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Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands)

09-27-2020 , 03:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Why
I am not so sure "Negreanu will have some of the best guys in the industry helping him get better", the Negreanu brand is pretty toxic these days, what with him being banned from Twitch while promoting GG Poker after saying he would break the teeth of the person he was talking with and feed them back to them anally, calling people who criticise his play self abusers, playing poorly, and having public melt downs when he loses, I dont think people will be queuing up to help him, or even be associated with helping him and his challenge.
Or he could simply pay someone for private lessons. Wtf does any of your criticisms have to do with him obtaining the tools out on the market to concentrate on heads up play?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Why
As was mentioned in this thread, he does not appear to have many friends in the poker world.
This just seems like projection on your part.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Why

What makes anyone think he is doing any preparation for this challenge?

He obviously should, as I mentioned earlier on this thread, the logical thing to do would be to prepare but we are dealing with an aggressive narcissist here, with Tourette's I think he mentioned, who has a warped view of reality in which he is so good that the only reason he loses is that the other player got lucky. That unfortunately is not the mind set to put in the necessary work.
Because he says he is going to prepare for the challenge and has outlined a game plan and timeline. Or just maybe, he is taking your advice through you public posting on 2+2 and following your recommendations. That would be so dreamy!
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-27-2020 , 06:56 PM
I think DN knows who Polk is, and I doubt he wants to be embarrassed. So I’m guessing he has some kind of plan. And lol he has no poker friends
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-27-2020 , 08:14 PM
I've said it before and I'll say it again.

100% Jaywhy is one of the no lifer trolls in Dnegs chat.

Last edited by madlex; 09-27-2020 at 08:30 PM. Reason: Language
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-27-2020 , 08:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hueeey
I've said it before and I'll say it again.

100% Jaywhy is one of the no lifer trolls in Dnegs chat.
I don’t think there’s any reason to say that over and over again. He said he isn’t and that’s that.
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 01:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MicroDonkYT
Yeah, he could. To be clear, this is my contention:

IF he hires a known online crusher to coach him
IF he dedicates 2-3 months of full time labbing/playing
IF Doug doesn't embrace solvers

He could partially close the gap. He could go from probably a -25bb/100 dog to maybe a -5-6bb/100 dog.

Doug's game is based on old principles of MDF and was quasi-GTO. It is clear his approach is dated and he would get crushed by any modern HU specialist (if they still exist). If he doesn't embrace solvers and tweak his game, then Negs could very likely close the gap.

With all of that said, none of it is very likely and there's probably a >90% chance that Negs get smoked, but I highly doubt this match ever happens.
Whats up man,

I read over you comment yesterday and was thinking about the statement you made about Dougs game. For many years i had always thought that Dougs style would be very similar to the other HU specialist like Linus, Limitless, Otb, MMA, etc. However even Doug admits he has not done much if any solver work,, so this cant really be true.

What does this mean though? Does it simply mean that the endbosses right now has just precisely fine tuned more and more spots from getting/understanding many different solves? Or does it mean that Doug style was more exploitative then balanced and the top HU specialist already knows how to counter-exploit such strategies.

Lastly, since you mentioned that Dougs style was very MDF based and is outdated, isnt solvers still applying rules of MDF otherwise those strategies would not have been unexploitable?

Hopefully my post is not meant to be in another thread or a DP containement thread haha. Feel free to reply me privately as well if you wish to avoid spamming this thread.

Cheers, Ab Bad
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 02:39 AM
I'm not sure about all of that, but having played doug a few sessions, it's very clear that he has fully embraced/put a lot of work in with a solver recently
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 03:35 AM
I'd love for Doug to come here and comment on 5.6 to 1 over 10k hands lol. He's probably going to put a million bucks on negreanu..
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 04:15 AM
Holy ****, are you still posting about this?
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 04:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyfrommichigan
I'd love for Doug to come here and comment on 5.6 to 1 over 10k hands lol. He's probably going to put a million bucks on negreanu..
find an escrow you like and I trust and I will bet you.

will take the current pokershares odds, juice free obv

its currently 1.16 for doug and 5.6 for daniel. which means the juice free +/- 482

my 482 to your 100. or will take more if you want.



if not, please shut up about it

Last edited by Zima421; 09-28-2020 at 05:13 AM. Reason: will donate my winnings and my initial bet to charity. YAYO
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zima421
find an escrow you like and I trust and I will bet you.

will take the current pokershares odds, juice free obv

its currently 1.16 for doug and 5.6 for daniel. which means the juice free +/- 482

my 482 to your 100. or will take more if you want.



if not, please shut up about it
Indeed it's unlikely I'd want to verse myself in the logistics of betting with you but if you want to point me in the direction of where this is explained, I'll take a look..if it was as simple as just putting in a bet with a reputable sportsbook, I'd put a hundred down in a heartbeat..
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 10:39 AM
it's amazing how someone can be so defiant in the face of something that could literally be solved using a calculator
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 12:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyfrommichigan
Polk's edge over 10000 hands against someone as competent as negreanu who isn't playing on scared money is minuscule at best. Flip a coin..if you're 23 and buy into the wizard myth it's unlikely I'd be able to convince you of this..
Guy, you have said you think this challenge is a coinflip, but not explained your carefully considered background thinking on this statement.

It would be really helpful to see what we have overlooked, that you have spotted and are sharing with us.

