Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

News, Views, and Gossip For poker news, views and gossip.

View Poll Results: so do you?
yes 215 44.61%
no 267 55.39%
Voters: 482. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-21-2013, 12:48 PM   #1
TheTenderVigilante
grinder
 
TheTenderVigilante's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Doesn't have insurance
Posts: 634
do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

figured this poll would belong here more than it would belong in legislation
TheTenderVigilante is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 01:22 PM   #2
SwoopAE
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
SwoopAE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Australia
Posts: 22,130
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

most ineffective lobbying group of all time but they are trying so yes even though they haven't actually accomplished much
SwoopAE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 01:41 PM   #3
RikaKazak
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 9,657
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rmhumr View Post
I don't get why people even care to ask. Are you suggesting that if the poll finds them ineffective you are going to go out and change things. I am willing to bet the answer is no. The fact is they are trying, and instead of attempting to put them down maybe you should provide whatever constructive criticism you are able to provide. I am also willing to bet that you don't have much.
Maybe if they get a bunch of no's, they'll realize their public image isn't that good and do something about it?
RikaKazak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 02:09 PM   #4
Do it Right
Pooh-Bah
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 3,890
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

I had a reasonably positive opinion of the PPA until they decided to allow Lederer and Ferguson onto their board of directors. And this was long before Black Friday and their insistence on keeping Lederer on board and defending him. Other such decisions like having Annie Duke lobby on player's behalf, again even before she was involved in various scams, left also left me scratching my head. It seems very clear somebody of her charisma, and as was late to be seen - character, is not exactly the sort of face you want for online poker.

I've no idea what's going on behind closed doors leading to decisions like the above, but that was more than enough to lead me to realization the interests of poker players in Ameica and those of the PPA are not necessarily aligned, let alone the same.
Do it Right is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 02:13 PM   #5
browser2920
Pooh-Bah
 
browser2920's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: in line behind 2919 other browsers
Posts: 4,558
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

That's a solid yes. When I was a kid (late 60s/early 70s) Putt-Putt was big, and the Professional Putters Association tournaments were on TV on the weekends. That was no hokey miniature golf with clown and windmill holes. This was the real deal!
browser2920 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 02:14 PM   #6
_Yogi_
newbie
 
_Yogi_'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 25
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Do it Right View Post
I had a reasonably positive opinion of the PPA until they decided to allow Lederer and Ferguson onto their board of directors. And this was long before Black Friday and their insistence on keeping Lederer on board and defending him. Other such decisions like having Annie Duke lobby on player's behalf, again even before she was involved in various scams, left also left me scratching my head. It seems very clear somebody of her charisma, and as was late to be seen - character, is not exactly the sort of face you want for online poker.

I've no idea what's going on behind closed doors leading to decisions like the above, but that was more than enough to lead me to realization the interests of poker players in Ameica and those of the PPA are not necessarily aligned, let alone the same.
Agreed, well said. Preach on...
_Yogi_ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 02:44 PM   #7
Bene Gesserit
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Bene Gesserit's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: my old Kentucky Home
Posts: 6,367
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Yes if you understand that their main agenda is getting online poker legal in the USA and not a lot of other issues about poker. They are somewhat underfunded lobbyists for a non mainstream issue. Don't think their actions or motives hurt anything, but they are not a bunch of heavyweights getting things done either. No need to be fanboys or haters on PPA IMHO.
Bene Gesserit is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 05:07 PM   #8
BustoPro
old hand
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Downwardly mobile
Posts: 1,668
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bene Gesserit View Post
Don't think their actions or motives hurt anything, but they are not a bunch of heavyweights getting things done either.
Pretty much this.

"Irrelevant" should be a poll choice, although the way the question is worded, I'd have to say "no".
BustoPro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 06:13 PM   #9
Percival
journeyman
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Lost Wages
Posts: 321
Perfect thread, and the real results show true before the PPA sends all its goons to overload the "yes" side.

People don't trust the PPA, and for good reason. It never fought for players rights, only a players' right to play online. And consumers were left battling online operators, tooth and nail, before black friday, just to gain the most basic customer services. And all the while, the PPA accepting funding from FTP, appointing Howard Lederer and Chris Ferguson to its board, and using poker consumers and their 'signatures' to at least in part, further empower the scumbags that would come to be known as the biggest violators of consumer trust in poker, FTP.

I think the idea of an 'alliance' among poker players is nobel and a great concept for poker. I just feel that a PPA that is dismissive of its members and poker stakeholders can never fulfill a duty to speak for the poker, consumer public.

Page 1, first responders
38 no
25 yes

Last edited by SGT RJ; 07-21-2013 at 08:32 PM.
Percival is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 06:17 PM   #10
DonkeyQuixote
veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: setting strawman arguments ablaze
Posts: 3,283
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

I voted, "Yes", (and am hardly a PPA goon)

Here is why: Three plusses and one neutral factor

1. (+)The PPA has been effective in a defensive stance on Capitol Hill, which has been crucial to online players continuing to have any access to unlicensed online poker in the absence of any federal prohibition bill passing. Sure, one or more Board members is ever ready to trade away a complete BAN today, for the hope of some States' players getting some licensed poker at some point in the future. However, that misguided line of reasoning by the PPA does not change that their best value has been to defend ..... however less productive their efforts to pass a federal licensing bill.

2. (+) The PPA has been a useful in channeling player discontent and delivering those messages, however ineffective it may have been in resolving those concerns.

