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Old 03-02-2013, 10:43 PM   #1
Gioco
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Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

If they receive treatment equal to other similarly situated defendants, this could be big news, not because of the immediate penalty but because of the potential licensing ramifications in jurisdictions where it does business:
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/03/bu...html?src=busln

The actual word the Sands Corp. used in its filing was "likely"
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Old 03-02-2013, 11:25 PM   #2
joeschmoe
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re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

Business week background article from July 2010.
The Higher Costs of Bribery in China
"...Citing a World Bank estimate that more than $1 trillion in bribes are paid each year...."
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Old 03-02-2013, 11:34 PM   #3
JayJune
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re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

here is the original article from last year about the bribes and the Adelson US/China Center...

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/14/us...pagewanted=all
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Old 03-03-2013, 05:15 PM   #4
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

**** Adelson and I hope his company goes bankrupt but not being able to pay bribes overseas is a hinderance to US businesses. When China broke the monopoly on Macau and let 2-3 companies have licenses, obviously bribes were going to be paid to secure them and obviously Wynn, MGM and everybody else paid them too. That's just how business is done in some countries.
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Old 03-03-2013, 11:12 PM   #5
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

I suspect it won't affect Sand Corp. that much. Several people will take the fall for it. At worst, Adelson will be forced to sell his US holdings (which at this point are a rounding error on his overall profits). Paying third party lobbyists to work on your behalf is not illegal. You can't control what they do with their money. Only if he was colossally stupid would he have any connection with the bribes directly.
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Old 03-04-2013, 01:14 AM   #6
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

Quote:
Originally Posted by amberdosh View Post
**** Adelson and I hope his company goes bankrupt but not being able to pay bribes overseas is a hinderance to US businesses. When China broke the monopoly on Macau and let 2-3 companies have licenses, obviously bribes were going to be paid to secure them and obviously Wynn, MGM and everybody else paid them too. That's just how business is done in almost all countries.
Unfortunate, but true
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Old 03-04-2013, 02:12 AM   #7
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

We should all keep in mind he's less than a year removed from funneling $60 million to U.S. political candidates to help their election bids. Much of it after it was already known that he and his company were under investigation by federal authorities. By the way, he acknowledged that one of the reasons he was motivated to spend so much money on the election was because of that investigation.

It's a good thing all this corruption only happens in other countries...
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Old 03-04-2013, 06:16 AM   #8
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

Quote:
Originally Posted by amberdosh View Post
**** Adelson and I hope his company goes bankrupt but not being able to pay bribes overseas is a hinderance to US businesses. When China broke the monopoly on Macau and let 2-3 companies have licenses, obviously bribes were going to be paid to secure them and obviously Wynn, MGM and everybody else paid them too. That's just how business is done in some countries.
I think you are completely missing the point of the legislation and its equivalent in Europe.
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Old 03-04-2013, 07:33 AM   #9
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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I think you are completely missing the point of the legislation and its equivalent in Europe.
Care to enlighten us?

Not trying to be a prick btw, just curious as to what arguments the US / EU give when defending the application of their anti-corruption laws outside their territories.
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Old 03-04-2013, 08:35 AM   #10
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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Care to enlighten us?

Not trying to be a prick btw, just curious as to what arguments the US / EU give when defending the application of their anti-corruption laws outside their territories.
My original comment was aimed at "That's just how business is done in some countries." Those who made the laws know about the corruption culture in the developing world. That's the whole point of the law - to stamp out that culture.
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Old 03-04-2013, 09:20 AM   #11
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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Originally Posted by davmcg View Post
My original comment was aimed at "That's just how business is done in some countries." Those who made the laws know about the corruption culture in the developing world. That's the whole point of the law - to stamp out that culture.
We could argue that such laws do not stamp out the "corrpution" culture of other countries / continents, and that it is maybe presumptuous to think so. Furthermore, it hurts the US & EU's business in these areas.

But well yeah that's the whole debate isnt it... /derail
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Old 03-04-2013, 11:20 AM   #12
DoGGz
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

Bribes exist in the US political system and you expect them not to exist in China? Adelson is a scumbag but he's just playing the game.
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Old 03-04-2013, 11:49 AM   #13
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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Originally Posted by Marc14 View Post
We could argue that such laws do not stamp out the "corrpution" culture of other countries / continents, and that it is maybe presumptuous to think so. Furthermore, it hurts the US & EU's business in these areas.

But well yeah that's the whole debate isnt it... /derail
These countries want western technology/investment. So they should play by our rules.

