i agree with u but this is probably one of those indirect evidence that they can gather on someone, im sure theres more based on other stuff.

did parker get banned from gg? just curious. ty

Yep could be that or a randomizer, or a HUD

Actually bigger chance of being banned for this rather than using RTA on external computer.

they ban people for bumhunting on ggpoker though and live poker is pretty much exclusively bumhunting

Dominik Nitsche was banned for sure? He didn't mention anything on Twitter.

No RTA user worth their salt is going to do it on the same machine as the poker site, so all this talk about mouse movements is a red herring.

Unless the charts are in a completely unsimplified form, I don't see how a site could know a player is cheating with them. Just about anyone who puts in the work can memorize charts.

How to bumhunt in live poker:
1. Get seated at the first available open seat at any table in the room.

I’ve only played in about 10poker rooms but every single one of them you were not able to manipulate your seat number or move tables with the exception of being allowed to move to busted seats if you were in a dealer seat .

lol, what? I've never played in a casino where every reg isn't seat changing or table changing constantly

Yes

Imagine playing in a casino where at any time during a hot run the pit poss can tap you on your shoulder, accuse you of cheating, and take all your chips. With no accountability or recourse.

Isn’t that exactly what happens to ppl suspected of counting cards at blackjack, no warnings, banned, funds confiscated, no appeal.

No

If they're card counting using a device.. Card counting as a team... Yes, money would be confiscated. (essentially breaking the TOS)

Just card counting... kicked out yes, money confiscated, no.

To compare it to the GG scenario, the players fit the confiscation category, they were almost certainly doing things that the TOS says they can't do. Tough lesson to learn and a good warning for all those who are doing or thinking about doing the same. (If anyone wants to show 100% definitive proof those banned were squeakily clean I would love to see, something tells me ill be waiting a while) In fact my guess is, if they were 100% squeaky clean they would already be in here with pitch fork and torch in hand... Odd... Crickets...

LFGGG!

Either you post some evidence or stop posting these rumors. Why can't anyone give evidence for who was banned or not.

No. The casino can refuse service to them just like any business can refuse service to anyone (subject to certain anti-discrimination laws), meaning the casino can decide to not let them play blackjack anymore. But the casino can't take their money.



Not even necessarily about this, but just in general how would someone post 100% definitive proof that they did not do something?

Also, if you think currently is crickets and you're waiting for pitchforks and torches, what exactly do you think is this thread and all the other ones that have been popping up about GGPoker making vague violation of TOS allegations and confiscating large sums?

I've barely even heard of GGPoker other than the WSOP partnering with them for its online WSOP and all the various threads here claiming that GGPoker wrongfully confiscated money.

I haven't seen a single person who was banned yet to speak up about it. If they were innocent they would be very quick to jump on board and say this is BS that GG did this. instead, crickets...

At least make a public statement declaring your innocence and from there we can see how they will prove it.

Now if I was guilty, I'd be silent and trying to figure out the best way to BS my way through it, which seems to be the case so far.

I've only pretty casually browsed 2+2 for a while now and I've seen at least a half dozen threads on here started by people claiming their balances on GGPoker were wrongfully confiscated as well as several other threads such as this one with people discussing that GGPoker may be generally wrongfully confiscating balances or threads that have links to someone's twitter discussing confiscation by GGPoker.

Doesn't mean they're all right.


But it's just the TOS itself that seems to be a problem to me. They're so vague and broad that GGPoker really probably could find some moment in anyone's play where they can say there was a TOS violation, and it seems they're actually doing it and confiscating balances not too rarely.

So, whatever; I'd just think it over before deciding to play on GGPoker or put a lot of money there. But it doesn't matter for me anyway since I can't play there because I live in the U.S.

According to the internet, the casino can ban(86) a person for card counting

There was even a guy who started a thread here who was banned for card counting went to play a wsop tourney and during the event he got found and booted and didn’t get the buy in back

Instead of just refusing to let them play blackjack the casino could ban them from the premises altogether.

That’s my point. GG is doing the same thing, 80 accounts were found using some sort of rta or gto or whatever and 13 players funds were taken (guess the hard evidence of cheating) the others were told to leave.

Gl getting caught cheating in a casino and keeping winnings

There is no way to prove that you are playing fairly, the burden of proof should be in the opposite direction.

It is true that so far none of the banned players have come forth, it will be interesting to see what the have to say and if they are all related in some manner (all from eastern europe or some mtt stable?).

I'm not sure what you're saying your point is.

The casinos just refuse service if they don't want a particular customer to patronize their establishment. They can't take the person's chips off the blackjack table and keep them. That would be stealing.

Confiscating player account balances on vague claims under TOS that are vague and broad isn't the same thing as banning players from future use of the site, but returning the money in the account.

I would think that most people would agree that for confiscation of funds the wrongdoing should be more significant than it needs to be for a ban and it should be quite close to certain that it actually occurred.

And in the case of confiscation, the money should then be redistributed to the cheated players. What did happen to the $1,200,000 confiscated that is the subject of the tweet in the first post of this thread?



It's just something to consider when choosing poker sites and how much money to have on deposit with them.




You added the following to your post after I posted the above:

If you actually cheat in a casino (counting cards [which is what you started this conversation with] isn't cheating - it's not illegal to count cards), the casino will call the police.

There's no reputable casino that would take your blackjack winnings away if you were caught card counting, either by yourself or with a team. For example, I don't recall one instance in the book "Bringing Down the House" where that was done.

Only 13 out of 80 accounts money was taken.

Do you think that cheaters should get to keep winnings?

Out of the 13 accounts we can guess Fedor is one of them, I think most sane people would agree he cheated and shouldn’t keep the winnings.

So far no other ppl have come here and said money was taken for no reason.

Back to the blackjack thing, yes if counting cards probably just banned, but if someone actually gets caught cheating with machines or switching cards or whatever I really doubt you would keep winnings

Also agree with gg should be giving the money to affected players which seems they might not be?

But ppl upset at GG for warning and banning players breaking TOS is getting tiring, so far all I’ve seen have in some way been breaking TOS