3. (+) Entertainment value: For example, despite recent posturing that the PPA somehow caused/influenced the December, 2011 DOJ response to Reid and Kyl, it was clearly a Wire Act battle already fought and won by State Lotteries the previous September. PPA sideshow puffery and over the top boasts have been a comic foil on a regular basis over the years, the gift that just keeps giving.

4. (Neutral) The PPA has not had any negative effect on States' moving to legalize online gaming, despite years of campaigning against States' rights to regulate online gaming. It is incredible that the PPA recently tried to take credit for jump-starting State interests, ignoring historical opposition and rabid, frothing-at-the-mouth posts about the evils of lotteries and State-level development of a legal framework and multi-state compacts.
DonkeyQuixote is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 06:50 PM   #11
Percival
journeyman
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Lost Wages
Posts: 321
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

I don't agree Don. Ultimately, the PPA claims to represent the players' best interests. But it can't do this when it either minimizes or criticizes consumer concerns.
Percival is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 06:53 PM   #12
knircky
veteran
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 2,097
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Poker players wine, don't do anything and don't support the PPA. What do they expect?
knircky is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 07:18 PM   #13
Go Get It
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Doesn't have a leg to stand on.
Posts: 12,427
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by knircky View Post
Poker players wine, don't do anything and don't support the PPA. What do they expect?
Profit?
Go Get It is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 07:23 PM   #14
ChicagoRy
 
ChicagoRy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: ColoradoRy
Posts: 20,493
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Without a lot of player support, and in a field where the casinos are the big dogs and are running a "It's us or nobody" campaign that is so often against player interests, I think the only thing out of whack is the expectations that so many give the PPA.

Expecting the PPA to get massive changes done themselves is like expecting the Charlotte Bobcats to win the NBA Championship, when the playoffs are a very big accomplishment.

The PPA is outmanned, outspent, outlobbied by orgs that stand to benefit a lot more from legislation. At least the PPA's interests often align with the players, and it's clear that the PPA actually listens to players.

The best the better spent interests of the casinos can do, is make fake grassroots orgs to pretend to garner player support. And these are casinos that will run online poker one day in the USA, you would think they would have MORE incentive to get to know and establish a stronger relationship with the community.

For those reasons, I vote yes.
ChicagoRy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 07:39 PM   #15
banonlinepoker
banned
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,338
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

They wanted us to believe that online poker could be legalized without bringing it to the Mainland. Didn't quite work out.
banonlinepoker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 07:51 PM   #16
mightytiny
adept
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 755
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Sorry I am reminded of the medical industry...the last thing they "cured" was polio. After that, the industry developed so you would continually need medicine to live with the condition.

I think the primary goal of the PPA now is the survival of the PPA...just my opinion
mightytiny is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 07:56 PM   #17
SuperRu
adept
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,084
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

The PPA does well with the resources they have and with what the players are willing to do. I vote yes.
SuperRu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 08:03 PM   #18
robot_dox
centurion
 
robot_dox's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2013
Location: spinning like fresh milk
Posts: 181
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

The problem is they are trying to work within the system in a corrupt country where they have no chance of getting their demands met. It would be more effect to spend their time/energy working without the system, either in an effort to bring it down or just ignoring it entirely & not pretending it is legitimate.
robot_dox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 08:15 PM   #19
dankhank
dankest of hanks
 
dankhank's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: for me the action is the juice
Posts: 8,094
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

I paused for more than a second before voting, but I voted yes. The main reason is this: for me, TheEngineer is the face of the PPA. And long before Black Friday, shortly after UIGEA, prior to the real impact of these laws being felt, when nearly every poker player was uninvolved and apathetic, TheEngineer stepped up and lead the troops on 2+2, and he has remained in that role ever since. I respect that.
dankhank is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 08:35 PM   #20
Used2Play
grinder
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 694
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

Wish there was a "neutral" choice. That is what I would have selected...
Used2Play is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 09:18 PM   #21
DaycareInferno
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
DaycareInferno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 18,279
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

I don't. Not in dead horse kinda mood today tho.
DaycareInferno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 09:22 PM   #22
prescottburgess
grinder
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 672
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

I joined the PPA several years ago but I no longer support them. I do not want them to use my name as a "signature". How do I unjoin?
prescottburgess is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 09:30 PM   #23
grenzen
veteran
 
grenzen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,403
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

I voted no. After I joined I realized they are simply an online gambling lobby, using online poker as the face of their efforts. Yeah, I would also unjoin if that info is posted.
grenzen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 09:43 PM   #24
OklaHustler
adept
 
OklaHustler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 819
I vote NO for to many reasons to list....oh yeah and **** Skallagrim, that ******* thought answering questions of there ineffectiveness with pure sarcasim and snarky bs remarks soon after BF hit....idiot
OklaHustler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2013, 09:57 PM   #25
noobpoker
grinder
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: noobtown
Posts: 574
Re: do you have a favorable opinion of the PPA?

honestly the saddest part is that the best representative we could get was fossilman. dont get me wrong he's a nice guy, but the face of legalizing online poker should not be jabba the hutt..

while i dont have an opinion of the PPA, i can understand how hard it must be to lead people (let alone poker players ). its just that time and time again they've done really silly/dumb things, like calling for photoshops of sheldon adelson(as opposed to constructing a substantive platform of debate where they would easily win), or losing their cool and attacking posters. very split on the ppa.
noobpoker is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:50 PM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive