lol aguiar

good work bro


and two shae's post are a bit laughable too. so, he was nice when you played him with. grrrrrrrreat

No he wouldnt

He would pay tax at the end of the year on his total profits, if he had a losing year he wont have tax to pay, if he only played the 1 drop and mincashed, hed pay tax on the 300k profit

if he mincashed, then went and lost 250k in buyins throughout the year, he would pay tax on 50k at the appropriate tax rate

IDK, they have had a free add on NVG running since they did it. Some say the only bad press is no press. I bet a lot more people have or will check out DK now then would have by avoiding this PR problem.

And I don't think they intended on this but honestly it probably worked out better for them and they got way more out of the money they gave lindgren then they would have anyone else thanks to this uproar.

Not true. I noticed from experience that if you cash in a tourney where you buy in with BIC (wsop buy in chips) you get taxed differently than if you cash a tourney where you bought in with cash chips or cash, etc. When he won the 25k satty I guarantee his receipt said he bought in with $1,000,000 BIC. He's getting taxed on the 1.32m in the min-cash situation this person described bc he technically paid $0 cash value anything for his buyin. His $25.4k satty receipt will be a 25.4k write-off if he bought into that with cash. If someone bought into the tourney with cash and cashes for 1.32 then yes they are only getting taxed on 300k.

Ya, sure.......bet he thinks IRS stands for "I Rear-ended Somebody."

I want to make it clear that I am not in any way trying to defend Erick or what he's done. I just want people to think critically about the pros and cons of calling him out at the table as someone he does not owe money to.

Since I made that post, not a single person has given a compelling reason why he should be called out at the table. Please, give an explanation as to how it would be productive for a) the person calling him out b) Erick or c) people Erick owes d) the rest of the community

I encourage you to check out Haralabos interview with pokernews yesterday where he talks about Erick.

I don't buy the "It will make him more likely to pay". If that is your key point, we will have to agree to disagree.

You can talk about "the community" and how trust is key.

But there is only one certainty in this community. If you lend to/gamble with deadbeats without the money on the table, you are a fool. You will get rolled. Oh you didn't know that? You must be new here. Caveat emptor, plan accordingly.

link?

edit: found it

http://www.pokernews.com/video/wsop-...ld-is-8952.htm

Deleted the Draft Day/Taylor Caby stuff to keep the thread on track.

Yeah, I don't think it's likely to make him more likely to pay anybody back, and if I was at his table, I very much doubt that I'd personally call him out.

However, I would totally support someone else who called him out, and here's why:

It sends a message. It tells Edog, in the first instance, and secondly other potential scam artists and welchers that their behaviour is unacceptable, and that people who do it will be regarded as pariahs -- unwelcome in civilized company.

Whereas I think your insistance that people don't call him out sends quite the opposite message. It's fine to scam people, because nobody really gives a **** about it.

So yeah, while I'm not very likely to call someone out if it's not actually my money at stake, my support will always like with the people who do the calling out as opposed to with the actual scammers and welchers.

YMMV.

i just find it disgusting that edog can walk around and not hear anything about how big of a scumbag he is. i dont necessarily think calling him out at the tables will help anything (doubt it will hurt anything either, most of the times scammers are either gonna pay or not pay and nothing will change that either way)

people who steal are usually charismatic people who can charm the people around them into thinking "oh, he isnt such a bad guy" and they somehow get sympathy from people.

i just hate scammers in general.

Bolded part is absolutely true and the crux of my "calling him out is not productive" argument.

And the rest just confirms my initial contention that people who call him out do it out of insecurity or a delusional belief that they are some self-righteous crusader who distributes justice (as if they and they alone know who deserves what). He deserves to feel like the bad guy and you deserve to feel like the good guy, and make sure he knows that's the situation. As if he doesn't already know that stealing money is bad and everyone that is part of the community looks down on him...

duke and lederer have been publicly shamed now they don't come around anymore...go figure

if he doesn't come around, he can't make money and no one gets paid. Seems like a good idea. Even better, he will probably sit at home and gamble any $ he does get hold of on sports.

Yeah, you don't understand what you are talking about. In most social groups, and in all honorable communities, when someone engages in outrageous criminal behavior there is a social price to pay. People may think that the only way they can get paid back is if Lindgren makes a huge score, and maybe there is truth to that, but in the long run, if poker losers continue to let people commit major felonies and other frauds against them, without so much as even putting social pressure on them, then those owed deserve zero.

Hardly anyone ever mentions his major scam. He borrrowed 2 million from Chris Ferguson, and was accidentally sent the money twice. So, he kept the other two million and even when quickly confronted he still still kept it. It was never paid. In real world activities that results in prison or a serious threat to his well-being, but at a minimum, he would not be allowed to ever show his face again.

You guys are too much. Some of the most dishonest intellectual discussions and attitudes are promulgated daily by people who have no clue about anything. You will get ZERO from Erick Lindgren, and you WILL like it.

The mental gymnastics that most of you do when discussing your pathetic behavior is not found anywhere else in the world. Poker is unique that way. And that is why no regular advertisers are ever found for poker events, even WSOP events. It is because most poker players are outcasts, are not involved in the daily workings of society, are broke, and therefore cannot buy the products that would be advertised. It is an ugly human endeavor.

First of all, do we know for sure that he isn't getting remarks?