Polk's heads up credentials are well publicised, what are your grounds for thinking Negreanu is so much his equal heads up it is a coin flip between the two?
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 01:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Why
Guy, you have said you think this challenge is a coinflip, but not explained your carefully considered background thinking on this statement.

It would be really helpful to see what we have overlooked, that you have spotted and are sharing with us.

Polk's heads up credentials are well publicised, what are your grounds for thinking Negreanu is so much his equal heads up it is a coin flip between the two?
Polk's edge (if he even particularly has one at this point) is closer to 1.2 or 1.3 to 1 than the absurd 5.6 to 1..particularly over a random 10k sample..lebron james can certainly jump higher than me..but do you think he can jump 30 feet higher than me??
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 02:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ab.Bad
Whats up man,

I read over you comment yesterday and was thinking about the statement you made about Dougs game. For many years i had always thought that Dougs style would be very similar to the other HU specialist like Linus, Limitless, Otb, MMA, etc. However even Doug admits he has not done much if any solver work,, so this cant really be true.

What does this mean though? Does it simply mean that the endbosses right now has just precisely fine tuned more and more spots from getting/understanding many different solves? Or does it mean that Doug style was more exploitative then balanced and the top HU specialist already knows how to counter-exploit such strategies.

Lastly, since you mentioned that Dougs style was very MDF based and is outdated, isnt solvers still applying rules of MDF otherwise those strategies would not have been unexploitable?

Hopefully my post is not meant to be in another thread or a DP containement thread haha. Feel free to reply me privately as well if you wish to avoid spamming this thread.

Cheers, Ab Bad
Hi,

Douglas has been solving poker spots using his own in house (basic in comaprison to what people have now) software/solver before most of todays high stakes regs were playing 5/10.

He understands HUNL like not many others in this world do...

Dnegs on the other hand is a clear massive favourite in this and will beat Doug very easily based simply on live reads alone.

Really hope this happens. GL.
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 02:12 PM
I have bets on DN where my opponents are laying me 3:1 and 6:1.
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 02:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Howard Treesong
I have bets on DN where my opponents are laying me 3:1 and 6:1.
You are +ev and massively +ev at 6 to 1.
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 02:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyfrommichigan
Polk's edge (if he even particularly has one at this point) is closer to 1.2 or 1.3 to 1 than the absurd 5.6 to 1..particularly over a random 10k sample..lebron james can certainly jump higher than me..but do you think he can jump 30 feet higher than me??
You keep spouting this stuff but have no reasoning to back it up other than 'they are both competent players'
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 03:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by isunkurbttlship
You keep spouting this stuff but have no reasoning to back it up other than 'they are both competent players'
I'm sorry, but I really don't know how to have discourse with people who don't understand that 5.6 to 1 in this context is akin to arguing that that lebron james can jump at least 30 feet higher than me..I guess try to read up on edges in poker, variance in poker, etc..
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 03:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyfrommichigan
Polk's edge (if he even particularly has one at this point) is closer to 1.2 or 1.3 to 1 than the absurd 5.6 to 1..particularly over a random 10k sample..lebron james can certainly jump higher than me..but do you think he can jump 30 feet higher than me??
Guy, I thought you were being a contrarian, just deliberately having an opposite view for the sake of it, but see you actually have thought your position through. And you may well be right, over the 12,500 hands Polk will be a few hundred to a thousand hands better than Negreanu, rather than many thousands of hands better.

Funny you should ask, the odds are 5.6 that Lebron James can jump 30 feet higher than you!
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 06:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyfrommichigan
Polk's edge (if he even particularly has one at this point) is closer to 1.2 or 1.3 to 1 than the absurd 5.6 to 1..particularly over a random 10k sample..lebron james can certainly jump higher than me..but do you think he can jump 30 feet higher than me??
Oh STFU already. You know absolutely nothing.
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 06:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pontylad
Oh STFU already. You know absolutely nothing.
No doubt you'd put up 500 against my 100..I'm quite dumb, after all..like taking candy from a baby..
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 07:44 PM
I mean, I made a bet with someone roughly 2k to 500. Would gladly do the same with you if you can escrow with someone reputable.
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 08:18 PM
Guy, can you please explain what “random” 10k hands mean? And how is that any different from just 10k hands? And what is the opposite of random 10k hands, unrandom 10k hands?
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 08:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProffesionalMalaka
Guy, can you please explain what “random” 10k hands mean? And how is that any different from just 10k hands? And what is the opposite of random 10k hands, unrandom 10k hands?
Think of it as discrete vs continuous..that is, hugely influenced by variance..10k hands heads up, variance will be a bigger factor than any skill differential..that is, daniel is good enough that variance will decide the winner more so than any skill difference..
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote
09-28-2020 , 08:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by guyfrommichigan
No doubt you'd put up 500 against my 100..I'm quite dumb, after all..like taking candy from a baby..
What is wrong with you, you could probably get about $100k of action by the end of the day if you wanted Dnegs at 4 to 1. Earlier you were talking about the odds being way closer than this.

Also you've had numerous offers to match your bet but then you keep refusing. Cause Hurrr Durrr I don't trust betting with randoms. 2+2 was basically built on people betting against each other. There are countless people who can escrow the money and pay the winner.

You're either a troll or close to brain dead. Can a mod just ban him from posting in this thread?
Doug Polk's Challenge to Daniel Negreanu: Heads-Up NLHE Showdown (25k Hands) Quote

      
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