Just shut the F up same as we grew up Playing HU for Rollz there was none of this BS we played HU someone lost other person Won . . .

HU For Rollz Used To Mean Something . . .



Make Your Own Money . . .

The app was made by people whose priority was making the game, and would not have included making it absolutely secure. Who knows, maybe they made it so that it has security gaps they could then exploit, making the game a bit like a Trojan horse.

I went onto youtube to search OFC cheating videos, and there are several from 2013, after Barry Greenstein warned people not to play the game online after he had lost to someone he suspected had cheated him, so doubts have been going on for years.

By now, there is little chance of any accusations against the accused being proven, so we just have to rely on circumstantial evidence.

And the long series of oddities about the accused's game selection and enormous difference in his ability between playing the same game live and online, suggests to me Mercier is spot on with his doubts, and the accused coming here to defend himself made a bluff that went totally wrong.

A 17 page thread about why and how two players must play each other to clear their names is indicative of how ridiculous poker players have become.

OP is way out of line and he doesn't seem to get that J. Mercier has a right to his opinion and to tell his opinion to his friends. And Mercier doesn't have to explain himself or engage with the OP to clear OP's name.

OP, just move onto the next game! Stop proving that poker players are the most self-entitled whining little babies on the planet.

OP is out of line for starting a thread with the intention of clearing his name from allegations of cheating that are weakly sourced at best?

cool perspective you got there bro

And thinking that a pro must play you on your terms and at your convenience to clear an allegation that wasn't made widely public except when the OP posted such a blatantly provocative post?

No matter what happened here, OP is under the mistaken impression that Mercier owes him an explanation or chance of redemption. Poker players seriously need a reality check.

There's no widespread honor, loyalty, or fairness in poker, especially among strangers.

Grow up and just play the game.

first part is a bit wrong. This app was made by a few silicon valley friends of hellmuth, after it became apparent of the vulnerabilities present in the ABC game center app. Security was a primary concern, as the app was developed while many were being cheated out of millions on ABC.

I think near 0% chance OP has "hacked" or has any sort of backdoor into program, but very possible to be using solver or some sort of playing assistance tool for all reasons jason has laid out.

I played jacyln recently about ~300 hands and she quit a small loser, and i never suspected any wrong doing other then a few friends telling me that she was mashing everyone.

At this point, don't see much to gain from either party. Not sure why OP even made thread as best case scenario is he's proven right and never gets action again, worst case he's proven wrong and never gets action again.

I have some sad news for everyone here.
I too have played Fernando and I must admit that I thought he was cheating me because I would always get worked. But then I realized that he's not doing the cheating. He's just taking advantage of a broken app. As I was playing another friend of mine, we came upon something that compromises the app that Fernando is challenging everyone on. It started showing me my opponents three draw cards that he was drawing before using two and mucking one. I did take a screen shot of this to prove that this app is broken and if you are able to see your opponents draw cards then that gives you a huge edge on what to play yourself as you are being able to see that muck card that you are not suppose to see. Hence helping you decide what to play knowing that your outs are gone or still available. My next post will show the screen shot of this and forever solve this issue at hand.

Sounds about right. Post away Deebster.

https://twitter.com/alfredolozada77/...35737716445185

Jason may or may not see that on Twitter but hopefully he catches your posts here.

Well this was an interesting turn in events.

play live

Don't get cheated on the Open-Face Chinese app
by Barry Greenstein on February 15, 2013 5:51 AM

Open-Face Chinese Poker has really taken off. For example, during previous years at the PokerStars Caribbean Adventure we always had a $200/$400 or $400/$800 mixed game. But this year rather than a big mixed game, there were four tables of Open-Face Chinese Poker going.