If Negreanu or other EDog friends are speaking out in his defense, it suggests that he is getting some sort of heat, perhaps as simple as heckles from the gallery. They wouldn't form some sort of figurative protective phalanx unless it was unprovoked, or would they?

Here's how I also figure it: of all the people interacting with EDog on a daily basis right now, what percentage of people are even aware of his foibles? Bear in mind, 2+2 is hardly an accurate cross section of the overall poker community — especially at these live MTTs where you still can hear on the rail how great Annie Duke is.

Of the subgroup who knows of his gambling debt, they probably break down more or less as follows:
1. Those he doesn't owe and who don't care about his debt one way or another. e.g. people who saw the article in Bluff and went, "Who? Oh yeah, I remember that guy."
2. Those he doesn't owe but who are concerned/infuriated/appalled by his debt. NVG appears to have an inordinately high number in this category.
3. Those he doesn't owe but who see him as a sympathetic character. I'll first pause for laughter. Yes, I think this is a larger group than we might think. Lindgren cultivated a nice-guy image for years. Now he's put himself in a tough situation in which he has declared bankruptcy. He probably wants to do the right thing, and would pay if he could, but he's in so deep that he now faces a nearly insurmountable obstacle.
4. Those he owes, and who don't believe he will ever be able to pay back. Haralabob must have been in this group if he was willing to unload the debt for pennies on the dollar.
5. Those he owes, and who don't believe he is willing to pay back even if he has the means to do so. In other words, they believe EDog is truly a scammer, not just a deadbeat.
6. Those he owes but who believe he will pay back. Those people, as Haralabob said in his interview, are the ones rooting hardest for him. Of course, they will celebrate all the way to the cashier's counter if he wins.

There is a probably a seventh category of those getting some restitution in the wake of the Chapter 7 filing, but I don't know enough about this to posit who they are.

Anyway, of those various splinter groups, the type of people who will attempt to shame him would fall under No. 2 and No. 5. Among those people, how many are in Vegas right now? And among that group, how many — despite what they might claim in an online poker forum — would really walk up to Lindgren and state their pieces to his face?

I don't know how many jabs and jeers E-Dog is facing in the Rio right now, but I would suspect the number is low if it's any at all. Disgusting? Perhaps. But not at all surprising to me.

EL wearing a DraftKings patch is amazing troll. DK sponsoring a guy who's known for not paying up on fantasy sports bets when that's what DK essentially is--is such an amazingly terrible decision that there's just no way they're being run with anything other than incompetence.

sadly in the current internet realm of things most likely DraftKings is just foretelling their future, sports bets that don't get paid.

yeah, this is probably true as well, not b/c of the bad press here but most watching on TV won't have any idea and will just see the ad on a name pro.

It's just they managed to do it with about the only bad choice in that field they could pick. Like anyone else would've been a better option.

edit--not surprised either corp response was "Given all of this I believed there would still be some negativity but the end result would be positive given that Erick could get significant TV time and exposure to 100’s of thousands of poker fans watching this event casually. " you only posted that line b/c it's the entire truth from you--you clearly don't give a **** about your image, just your bank account.

i don't get this. Ppl go broke and in debt with huge IRS debts and file for baknkruptcy all the time. They don't get mauled the way ppl in the poker community do about their debts.

Um, I'm pretty sure most people who KNOWINGLY go into massive debt (as opposed to just unfortunate circumstances on relatively smaller amounts) would be shamed. If someone purposely tried to hide from the IRS and spent more money they didn't have (most likely borrowed from others), I think at the very least, people who knew about it would eventually call them out as having a problem. And if they continued to do so, people would shame them and think of them as not a very good human being. See Bernie Madoff.

Even if they don't associate with people who would, surely a legitimate company wouldn't ask them to be a representative of the brand that is directly tied to the field where the debts came from.

If you're just referring to people who tried to do right and things went badly for them, that's not the case here.

From my point of view, people live above their means all the time and go into deep debt with creditors, homes, IRS etc etc. They think the money will just keep coming in (similar to what Erik did i believe) and expected everything to even out. Like with ERik I'm sure he was owed money from others and just got caught in the cycle until it collapsed.

But by all reports, when it did collapsed (Black Friday), instead of owning up to it or even stopping the cycle, he continued with it and/or was deceptive about his situation. I believe Haralabos has even mentioned how EL was defiantly against paying him back because he didn't like him (I think for outing him?). That's not someone thinking about remorse or recovery, which helps to confirm EL as a person of poor quality. Yes, he eventually got around to admitting it, but only after everyone knew and already had labeled him a scumbag.

Which ultimately leads back to the question of how an entity like DraftKings would associate with anyone like him, especially given their industry.

Again, I know the situations and people you are referring to, but EL is not one of the sympathetic ones.

Haralobos mentioned in a Pokernews interview that one of the reasons he sold the debt for pennies on the dollar is b/c he thought it was unlikely he was getting paid and Lindgren didn't want to pay him because Haralobos outed him publicly

i don't blame him - prob got 100-200k on the debt. He's in the hole pretty bad and it's not like he can just file for bankruptcy and move on from this.

http://www.bluff.com/magazine/broken...en-story-6094/

So he currently owes Poker Stars 3 million? That plus all the other people he owes he's in for a long grind...

Pretty sure he means his total debt, not just Stars.