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Old 03-09-2012, 10:09 PM   #1151
Rob999
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Any chance Erica Dog could help pay down the debts? I mean after she gets back in shape.
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Old 03-09-2012, 10:39 PM   #1152
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

As far as who owes Daniel $500K, Layne Flack is an excellent guess mainly because if he owed it to Daniel then Daniels right he will never see it. I have a long shot guess that nobody has mentioned. Johnny World Hennigan. Haven't seen much of him in the poker world lately. He's a sick sick degen., Daniel once thought he was the best player going when he was first starting out and would have no problem making big wagers with Hennigan and of all the "name/great" players in the US he seemed to profit the least from sponsorship and the likes. He also has a history of going busto!!! The downside of my guess is that I still think that if he played a lot of tournaments he would make a big score at some point....although maybe he owes a lot of others.
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Old 03-09-2012, 10:43 PM   #1153
molinn9
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by glimmertwin View Post
Never gonna give it up, Never gonna pay it down, I'll give you the runaround, Rather than pay you, You can kiss your cash goodbye, You don't have to wonder why, Betting sports just gets me high, But I can't pay you...
wow i have seldom seen genius at work but this text sir is just BRILLIANT well done!!!!
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Old 03-09-2012, 10:50 PM   #1154
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by glimmertwin View Post
Never gonna give it up,
Never gonna pay it down,
I'll give you the runaround,
Rather than pay you,
You can kiss your cash goodbye,
You don't have to wonder why,
Betting sports just gets me high,
But I can't pay you...
lol nice
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Old 03-09-2012, 11:48 PM   #1155
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by ConstantRijkenberg View Post
all this explains how he became 43rd in the last ME of the WSOP been his first cash ever in it .

" people play their best when they are broke "
Ha, well, I have another cliché that I like to use... and believe: "Scared money never wins." I don't know if it's tilt control or what, but it's almost always held true in my experience.
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Old 03-10-2012, 12:12 AM   #1156
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

What a joke Full Tilt is. Just a mockery to poker as a whole.
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Old 03-10-2012, 12:33 AM   #1157
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob999 View Post
As far as who owes Daniel $500K, Layne Flack is an excellent guess mainly because if he owed it to Daniel then Daniels right he will never see it. I have a long shot guess that nobody has mentioned. Johnny World Hennigan. Haven't seen much of him in the poker world lately. He's a sick sick degen., Daniel once thought he was the best player going when he was first starting out and would have no problem making big wagers with Hennigan and of all the "name/great" players in the US he seemed to profit the least from sponsorship and the likes. He also has a history of going busto!!! The downside of my guess is that I still think that if he played a lot of tournaments he would make a big score at some point....although maybe he owes a lot of others.
I have another long-shot guess: Kirk Morrison
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Old 03-10-2012, 12:51 AM   #1158
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

I think Daniel said they were playing at shooting stars. So it cant be Johnny world or Kirk Morrisson. I think its time Danile just confirmed it for us all its Layne Flack. Isnt Layne high on coke every day and i doubt Flack even knows what 2+2 so you are save Danny to tell us
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Old 03-10-2012, 01:43 AM   #1159
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBump View Post
NH


Could SrslySirius turn this into a vid ?!
yeah, this. i'll end my derail by asking what another 2+2er brought up (which i think is relevant):

Quote:
Originally Posted by RoyalCrap View Post
I believe what Mason said a while back that the inability of most professional poker players to succeed is tied to a lack of understanding of the underlying mathematics of the game. The best players are drawn to the biggest games, and I suspect that, at the highest levels, the very best poker players do not have much of an edge over players who are just "good."

A winning player needs to not only maintain an edge over his opponents, but also a big enough of an edge to make a living after paying rake to the casinos and taxes to the government.

Perhaps most importantly, a winning player cannot succeed unless he understands his risk of ruin and selects his games accordingly. It would be very interesting to have someone like Mason weigh in on exactly how big of a bankroll a "good" or even "great" player must have to play in a series of $10K buyin events with 600 or so players, such as the WPT Shooting Stars event, with say only a 1%, 5%, or 10% risk of ruin. Without doing the required math or analysis, I would guess that such a player would need a minimum of 100 buyins (that is, $1 million) just to reduce his risk of ruin to around 10%.

In other words, imagine that a great player has a $1 million bankroll and an opportunity to play in 365 $10K buy-in events in a year. I would guess that there is a 10% chance or so that that player will lose his entire bankroll that year. That's probably the underlying math.

I would also love to have Mason discuss the return on investment for such a player. Let's say this great player doesn't lose his entire bankroll, which would probably be the case around 90% of the time. How much will that player actually make in net profits (e.g., after rake, taxes, travel expenses, buyins lost, and so on)?

If this hypothetical great player has a 10% ROI, he would need to play in a lot of $10K buy-in events just to make a decent income. Also, there would probably be many years in which he would be in the hole for the year.

Understanding the math of the game is key, and it looks like all but maybe the very best-of-the-best understand that. The rest either have failed or will fail.

