Originally Posted by raidalot
Questions from a casual observer
I was not cheated at UB/AP and everything I know about this story comes from what I read on forums such as this, Cereus statements/blog etc. I have followed the story for a while and am encouraged by the fact that Joe wants to answer questions. Therefore I have prepared a summary of questions that people like me are interested to know. I have done no original research, this is all just based on info published by Haley, Mookman, Elevengrover and others (to whom: thank you and please continue the good work).
Joe, I am sure that you won’t know all the answers but I would appreciate if either you would obtain the answers or get someone who knows the facts (eg Legget) to come on here and answer directly (as you say you are trying to do).
To avoid any misunderstandings, when I refer to “Current Management” or “you” in here I mean: the management and owners (and their associates) of Cereus and all the entities in its group. This would include Paul Legget and all other executives.
The basics
Since the scandal was broken on 2+2 Cereus (directly and through its reps) has used a mixture of denial, feet-dragging, silence, obfuscation etc in what looks like an attempted cover up. You say that approach was, with hindsight, a mistake and the company now wants maximum transparency. I think that is definitely the right approach if the Current Management has nothing to hide, well done.
Okay, so lets just start with a few basics on the cheating (so we know you are serious about transparency and we are not all wasting our time talking about hypotheticals):
Cereus/KGC have released various info on when the cheating occurred. I believe the latest is the KGC statement in September 2008 in which they said Russ cheated over the period May 2004 to January 2008. There have also been various statements on which were the cheating accounts, usually updated when 2+2 members identified more of them.
(1) Over exactly what time period did the cheating occur?
(2) Who were the individuals who you believe cheated?
(3) Which of the following do you know or suspect were involved in the cheating and which do you believe were not:
(a) Greg Pierson (as alleged by Haley in her blog)
(b) Mansour (as speculated by individuals analyzing the Travis Makar leaked email)
(c) Joe Norton (as speculated by many posters)
(d) Scott Tom (as some have suggested links to his IP address)
(4) Please supply the full list of accounts that you suspect were involved in the cheating.
(5) Please supply the evidence that Russ cheated.
(6) Please supply further details of the accounts named in the WCP article so that Elevengrover and/or others are able investigate properly.
(7) For the purposes of calculating the rebates, which accounts were assumed to have cheated and over what time period in each case?
(8) What was the total actually paid to players in refunds?
(9) Did Legget or any of the Current Management know or suspect cheating had occurred before it was uncovered by 2+2?
(10) Please explain what useful information the company has released so far which helps outsiders understand what happened other than (i) information that was first published by others and (ii) the names leaked via Mookman (where there are issues with the information supplied).
(11) Since March 2008 has Cereus or Current Management had any links with Iovation, Greg Pierson, Scott Tom, Norton, Mansour (or any entities linked to them)?
Whistleblowers
In June 2008 brainwashdodo (later identified by Haley as ex AP customer services rep Zoltan Rozsa) came on 2+2 and claimed the current management were involved in the cheating. Travis Makar, ex systems support contractor to Russ and co, recently claimed that Paul Legget tried to pay Zoltan to suppress that info but that Zoltan wanted more than Legget was willing to offer. Makar suggested that somebody else paid him off.
(12) Why did Legget try to pay off Zoltan if (i) he had nothing to hide and (ii) his aim was for transparency?
(13) Does Legget or anyone in Current Management know or suspect who did pay him off?
(14) On a recent Pokercast interview Joe said that Cereus had “reached out” to Makar: what dialogue has taken place?
Lost HH
On his UB blog on 3 November 2010 Legget revealed that about 10% of the hand histories had been lost which had “occurred when one of the RAID drives failed”. The company claimed (conveniently) however that it still had the financial details associated with each hand (eg amounts bet/raised/won/lost etc). This was met with general derision from computer experts and others. Haley suggested that, in fact, the hands had been deleted by the cheaters to cover their trail.
(15) Would it be possible to provide a more precise explanation of how the HH were stored and how they were lost.
(16) Anyone who works for a company with a decent sized database knows that, these days, there are so many backup procedures that it would be very hard to get rid of info even if you tried. As well as parallel servers etc we all have historic backups taken at regular intervals (eg daily, weekly, monthly). Did you really have no backup at all for your main database??
(17) How did it happen that the HH were deleted but the financial details were not?
(18) Do you accept Haley’s claim that the hands were in fact deleted by the cheaters?
(19) If so then (a) why did you claim the loss was due to hardware failure and (b) when were they deleted?
Other HH
Lets put the “lost” hands to one side for now and concentrate on the remaining hands. Not just the ones were the company says cheating occurred, but all of them. Players have been asking for these for 3 years but they are just stonewalled and, although Joe says stuff like “sure, I’ll get them for you”, in practice they never turn up.
Nobody is going to take a claim of transparency seriously until the hand histories are released. But that should’t be an issue as it is also the company’s policy to provide them. For example, in his Pokercast interview in June 2008 Legget said that it was a priority to take all UB hand histories and put them in PT2 (or similar) for all players to see.
(20) Why have you not released these hand histories to players?
(21) Would you now release them, say within 30 days?
(22) Joe: you say Paul has always done everything you asked him to do. Have you ever asked him to release HH?
Action against cheaters
The KGC (presumably with the company’s help) identified Russ as the main cheater but the company didn’t publish any evidence and didn’t file any suit against him. In a September 2008 statement the KGC said it was “currently in contact with the appropriate law enforcement agencies and intends to fully cooperate in the prosecution of all individuals involved in the UB cheating incidents.” In December 2008 it said “the KGC has initiated a criminal complaint against at least one cheater and is cooperating with law enforcement authorities.” Cereus obviously has a big interest in this and so we all assume it worked with the KGC on the effort to bring the perps to justice. Of course, any investigators would make Cereus their first port of call in collecting information so the company would have had contact with them. However, despite numerous requests, it has not revealed which authorities are dealing with the matter. The response has been along the lines of “the KGC are dealing with that side”. Of course (a) it is barely credible that the company don’t know themselves and (b) the KGC is not known for its transparent approach.
(23) Why was no action taken against Russ by the company?
(24) With which authorities has the company had contact on the matter?
(25) Which authorities did KGC report it to?
(26) If it was reported why has Russ (or anyone) not been charged by now?
Other matters
(27) Did anyone at Cereus authorize shills to post on 2+2?
(28) If they have nothing to hide, why has Current Management so far refused to put up a credible spokesperson (who has the facts) in a truly open forum to address the many questions that players have?
(29) Please clarify the operation of the old UB client software w.r.t. ‘god mode’ by (a) releasing the source code and/or (b) explaining how it worked, whether only special user accounts could enter ‘god mode’ and which accounts these were.
(30) In order to reassure suspicious players, would you be willing to allow a credible independent auditor (not the KGC, lol) to (a) review your database and (b) verify the refund amounts?
Sorry for the length but its a complex story with many unanswered questions.
raidalot
