Sorry, this is dumb. They're not going to risk their license or a huge fine to try to win back $1000 from you, even in 1990.

Here's the key to casino operations. Most people lose and some people win. If you get good volume, you're almost assured a profit.

If they have (or had in 1990) little asian ladies to play card tricks to cheat you, they wouldn't target a guy who won $1,000. They'd target the largest bettor, the largest stack, etc. If I'm the house there's 2 kinds of chips - those in my till and those in player stacks. I'm not going to just target a guy who won a few hands. That's so dumb.

Andrew - I have worked in casino operations for many years. If you really think they're lying to you (I doubt they are) file the Gaming report as Mason suggested. They will investigate, have a hearing and your question will be answered to your satisfaction.

Additionally, you can file a security report at the property to start a similar internal course of action. Someone will review the matter and let you know what they find. To do this just go to the security stand at the Flamingo.

The casino has no reason to lie about this, and I don't think they're liable if your chips were missing, though I could be wrong. To put it another way, if you had left your car keys or wallet on the table and they went missing, would the casino be responsible for that? I don't think so. The table is generally a safe environment and if someone is caught stealing the casino will prosecute them and force them to pay you. But if the thief is gone I'm not sure what the course of action is. They may pay you as a courtesy but I really doubt it.

Imagine if 2 patrons colluded to take advantage of this. The first, a player, leaves his stack on the table and walks away. The second, a bystander, picks up the chips and leaves, unable to be caught. The first player complains and is reimbursed by the casino. That's a pretty easy scam if you think about it.

Having dealt with many player disputes over the years, I can tell you the house ends up being right over 99% of the time. Players have an irrational belief that the casino is out to screw them out of small amounts of money. The fact is if someone is angle shooting it's far more likely to be the player. The angle shooters are trying to get a free comp from the casino. Usually people who escalate to a Gaming complete are just mistaken about what's happened (like you probably are )

Uh not sure if anyone has mentioned it but the guy who allegedly told OP to go look for his money at the craps table started a thread in LVL.

https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/1...mingo-1717678/

In the UK you are entitled by law to request any personal information that a company holds on you. This includes all CCTV footage as well. Do you not have a similar law in the US?

I have left my chips countless times at the table in a cash game in Vegas and never had a problem, and to me it is standard practice to do so.

Nope. If it's being used as evidence of a crime it is made available to all parties involved, though.

Standard practice != casino will go out of their way to help make you whole when some random dink steals your money.

1. No. If you are referencing the General Data Protection Regulation, that is an EU creation.

2. Presumably, OP is not present in any footage when the theft allegedly took place. So, requesting footage of himself would be a useless act.

Posted in the LVL forum...

Doubt that we have a similar law. Casinos aren't going to allow viewing of footage to anyone outside of management and regulators because of security liability. Typically a court subpoena for the footage would be required to obtain it.

OP can ask for another viewing of the footage by casino surveillance or management, or the gaming commission if that's possible, in case the footage was viewed too fast initially and something was missed. Then if the perpetrators had a rewards card scanned when they sat down, then info and evidence can be turned over to authorities. That would obviously be a best case scenario.

this is really shocking. so basically if you are ever playing poker at a casino in vegas, would it be reasonable to carry around an acryllic box/cover for your chips?

This ^

I also do this at tournament breaks after taking a photo of my chip stack. I've never lost chips in a cash session break, but have way too often lost big chips at tourney breaks.

Look.. Never was I trying to get anyone fired... Aside from this incident taking place, I enjoyed playing at the Flamingo... The staff was mostly welcoming to me and the action was good... Whether or not I was bending the truth in this situation is all speculation and you can either take my word for it or not... I am giving you the situation exactly as I recall it...

I emailed Michael Bickford and got this response :

Hello Andrew –



I have looked into your situation and we have the surveillance footage. It was reviewed by the surveillance team at that time. After their review it was then personally reviewed by Aaron. You left the table at 3:58am and returned at 4:44am. When you left the table you had 4 green chips. During the entire 46 minutes you were gone it is clear that no one touched your chips. Yes, there are a ton of cameras in the casino with lots of different angles. If someone even came close to touching them we would know. We take cheating and theft very seriously. If someone had taken any chips we would be rigorously trying to track them down and it would be a huge issue; but as of now we haven’t seen any evidence that anyone took any of your chips. A few years ago someone took $16 from another player, I tracked him down to another casino, had security remove him from his room (without refund and 2 nights remaining) and now he is banned for life. All over $16.



I will contact surveillance about reviewing further and if there was anything taken we will let you know.



Regards,

Michael


Now to me this sounds like he spoke to Aaron and this is the information that was provided to him... Whether or not he personally viewed any footage I have no idea and I emailed Michael back immediately asking for further review and have not since got a response... Does that mean it didn't happen as I described? Not in my eyes... In my eyes that was the first time I had green chips during my play there and I remember shuffling them and I wasn't the only one at the table that noticed I had more than 4 of them... It felt nice because I was playing good and I was in the zone and after winning some nice pots and having a nice pile of red chips I remember almost slamming those 8 greens on top in a confident manner as I felt victorious...

