Quote:
Originally Posted by Phulhouze
Appreciate you writing this. I think itÂ’s under discussed and, as you mentioned, usually written off with one of a few tired responses.
I donÂ’t have an answer, but IÂ’ve found two ideas pretty compelling, on opposite sides of the argument:
For: I donÂ’t really take responsibility for so-called predation, as any job involves taking money from somebody, exploiting somebody, hurting the environment, etc, etc. No one comes out clean in terms of getting the money you need to support you and (maybe) your family.
IÂ’ve been in education for 20 years, and more and more come to see how much of the field is dominated by adults finding ways to line their pockets with tax money thatÂ’s supposed to help kids. So end of the day, is it better to profit off guys who get drunk and spew off their rent money, or taxpayers and underprivileged kids?
Against: Since I’m not terribly concerned about what I’m “taking” or who I’m taking it from, my issue of conscience with poker as a job is what I’m not giving.
In most fields, while youÂ’re extracting money from somewhere, youÂ’re usually giving something of value in return. Even the worst education companies I worked for were providing some benefit to teachers and students.
In poker, people talk about it like pros are the house and we’re there to show recs a good time. In all honesty, this is just a way of saying “don’t let the fish realize they’re fish. Be nice so they stick around and lose more money.”
I really donÂ’t believe that playing poker for a living contributes anything to society. Maybe an Ivey or a Negreanu adds some marginal entertainment value with their tv appearances, but still nowhere near what they extract from the game. And the rest of us arenÂ’t even providing that.
Maybe if you frame your concerns less about guilt for the harm your causing, and more about a desire to make a positive contribution, you might find more clarity about your next step.
I've honestly never had an issue about my lack of contribution to society. TBH, I think our society is corrupt at its core, and I've never felt any urge or obligation to contribute to it. If I was gonna try and contribute to society, I'd be trying to change it. I'd be an activist of some sort. Maybe I'd join some radical group devoted to direct action. I used to participate in efforts to cause social change, and none of them ever amounted to anything. Social movements with similar goals have ways been ineffectual. Look at Occupy - what did they accomplish? Corporations have more power and influence then ever. Same with the movements to abolish or defund the police. Police impunity is at an all time high.. So xe efforts to radically change our society have historically amounted to almost nothing, I don't feel like participation in such movements would be productive use of time.
Perhaps if I had been born in a different era, I'd feel differently. If id been around at the turn of the century, I'd have joined the IWW and fought for organized labor. They actually did succeed in giving labor a fighting chance against capital. If id been born a little later, I'd have fought in the Spanish Civil War. On the 60s, I'd probably have joined the anti war movement, as they DID make a difference. But aside from that, social activism appears to be beating a dead horse. Obviously, if I can't radically change society for the better, I have no desire to contribute to it. Yeah, I could have taken a different path. Become a doctor and open a free clinic in a third world country. Maybe I could have been a civil rights lawyer. Who knows? Calle selfish, but I prioritize my family over whatever peace of mind I'd have gotten from pursuing social justice.
My daughter recently graduated from college. She's the first member of my family on either side to get a college degree, as my generations of my family have been working class. My daughter now has the opportunity to pursue countless avenues, many of which will give her have the opportunity to make the world a better place. My poker winnings paid her tuition, and as far as I'm concerned, that's my contribution, and I'm happy with it. Not only have I given my daughter an opportunity nobody in my family had ever had, but all the unethical things I've done as a poker player now have as least a level of merit l. I've paid it forward on the only way that makes sense to me.
As for poker itself, even though it doesn't 'contribute' to what I consider a corrupt and morally bereft system, it does exist in a microcosm. The game is a self-contained universe, where whatever happens can be viewed totally independently from whatever social constructs exist outside of it. This to me is better then something like finance and banking, or lost importantly l, hedge fund type stuff - the moving around of capital for the some purpose of naked accumulation. This type of career harms society immensely l. Every dollar a hedge fund makes hurts the working g and lower middle classes either directly, through patent sharking and aggressively absorbing small business (just a few examples), or indirectly by contributing to a capitalist economy with corporate personhood, prioritizing the profit motive and stifling the personal agency of the already exploited working class
I guess what somes it up is that capitalism revolves around exploitation. Parasites such as big business owners and landlords exploit the workers who actually build our infrastructure. Owners and managers take a portion of the value of working class labor, leaving the masses, especially in developing countries, in a state of wage slavery.
Not to fully turn this into a capitalism vs. socialism debate, but my own reasoning as somebody who opposed capitalism at its core is that it's nearly impossible to succeed in our society without contributing to exploitation. In poker, I'm doing it at a much smaller scale then many other professions. This is why my mai issue is the personal damage I do to degenerates . Even investment bankers don't have to look their victims in the eye, wheras I DIRECTLY exploit people who sit across from me. No rationalization will make me feel better about that, although I do consider myself a much lesser evil in the scene of things. So yeah, my ethical issues are personal rather than social, and contributing to society has nothing to with it. As long as I'm not making the world any worse, I can live with myself.