Of the $850m won by top 30 how much do we think went back to Paul Phua?

Udon wannit do you

Pretty lame marketing. How long does it take newbies to figure out it is not $58 million or whatever in profit?

High stakes games in general have gone to hell in the US. Probably, there is a shortage of whales. End of poker boom, but people probably are hesitant to lose large amount with the virus, inflation, etc.

Justin Bonomo Reclaims #1 on Poker All-Time Money List... retains his #4, #5 and #8 placings as well though.

Timebanks are gay. Tournaments should have blacklists, and if you waste everyone's time you should get put on them.

I thought Dan Bilzerian was all time #1

He's for sure all time #1 on some lists...

https://pokerdb.thehendonmob.com/ran...me-money-list/

#3 Negreanu, #4 Seidel, #10 Holz, and #11 Ivey seem to be more or less legitimately on the list. #1 is a long time expert in the more entries, the more prizes.

You realize that DN is the re-entry king? At one time this year, he was top 5 in POY points while being underwater. At least one time he re-entered a tournament so many times, he would have needed a top three finish to cover his buyins. He did not.

The clear problem with this list is getting to the top depends on winning and placing in multiple super high roller events. The issue with those is there is so much cross booking and backing going on, we really don’t have a clue how much of the winnings is really the winner’s.

I think only winnings are recorded- if they bust out of the money - how would they get the information?

Or if they bought in 15 times?

Bilzerian is a #2

dnegs is very transparent and does an annual blog of "I cashed 2.8 million this year but lost money"

Maybe not Dnegs, but I would bet Seidel, Holz, and Ivey are significantly ROI+.

All time profit list needs to be invented surely

How many millions of dollars has Cary Katz lost to get to number 9 on the all time money list ?

https://pokerdb.thehendonmob.com/ran...me-money-list/

the people behind pocketfives and rotogrinders have this information and in either a joey ingram or adam levitan interview (don't recall which) they said they have spent a lot of time considering whether to publish gross/net and decided it's not in anyone's interest

they chose to only post winnings as they didn't want to stigmatize and embarrass people

someone who's punted 6 figs over the years can get googled by a colleague/mother-in-law and they'll see he's "made a quarter million dollars" and that's the way everyone wants it to be

That’s fair but if they just remove the all time money list from existence and keep the all time profit list we would know who the real OGs are and nobody gets embarrassed

Show top 5 winners and no one gets embarrassed

yeah but then there's a certain implication when all the top people in gross don't show up in the top list of profit

you gotta remember that these places that track this did so for sake of affiliate marketing content not to do anything academic - they just wanted views - it was a major cash cow for rotogrinders for dfs because people they got affiliate credit when people linked their accounts "to compete on the leaderboard" - they did that when that business model for poker started faltering post black friday

Cary is a legit player that also happens to have a large bankroll. I'd say he has a far better ROI than you might think, almost certainly positive! He was heads-up for a bracelet at WSOP a couple years ago and I think he's placed well in some large field mixed game events too.

For sure not making anyone's top 10 players of all time list, but there are bigger whales than him near the top of that list...

Cary is the ultimate tournament Nit .. I'd say he's the Allen Kessler of HRs with a 'cash first' approach until the bubble. I think Cary uses his image very well at the table to navigate what is normally a short stack throughout. He's probably better than PHell at the shorty, but you really can't dispute either Player's results over time.

You have to give props to Cary since, presumably, he still has pretty major day job responsibilities while maintaining a pretty good poker side gig. He's certainly come a long way from when we first started seeing him play. He's got a couple of wins and plays multiple games as well.

Not sure of his cash game, you'd have to assume that he plays cash to learn the games .. just not out in the open.

We can all speculate that 'if I had the same bankroll' we would be able to hang with these boys .. it'd be nice to find out! GL

sharing this as some of it was news to me, perhaps others may learn something.

I might have been out of the loop that month, but when did rotogrinders ever do a live or online profit/ROI board? I only remember this happening twice. sharkscope had the 2006 or 2007 WSOP numbers and published it, huge back lash. Then WPT when they revamped and had a statistics page did something similar and it got ugly real quick.

they didn't do it but it was discussed in whichever podcast (levitan or ingram) the founder went on and he said they chose not to do it out of concerns of the second bolded

https://rotogrinders.com/rankings

it's amazing how many people they got to opt in to getting tracked, something i would imagine they'd want to keep under the radar unless they had tout career on the distant horizon - a bunch of em like moklovin are very quietly grinding away without the big presence so it's surprising he'd want to get tracked as such

if i ever want to go tout i'd opt in but don't see any upside in getting listed if you don't want that barring vanity/staking