I've just started to play the game. I'm not real good as yet, but I ventured in during the last day at PCA because it looked like a pretty good game and that there might be some people I thought I still might be able to beat. As it happened, I ran pretty good -- I had two straight flushes -- and I won a decent amount of money.
I was told then by some people that many were playing Open-Face Chinese on an app that's available for iPhones and the iPad. So when I got home I downloaded the app, and I started playing just for fun against some people. You can even play against the app itself.
I did that for a while until I thought I was ready to play for small stakes against some players. I started out playing small -- just $10 a point -- and I was losing a little bit as I was playing against people who were better than I was. Then once I got a little better I kicked up against some other poker players to $25/point because that seemed to be the normal amount for which people were playing.
Then a guy challenged me to $50/point, and even though I'd heard that he might be a better player than I was, I thought perhaps I could learn playing against a better player. Nowadays poker players seem to learn from videos and by going onto forums, but in my day the way you got better was you watched better players and tried to see what they were doing and then tried to incorporate what you saw into your game. That's what I was trying to do here.
Of course, one of the problems right now with Open-Face Chinese Poker is that you have a lot of disagreement about who the better players are. It's a pretty complicated game, and at this stage in the growth of the game everybody makes some mistakes.
In any case, I played this guy and I actually beat him out of about 100 points. Then he suggested we double the stakes and so we did and played some more, and that's when he started winning.
Now, it's not that he beat me, but it's how he beat me. It seemed like after being in trouble he kept getting saved on the river over and over and over. Even though it was believable that he was a better player than I was, I decided I wanted to start keeping track of when he needed to get outs in these situations. When he had to get an out on the river to beat me, I wanted to see what his percentage was.
I started keeping track, and the next 14 times it came up, he hit seven times. Now that's not every time, but it was enough that after that I quit.
I have a nephew who is a programmer and I called him up. I told him I thought I was being cheated, and asked him if he could figure out if there was any way you could see if a person could download this app and perhaps change the cards or do whatever, because I suspected there might be something going on here.
My nephew downloaded the app and once he had a chance to start looking at it he called me back within 30 minutes. He said anyone who's a programmer who knows how to hook up an iPad to another computer could easily cheat using the app.
He said he could see all the cards and do whatever he wanted. I asked him if he could give me a demo, and we played a game and he sent me three kings on top, a flush in the middle, and a straight flush in the back. He explained that anyone who was a programmer or who had a friend who was a programmer could cheat me at the game, no problem.

Using a proxy server, with the current version of the app, you can see all thirteen cards of yours and your opponents when each deal is begun. Most cheaters wouldn't spend the time to change the cards as my nephew did. They would know whether their flushes and full houses were going to come in, which allows them to play efficiently like normal Chinese poker.
It was just as I'd expected. I began calling around to people who were playing a lot. Pretty much anybody who has won big at this game at this point is under suspicion, because it's so easy to cheat.
My nephew got in touch with the app's programmers to tell them what they have to do to fix their app. The Apple documentation actually explains how to make an app secure, but when these programmers wrote this Open-Face Chinese Poker app, they didn't know people were going to be playing for lots of money using it. And so they didn't write it in a secure way, because they thought it was just going to be a fun game that people were going to play for free. So it's not even really their fault.
Besides offering a specific warning here about the Open-Face Chinese Poker app and its current vulnerabilities to cheating, then, I think there are two broader morals to the story.
One is that when you play on an app such as this one for money, you better know who you're playing with and that you're in possible danger of being cheated. Even as future games come out, you'll want to remain wary.
To draw a comparison with PokerStars, they have an app with a whole security team of people trying to protect you by keeping track of data, looking at hand histories for anything suspicious, and so forth. It's a very different situation to play an app written by just a couple of guys who weren't really thinking that their game might be played for a lot of money.
So you have to be very wary when playing for any significant sum of money on some of these games that may come out in the future.
Secondly, as a general gambling premise, if you go somewhere and you lose and you don't understand why you're losing -- especially if you seem to be losing in ways that don't seem right to you -- you have to quit. If there's one game where you think the players are better than you but you do okay, go and play in that one even if there might be another game where the players seem really bad, but you don't win.
That's just a general rule of gambling that you need to use to protect yourself.

I'm guessing bc he thinks then ppl could exploit it, but the thing is that when you find something like this, unless your intent is to keep the information private for your own benefit, then the obvious thing to do is broadcast/share it as widely and publicly as possible, mb he's trolling

+1

Exploiting a bug that gives you an unfair advantage doesn't count?

booyakasha!!! how do you exploit this bug so other people can indepedently verify??

i called it. OP is a cheater.

Just because its possible to cheat on the app doesn't necessarily mean he is cheating, but definitely another huge red flag

Based on the information we have, I would say it brings the probability that OP was cheating from 40% to 90% if we can verify that the app he keeps challenging everyone on is compromised.

And since Jaclynn began smashing everyone on the app after she started hanging out with OP, there's probably an 80% chance she's cheating too.

(These are just arbitrary numbers set by a long time poker player who has had tons of experience dealing with the shadiest bunch...)

I've seen the pic you posted on Twitter 'Deebster', but can you explain how and what you have to do to see the draw cards? I have a few questions for the OP and Jaclynn Moskow before I write another article on this, and this kind of info would be invaluable. PM me please - I can't seem to PM you, maybe because you are new to the forum :/ Cheers, Andy

Tell me how to cheat on the app, then let's play $50 a point

did some googling but its not well known at the moment.
Only thing coming up is the ABC cheat video..

Also interested in this, dev's should fix this asap as i'm also playing a decent amount on the app...

@Deebster, did you contact the dev's of the app??

that picture doesnt prove anything, can easily be photoshopped. need a video of it in action or confirmation from other sources.

I thought the same thing at first, but I think he simply meant that he didn't cause the cheating through any effort of his own, but rather used an already existing method to cheat.

Obviously it would be cheating either way.

Ofc it is cheating, but it just meant that he is not using any external methods of manipulation and is just exploiting flaw in software.

I hope this is reported to app developer.