That is my "story" and I'm sticking to it.

Wow really? OP, do you have brain damage ? The guy told you he tracked down thiefs to diff casinos for $16 and your conclusion is he is lying because the world revolves around you? so now you know you didnt have those green chips but you will continue to moan and cry like a little schoolgirl even after youve been proven wrong?

Touche, good move, but closing your mouth and apologizing wouldve been a much stronger line to take imo

Well to be fair to OP, I also found the self-aggrandizing assertion about the $16 caper to be highly unlikely:

Michael: " I tracked him down to another casino, had security remove him from his room (without refund and 2 nights remaining) and now he is banned for life. All over $16. "

Were Michael's story true, but I'd hope it is not, that would be a pretty sweet lawsuit against both Michael,the declarant, and Michael's casino, and the other casino, and the other casino's security team. Banning a guy from your own casino is pretty easy, physically yanking him out of his hotel room at another casino, even if it is also a Caesars property, requires a bit more.

The "go find the accused and ask for your money back" actually being "let me know if the accused are still in the casino so surveillance can keep an eye on them" makes way more sense.

I think you're interpreting that phrase much too literally. I seriously doubt that Michael meant that Security went to his room and "physically yanked him out" of there. A much more reasonable interpretation would be that Security went up to his room and notified him that he had to leave, and then escorted him out of the hotel.

Most likely scenario: You won a split pot prior to your 30 minute break and were given back 4 and not 8 greens. At 3am you didn't pay close attention, and assumed since you didn't lose pot you should still have 8.

I was making a point. What you describe, going to his room (at another casino) and reading him the magic" 86 notice"*, making him vacate that property immediately under threat of arrest and then walking him off-property would seem more "reasonable" if this tale were true, but the story still crossed a line.

If you want to believe the story about the long arm tracking him down and exacting vengeance at some other property, fine. Funny though, he never mentioned getting the player's $16 back for him. I think that would have come up in the very dramatic description of the episode, if it had happened..... wasn't that supposedly the point of the roust ?

*NRS 207.200 (I've represented both the casino and player side of trespass issues. The story as related just sounds self-aggrandizing from the poker room manager....)

Who is crying? I care about what is right not the $ stolen... Do I believe him that they tracked down someone over $16; sure... Did he personally look at any footage regarding my incident; maybe...

So I'm to say sorry I will shut my mouth now I was wrong you are right because I was told something I don't believe to be true? I get the Lol's and the alright pal you're bending the truth and get made to look like a crazy person from opposing parties... Sounds like some old mob bs psychology...
I know what happened to my chips afaik Aaron or Mike never looked at this footage... Many people itt say only the security team is allowed to view it... I don't know what the case is... I don't really care I just want what is right...

I need to just file the complaint to the gaming control board...

This is not what happened... I did not chop a pot and then slam 4 greens on top of my red pile in satisfaction of chopping a big pot... After I earned the 8 greens (some of which from the real villain here, one of the two thieves) I placed them on top of my stack like mentioned already, with force, and then took the break... I wasn't gambling hard, I wasn't really involved in a ton of hands, I hadn't shuffled 8 greens between my fingers in that game up until this point, so it stood out to me more than ever, for once the world was revolving around me...

I am inclined to believe that you had four green chips when you left the table. If you ask for further review, you should request that they look at the hour before you left the table to see if you had more green chips before then.

lol village with pitchforks coming. I have seen a few times this has happened no video on tape have to ask someone to look outfor your chips on bathroom break and defo don't leave for 30 minutes.

OP,

I think you are underestimating how unreliable the human memory can be. I have personally been involved in pots where the opposing player was "sure" he had slid out a stack of chips into the pot to make a call. We end up chopping the pot and there is a disagreement that he owes a stack of chips to the middle before chopping. We went to the camera and it was confirmed that he had not put the chips in. This was early in the evening, the player did not appear tired, yet he was adamant that roughly 2 minutes ago, he had slid chips into the pot when he in fact had not.

I have also played over 10,000 hours of casino poker and have not witnessed any incident of chips being stolen off another player's stack. I have heard stories, and I am sure it has happened before.

In summary, I think you should more strongly consider that you may have forgotten how you went from 8 green chips to 4 green chips.

OP- if the 8 greens made such a big impression on you as you state above, then how is it that when you came back from your break you did not notice that your stack of green was now half of the size you left it at? In fact, you said in your OP that you didn't even notice that the 4 green were missing at all until after you had been playing, and then added stuff up after an all in. For someone so attuned and proud of having 8 green chips, it seems unlikely you could come back from a break and not immediately check them and start fondling them again. Instead, you claim that you came back and were suddenly so unconcerned about them that you didn't even notice they were gone until after you played an all in. That doesn't really make sense at all. To play hands and call smaller bets before going all in on the turn you would have had to move the green chips off your stack to get to the reds, and yet you didn't notice you only had 4 instead of 8 at that point?

From OP:

It most assuredly was.

That doesn't make it any less true (imo), however.

Unfortunately, when I play at a Casino, I play until my chips are gone.