RC
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Old 03-10-2012, 02:07 AM   #1160
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

I posted the original thread in hsnl. Pretty interesting how 'viral' this went.

I joined a few 2p2 fantasy football leagues in August and made some side bets with Erik. I didn't know Erik personally, but I felt 98% certain I could trust him. Why?

1. Other 'smart' reputable poker players in the league trusted him and made sidebets with him.
2. He's made an incredible amount of $ in live tournaments and via FTP
3. I had never read any 'dirt' on him.

End of season, I was +11k. Basically, for 3 months, I was emailing him every other week asking to be paid or at least give me a timetable of what's going on. January 30th, he told me he was "Cash broke". It's confusing to me because I thought you should sell houses, stocks, cars etc. if you're "cash broke" to pay debts in a timely fashion.

A couple other guys in fantasy football leagues with him who were owed 5x the amount of $$$ I was said "he always pays late" Nobody gave me this memo when I joined the fantasy football league with him.

Despite delay paying being prevalent for Erik, I was worried.

-He said he was "cash broke".
-He wasn't collecting 200k+ per month from FTP like he was in previous years.
-Yet he was playing with 10-20k at Ocean's 11 casino.

I thought is he chasing losses to pay back debts?

In late february, sick of the cat and mouse email game I told him "If you're 'cash broke', or 'people owe you money', I would expect you to sell stocks, cars, house whatever you have to do to pay. I don't want to post about how much of a hassle this has been, and make this public, but if I have to I will."

Erik said "totally understand and my only asset right now is debt i am owed. Let me get back to you in depth this evening. Very sorry that i lost more bettting sports than I should have and had no money left for fantasy. I am doing all i can to borrow so i can both pay debts and work. i will email you this evening."

Waited a week. Never got an email. Posted about the situation in hsnl. I could have waited I suppose and played the cat and mouse email game a few months or years longer.

However, out of selfish interests, I thought making the situation public would increase the chance I get paid vs not making it public.

Last edited by $kill Game; 03-10-2012 at 02:16 AM.
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Old 03-10-2012, 02:12 AM   #1161
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by atthebottom77 View Post
Originally Posted by RoyalCrap
I believe what Mason said a while back that the inability of most professional poker players to succeed is tied to a lack of understanding of the underlying mathematics of the game. The best players are drawn to the biggest games, and I suspect that, at the highest levels, the very best poker players do not have much of an edge over players who are just "good."

A winning player needs to not only maintain an edge over his opponents, but also a big enough of an edge to make a living after paying rake to the casinos and taxes to the government.

Perhaps most importantly, a winning player cannot succeed unless he understands his risk of ruin and selects his games accordingly. It would be very interesting to have someone like Mason weigh in on exactly how big of a bankroll a "good" or even "great" player must have to play in a series of $10K buyin events with 600 or so players, such as the WPT Shooting Stars event, with say only a 1%, 5%, or 10% risk of ruin. Without doing the required math or analysis, I would guess that such a player would need a minimum of 100 buyins (that is, $1 million) just to reduce his risk of ruin to around 10%.

In other words, imagine that a great player has a $1 million bankroll and an opportunity to play in 365 $10K buy-in events in a year. I would guess that there is a 10% chance or so that that player will lose his entire bankroll that year. That's probably the underlying math.

I would also love to have Mason discuss the return on investment for such a player. Let's say this great player doesn't lose his entire bankroll, which would probably be the case around 90% of the time. How much will that player actually make in net profits (e.g., after rake, taxes, travel expenses, buyins lost, and so on)?

If this hypothetical great player has a 10% ROI, he would need to play in a lot of $10K buy-in events just to make a decent income. Also, there would probably be many years in which he would be in the hole for the year.

Understanding the math of the game is key, and it looks like all but maybe the very best-of-the-best understand that. The rest either have failed or will fail.

RC
Sounds like up until Black Friday any "pro" who went broke could just join Erick Lindgren's stable courtesy of the FTP player pool, so you have to take that into account somehow, that even if you went broke you could stay in action.
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Old 03-10-2012, 02:36 AM   #1162
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

http://www.pokerstatic.com/hot-seat/...bos-voulgaris/

watch at 37:30

lol then he mentions him at 41:50 so sick but wasnt outing him

Last edited by sinner; 03-10-2012 at 02:47 AM.
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Old 03-10-2012, 03:39 AM   #1163
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Layne Flack took a private jet back to Las Vegas with Daniel from SJ, he posted a photo on Facebook. Would Daniel really be hanging out with a guy that owes him 500k and can't ever pay him back?

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Old 03-10-2012, 04:05 AM   #1164
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBBinLV View Post
Layne Flack took a private jet back to Las Vegas with Daniel from SJ, he posted a photo on Facebook. Would Daniel really be hanging out with a guy that owes him 500k and can't ever pay him back?
Not saying the "guy" that owes DN is Flack. But have you never seen some of the threads on this site about people owing/scamming money? The person owed sometimes goes as far as to defend the person who screwed them in hopes that they don't get mad enough to never pay back. It has happened with guys that have money or are broke, it's pretty common for the person owed to want to stay friends/on the good side of the person that owes them and then come back and say "can you remove this thread, person paid. Don't want to trash their name."