Corruption destroys the ambitions of the common peple in these countries and enriches the elite. Ppl like Adelson should be telling grasping pos officials to gtfo and publicly naming them as seeking bribes. Bribe takers are parasitic filth.
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Old 03-04-2013, 12:40 PM   #14
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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Originally Posted by davmcg View Post
My original comment was aimed at "That's just how business is done in some countries." Those who made the laws know about the corruption culture in the developing world. That's the whole point of the law - to stamp out that culture.
It's not our job to change the culture of other countries. That's the reason the US is involved in so many wars. We're always putting our nose where it doesn't belong. If China wants to get rid of corruption in their country - that is their problem, not ours. If they want to make anti-corruption laws and investigate and prosecute US companies who break them, that's great. They should do it. But it's not our place to try to do it for them. It's pretty arrogant for us to believe that forcing our big companies not to pay bribes is going to change China. All it does is put them at a competitive disadvantage to companies that are willing to pay.
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Old 03-04-2013, 12:59 PM   #15
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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Originally Posted by amberdosh View Post
It's not our job to change the culture of other countries.
Its not your "job" to do anything (but your actual job obv).

Like I said these countries want our technology and investment. The price for this is playing by our rules. I suppose you think that western companies should break sanctions because they are at a disadvantage to countries that ignore the sanctions?

Most people in the world just want a chance in a fair game and the elite in countries with endemic corruption rob them of that. It actually sickens me that you glibly ignore this when you come from a society where you get that chance.
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Old 03-04-2013, 01:01 PM   #16
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

Here's a review of some past FCPA case enforcement, it reveals why Sands Corp. doesn't think it will have a substantial impact on its bottom line, the penalties are just slaps on the wrist; the interesting issue is whether any gaming regulatory body will think it is significant; in the old days they would have, the new days of corporate ownership seem to have brought some new standards in what is allowed and what isn't:
http://www.sec.gov/spotlight/fcpa/fcpa-cases.shtml
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Old 03-04-2013, 02:13 PM   #17
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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Originally Posted by davmcg View Post
these countries want our technology and investment. The price for this is playing by our rules.
If they wanted it so badly, we wouldn't need to bribe them to take it.
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Old 03-04-2013, 05:31 PM   #18
Marc14
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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Originally Posted by davmcg View Post
these countries want our technology and investment
I don't agree. This isnt the 60s anymore. They already have "our" technology, and don't need our investments.

Is it the developping countries / the brics that "want" EU/US's products, or is it EU/US that want to export their products and expand their markets (weither its consumer goods, jumbo jets, weapons...)? I think its the latter.

Saying "if they want to do business with us they need to play by our rule" is incredibly self centered and disconnected from the reality of today's globalized (over?)capitalistic world.
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Old 03-05-2013, 01:03 AM   #19
the4bettingmonk
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

Well after DOJ`s handling of the enormous fraud recently in the banking sector I`ll go out on a limb and say there won`t be jail time for anyone involved in this :P
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Old 03-08-2013, 07:58 AM   #20
NerdSuperfly
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

Quote:
Originally Posted by davmcg View Post
These countries want western technology/investment. So they should play by our rules.

Corruption destroys the ambitions of the common peple in these countries and enriches the elite. Ppl like Adelson should be telling grasping pos officials to gtfo and publicly naming them as seeking bribes. Bribe takers are parasitic filth.

lol ... did you ever check where the 'western technology' is produced ^^

Bribes, presents or donations ... where to draw a line. E.g. in 'asian culture' it is quite common to be a good host and presents (for the host) are common. the politic system in the us depends on donations ... do you think, when a billion dollar company spends millions for a candidate (maybe through lobbyists), they never want a favour ...


if you want a good place on the market, you have to pay the fees ... whatever you call them
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Old 03-08-2013, 09:28 AM   #21
davmcg
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Re: Las Vegas Sands admits probable FCPA violation

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Originally Posted by NerdSuperfly View Post
lol ... did you ever check where the 'western technology' is produced ^^

Bribes, presents or donations ... where to draw a line. E.g. in 'asian culture' it is quite common to be a good host and presents (for the host) are common. the politic system in the us depends on donations ... do you think, when a billion dollar company spends millions for a candidate (maybe through lobbyists), they never want a favour ...


if you want a good place on the market, you have to pay the fees ... whatever you call them
Nice - another comment from someone who lives in a free country and has been given every chance to be a success, justifying kleptocracies slamming the poor into the ground.
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