2019 The end of Poker

Two major poker rooms in Vegas (Venetian & Red Rock) are jacking up their rakes to ring in the new year. Why? To fuel ever increasing jackpot poker insanity. It is bad enough that jackpot poker ever became a thing with $1 extra sucked out of the poker economy every hand. Now that is being raised to $2 per pot. Back in 1988 in Vegas, the rake was 5%, $2 max, no jackpot. Then it went to $3, then 10% & $4, then $4+$1 jackpot, now it will be $4 + $2 jackpot or $5+$2 jackpot. I come to play poker, not to be forced to buy a keno/lottery ticket every time I win a pot. Then if you hit, you have to pay 30% tax on $50,000+ and the rest of the money will never be put back into the poker economy. Low limit games are now virtually unbeatable for 90%+ of players. If you need to raise the rake due to inflation, then fine, but you need to raise the stakes too. Make the 1-2 game at least a 1-3 game. (at least the Venetian is going to 1-3NL from 1-2NL)

If poker rooms insist on silly jackpots, they should allow a player to opt out and give them an opt-out button so everytime they win a hand, they get their $2 jackpot rake refunded on the spot. This will save a typical player $20 a night. If you play 3 times a week that is an extra $250 a month in take-home money. How many have had over $3,000 returned to them in jackpots over the course of a year? I would bet not many.

The gaming commission should step in and either outlaw jackpot poker or regulate it. At the very least, the total jackpot rake from the prior day should be publicly displayed along with the total amount of jackpot money held in reserve. Afterall, it is the players' money!

I wonder how many poker room managers would like to have $500 taken out of their paychecks each time and then randomly given back $500 to $3,000 zero to 4 times a year and then maybe $50,000 once every 40 years to get them back to "even". The variance in poker is big enough as it is. Why do poker managers feel they have a right to make this variance even higher by the bastardization of poker via the introduction of jackpot poker rakes?!

RIP Poker 2019.

jackpots and all that stuff are garbage, but vegas grinders get the most return from it compared to other places. all the tourists leave behind all that promo money and never benefit from it.

if players stopped tipping in order to recoup the jackpot drop, i wonder how long before something changed.

While you make valid points, the reality is that jackpots draw in casual players. One room manager told me that implementing a jackpot increased the number of players by 25%. Foxwoods at one point only had the 1/2 NL and limit games jackpot eligible. 2/5 and above it wasn't taken. The problem was that when the jackpot got high, even the higher playing regulars would drop down to 1/2 to try to catch it. So they aren't going away.

Finally, while you may be able to shrug off giving up $100k or more if you would hit, most people will be doing whatever it takes to stake a claim.

"I never put that button out, it must of been the previous person in this seat."

"Dealer, I specifically told you for this hand I want to be in the jackpot."

"I don't know how that opt out button got in my pocket."

I agree with most of your post but you got two major points wrong.

1. In lots of places, jackpots don’t destroy poker but keep the poker room alive. I remember hearing a conversation between a dealer and a player who complained about the jackpot drop. Dealer told him that starting a jackpot a couple years ago was a Hail Mary effort when the casino considered closing the room. I’ve heard similar stories about other rooms where the jackpot drove business up by double digits.

2. Recreational players don’t want the stakes inflation adjusted. If major poker rooms in Las Vegas offered $0.5/$1 cash games with the same rake structure as their 1/2 (or 1/3) game, I bet that game would be the most popular in the room. It’s the same trend as online where the vast majority of players play $0.05/0.1 or even lower, even if they are from Western countries.

Jackpots also attract players that want to get lucky and hit it. They'll play the hands that qualify for the jackpot without paying attention to position and the fact that limp/calling raises OOP is -EV for them in the long run.

I used to play in a casino which had a Royal Flush Jackpot with one or two cards to qualify. Players would play any two broadway cards hoping to hit it even if it meant limp/calling a 5bb raise from OOP. And if they hit it? Good. More money for them to keep playing at the tables.

OP, just raise and make the pots bigger with cards that dominate their limp/calling range to compensate for the high rake when you win.

big jackpots are bad for poker long term..... You win 100k, how much money is going back to poker? that 3/6 limit player (age 70) wins 100k, how much goes goes back into circulation? They help the room, but the poker.

Bellagio has no jackpot and they still seem to get plenty of tourists and recreational players. The only people who really care about jackpots are OMCs. Though I do understand that OMCs are the lifeblood of most small Vegas poker rooms.

5 star rating for using the word bastardization!

Luckily there are many other options in LV, if you don't want to play the promo drop rooms vote with your feet.

i hate forced lottery tickets but i get them at 1/2 nl to get people in the room
i don't get why the exist in some places in bigger games. nobody is playing 5/10 nl to try and hit a jackpot.

Not making jackpots standard across las vegas is one of the biggest mistakes management made during the poker boom.

The only way to really know is to have both jackpot and non-jackpot tables, like Party Poker had back in 2006, and then judge by the waitlists

I played live cash fulltime from 2011 to 2014. Once it hit me how much i was giving in a month tipping i was shocked. If you avg winning just 2 pots an hour and give $2 each time, then multiply that by 8 hours a day 6 days a week, thats about $200 a week, $800 a month. Needless to say after that realization, i wasnt very popular among dealers.

did you go to 0 or 1?

$1 for pots over $40. Was there to make money, not to be liked by dealers.

I'm sure some of the smaller rooms only exist because of jackpots.

What happened?

Agree!!!

that's fine
if they dont like it tough ****

I would rather pay the extra $20-$30 a night in jackpot promotion to play with a couple extra fish at the table.

Also a side note, almost all the rooms around me have switched from bad beat/royal flush +100k jackpots that may leave the room and you never see again to $100-$1000 every 30 minute high hands so the players own wealth gets spread back around to them slightly more evenly

My point is that in most cases, the promotion drops don't attract extra fish, they attract extra OMCs. OMCs keep a lot of small poker rooms in business, but they aren't good for the quality of the games.

Lottery bull****.

Hi RedOak:

First, this is a very good post. But I think it's even worse than you portray.

It use to be that a jackpot would occur when a very strong hand got beat, and that's still the case. But what's happening now is that it's becoming "promotion poker." And what I mean by this is there are now all sorts of things that can occur where a player get's a little money in those poker rooms which have moved ion this direction. This can include having aces beat, flopping four-of-a-kind, making a straight flush, and who knows what else.

And yes, I also remember the $2 rake which gave new players at small stakes a chance to survive and become poker players. But I agree with you that those days are over.

Best wishes,
Mason

This statement is wrong for most promotions. But it does become correct for those poker rooms which rewards its customers for hours played. On the other hand, it's not true for something like flopping four-of-a-kind.

While this will never happen, it's not that bad of an idea. I believe that tipping is a reward for good service, and if you think that all of these promotions are not part of good service, then not tipping does make sense.

Best wishes,
Mason

Hi madlex:

Unfortunately, you have made two good points. The lure of a large jackpot does attract recreational players, but I also question the purpose of many of the other promotions that I currently see in some of the smaller poker rooms.

Best wishes,
Mason