Maybe it isn't the case with DN but it wouldn't be the most shocking thing for a person who is owed to do.
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Old 03-10-2012, 04:08 AM   #1165
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Hey, let's be honest. All the nightmares are true. The internet was rigged. All the FTP pros we "learned" from are scum.
The whole game is a scam and the newbies are the marks. We are all former newbies. Welcome to the jungle...
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Old 03-10-2012, 04:13 AM   #1166
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

I'm pretty sure edog is playing 2-5 at aria right now.. Must be trying to rebuild.
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Old 03-10-2012, 04:15 AM   #1167
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

I could be wrong tho, and could be a lookalike, however mattasow was just playing on the table too...
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Old 03-10-2012, 04:37 AM   #1168
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

I think Daniel is trying to use the force to do this.

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Old 03-10-2012, 05:51 AM   #1169
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by yowhatsup View Post
Not saying the "guy" that owes DN is Flack. But have you never seen some of the threads on this site about people owing/scamming money? The person owed sometimes goes as far as to defend the person who screwed them in hopes that they don't get mad enough to never pay back. It has happened with guys that have money or are broke, it's pretty common for the person owed to want to stay friends/on the good side of the person that owes them and then come back and say "can you remove this thread, person paid. Don't want to trash their name."
(...)

Hi,
Interesting post.
Actually this kind of rings a bell. I haven't done it consciously.

Without making a new thread, there are some people who owe me what IMO is a significant amount of money. 2 guys owe me about $2k each and there are a few more in the $500 range. Some I helped out when they were in the gutter, others are from big drinking bills and renting cars. These guys all have the money to pay back, and yet I've confronted them, they've excused/ignored on multiple occasions and I'm unlikely to see money and short of not being friends with them anymore and telling them they've acted scummy; I haven't done anything.

My Q is, and I've been thinking this for a while. Do you think it's fair to out them or make a google hit on what they've done and that they're not trustworthy? Or should I just let it slide and move on.

Thanks, f
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Old 03-10-2012, 05:57 AM   #1170
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob999 View Post
Daniel once thought he was the best player going when he was first starting out.
If you try to solve the mystery by seeing which of the the players he used to mention as great, have gone through millions since then, you won't have narrowed things down much.
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Old 03-10-2012, 06:06 AM   #1171
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by fanapathy View Post
Hi,
Interesting post.
Actually this kind of rings a bell. I haven't done it consciously.

Without making a new thread, there are some people who owe me what IMO is a significant amount of money. 2 guys owe me about $2k each and there are a few more in the $500 range. Some I helped out when they were in the gutter, others are from big drinking bills and renting cars. These guys all have the money to pay back, and yet I've confronted them, they've excused/ignored on multiple occasions and I'm unlikely to see money and short of not being friends with them anymore and telling them they've acted scummy; I haven't done anything.

My Q is, and I've been thinking this for a while. Do you think it's fair to out them or make a google hit on what they've done and that they're not trustworthy? Or should I just let it slide and move on.

Thanks, f
You should, talk to them all privately one more time and warn them that if they don't come up with a payment plan, then you will make it public online, and if they have reputations to protect they should pay up pretty quickly after that.
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Old 03-10-2012, 08:10 AM   #1172
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

The mystery debtor is John D'Agostino. There, I said it.
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:34 AM   #1173
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingBBinLV View Post
Layne Flack took a private jet back to Las Vegas with Daniel from SJ, he posted a photo on Facebook. Would Daniel really be hanging out with a guy that owes him 500k and can't ever pay him back?

Honest Q: Why does anyone hang around with this guy?
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Old 03-10-2012, 09:41 AM   #1174
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Could the mystery debtor be Sammy Farha??
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Old 03-10-2012, 10:14 AM   #1175
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Re: Erick Lindgren Owes Over $100,000 for Fantasy League, Won't Pay

Quote:
Originally Posted by fanapathy View Post
Hi,
Interesting post.
Actually this kind of rings a bell. I haven't done it consciously.

Without making a new thread, there are some people who owe me what IMO is a significant amount of money. 2 guys owe me about $2k each and there are a few more in the $500 range. Some I helped out when they were in the gutter, others are from big drinking bills and renting cars. These guys all have the money to pay back, and yet I've confronted them, they've excused/ignored on multiple occasions and I'm unlikely to see money and short of not being friends with them anymore and telling them they've acted scummy; I haven't done anything.

My Q is, and I've been thinking this for a while. Do you think it's fair to out them or make a google hit on what they've done and that they're not trustworthy? Or should I just let it slide and move on.

Thanks, f
i think it's fair to say you shouldn't loan out money if 5k gets your engine revved up

seriously, 5k wouldn't even be worth the time
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