I imagine they would have been able to get him with a Sniper if he was still shooting and they were worried about breaching...

If that Aussie is telling the truth, this is way more horrifying than we can ever imagine. Just think. This intelligent, wealthy, globe-trotting dude hid this evil from everyone, likely for decades. Who else thinks and feels like him? It's impossible to know.

One thing that worries me is how quick we are to call him things like "sick" (in a derogatory sense) and "inhuman." He probably felt that way his whole life, and chose to go on this killing spree to get back at a world he felt had wronged him. If other people are walking around feeling like him, what kind of message does it send when we immediately throw "disturbed" people under the bus? Probably just drives them further away.

Another aspect of it is that he was living the dream. Rich... self-employed... world traveler.. steady girl... And he hated all of it. I know this isn't a political thread, so I'll just limit it to this: what does this say about our popular idea of "success"?

With all that said, I don't have any solutions to these concerns. This is all so terrible.

Acc to the articles, the woman pushed her way past the ticketing area and all the way up to the front before behind apprehended and escorted out. She didn't have a paid ticket. (Conforms again with plain old crazy angle imo...)

I'm not assigning too much value to this guy's opinion just yet, since it's a bit of an outlier compared to the 'creepy' and 'aggressively unfriendly' accounts given by some of his neighbors. Same goes for his brother's account...he's dealing with learning that his dead brother's responsible for worst mass shooting in US history...I'm not going to assign his emotional ramblings too much weight just yet. This guy's definitely tough to pin down, that's for sure; everyone who's interacted with him seems to have a different take on what kind of guy he was.

That’s true, although it seems clear that he was methodical and secretive. And he had sufficient resources and care to buy 47 weapons and thousands of rounds of ammunition, clips, bump stocks, bipods, scopes, cameras, etc. without setting off any red flags. I have no real idea about gun pricing, but that means what, 100K-plus in material purchases?

Even if often unfriendly and standoffish, he certainly seems capable and organized. I just don’t see how this kind of thing can realistically be stopped. And I thank god/variance/karma for the fact that this likely could have been much worse.

Regarding the note:

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/05/us/las...ion/index.html

Agree with all except you can't thank god AND variance. The two are mutually exclusive.

If he was 100-200 yards closer he couldve easily killed thousands.

Good spot. Minimisation from the brother. The friend from the Guardian didn't see into the gun room but you'd have to assume there would be more than a couple of handguns.

Edit: or the Guardian guy is a hoax. Would be shameful journalism if that the case.

Everybody keeps saying the great amount of guns would be too heavy to carry. Well if he had large suitcases with those wheels on the bottom I don't see the big deal in that. just might have to make several trips from a rental car in the Mandalay Bay Garage over a 4 day period. Maybe 2 or 3 trips a day. You can carry a lot of weight in those rolling suitcases.

Also, I read the reason he broke out the second window might have been to have a shot at the jet fuel tanks at McCarran airport which were in range. One of the tanks in fact had 2 bullet holes in them which has since been repaired. Experts have said bullets most likely wouldn't explode the tanks.

Agreed. It is easy to label him as evil and a monster etc. But in reality he was a victim too. He was probably just a normal guy with emotional/psychological problems.

Being sympathetic to the guy doesn't in any way minimize the gratuitous suffering of the dead and wounded.

Events like this are just a symptom of the larger problem of a sick society imo.

Brother mentions this, and I tend to agree- He probably just paid a bellhop to bring up much of it. Even if it was over more than 1 trip. The guns don't weigh so much that the bags would be abnormally heavier than one fully loaded with clothes. No one would ever ask what they were moving and if anything it would look weirder if he didn't have them do it.

I'm curious about that myself but think she didn't really know anything. If she said a shooter was going to fire at them from the Mandalay Bay at 10pm I would take it more seriously.

Terrorism is an intimidation tactic applied by one group to another group. If this guy isn't part of a group with a political ideology then it isn't terrorism.

I agree the US media is a complete cluster but calling it terrorism is not correct in this case. It has nothing to do with skin color.

For example, if he was part of a white nationalist group trying to send a message about segregation then that would be terrorism.

Agree. I think terrorism is an act of violence in furtherance of some institutional agenda, be it political or religious or whatever. Symbionese Liberation Army and the Baader-Meinhof gang were terrorists, but Ted Bundy and Richard Ramirez were not.

In a Guardian article, the writer states that Nevada's definiton of terrorism is “any act that involves the use or attempted use of sabotage, coercion or violence which is intended to cause great bodily harm or death to the general population”, which would means the Nevada state authorities should class what happened as terrorism.

It also states that federal codes define it as “activities that appear intended to affect the conduct of government by mass destruction” and somehow claim that this covers Paddock's actions, which I have seen no evidence for so far.

I've always regarded terrorism's definition as the one more widely found in dictionaries: 'the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, especially against civilians, in the pursuit of political aims', which unless something turns up relating Paddock to 'political aims' then the term terrorist doesn't fit him at all.

Grunch

Did anyone on 2p2 "know" paddock?

except the crazy **** doesn't usually happens 45 minutes after you've said it

...i read that he used upward of ten different suitcases. this happened on Sunday, think he checked into the hotel on Thursday

did the police explain how he broke the window glass? like did he shoot it or what?

A "hammer-like instrument"

The cameras in vegas would catch a suspicious person. From all accounts this guy was a VIP so perhaps the camera ignored him.

Daily Mail: Las Vegas shooter's girlfriend says he would 'SCREAM in bed at night' and investigators say he may have been in 'mental anguish'

so you want to commit violence on those who have beliefs that you don't agree with? Sounds terroristic.

History shows people can be wrong, read the Oxbow Incident.

A LOT of smart people were wrong about the Bay of Pigs.

Most believe Iraq/Iran/ISIS nationals were responsible for 911 when in fact they were all Saudi Arabian.

Custer thought he was right to divide his troops and attack a superior force.

Half the PHD's at NASA were wrong to OK the launch of Challenger when clear and simple evidence pointed to not taking off due to low temps

Abraham Lincoln, one of the greatest leaders in history, made sure to include those that disagreed with him (and they were brutal) in discussions so he could see all sides and possibilities of an issue.

Occam's razor states the explanation with the fewest assumptions is probably the right one. We assume Paddock acted alone and was the shooter, and he probably did and was, but no one knows that for sure.

Which is why I said “absent evidence of that.” Occam’s razor is a heuristic that often and effectively shortcuts analysis. But the evidence matters. And speculating random theories without evidence is not helpful to anyone or anything. Do you know about the sandy hook troll I’m referring to?