#showers talk sushi and MMA lol QFT


Other things to remember:

- You may want to talk about kale smoothies and meditation, and how great/ a charitable person you are, and how you found yourself while on a hike in the mountains.

- Dont forget to tell everyone that you had a piece of X boss who won X tournament and how theyre your boi. Make sure to act big time and be very selective about who youre going on dinner break with, preferably eat with X who won X tournament. Beg for swaps during said dinner.

MORE TIPS:

- Drinan drinks red wine during tournaments, so you should too. If not, you better drink something during last level. Theyre out of red? "No wonder, I DRANK IT ALL."

- Cal wore lime green glasses, so you should too. If not, make sure to pick up some kind of coloured Ray Bans.

- Wear some colourful bead bracelets to let every know you went to EDC

- Stroll into Day 2 telling everyone how hung over you are from blasting off at the strip club the night before. You saw tits? NICE.

- Loudly pronounce your DFS lineup and how X player ****ed it all up for you.

- Did you go to burning man? Yeah its so commercialized now.

- "You know X?" Yeah she owes Cal like 100k. "What about X?" Yeah hes a busto dolt - hookers and blow.

crrrrrrispy!

how did i forget a EDC and wearing a charity patch while you owe a dozen people money!!!

Can someone tell me why someone like Kessler can play these tournaments and profit? Someone like him who play online on stars probably wouldn't be able to do it right?


Also what about those players that play those epts, wpts etc? So those guys are not really doing it for a living? I assume its possible but it has to be high stakes and thus has to be like those ept, aussie million, wsop etc?

Pauly. Dude. Just forget it. Do something else with your life. All your bumps/posts are the same "why can't I make it as an MTT pro? Wait....is it even possible?" Etc

It is possible. But it's risky and not worth it anyway


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Your travel, accommodation & daily living costs away from home PLUS paying for your normal base costs [your all-year-round home rental/mortgage for example] PLUS an insurance cushion for emergencies [stolen luggage, stolen laptop, getting ill abroad]...

It is not really smart to travel the tournament circuit in multiple countries unless you have a sponsorship. Even the sponsored players are swapping bits of themselves as a cushion for when they have that one, two, three year dry spell.

IMO there's no point in playing far from home UNLESS you have a huge edge of some kind. Of course if you have a steady source of income [you're a cash player, got a proper job or you're wealthy] you can hit a tournament anywhere for the amusement value & combine it with a holiday when you bust out most of the time out of the money.

However the idea of sharing the risk with other players of long periods of losing/min-cashes fills me with horror. Relying on other poker players to fill your empty cup when they bink a tourney is a recipe for massive disappointment

theres no way Kessler makes a real living at mtts.....to succeed you need to win and I never hear of him winning anything.....a bunch of min cashes = failure in mtts

Yea 3 million in winnings, several top 10 and a few first = failure.

I am all for a good Kessler troll when appropriate but don't talk out of your ass. Makes you look ridiculous.

How does this man not have a Wikipedia page??

Kessler, Gus Hansen, Patrik Antonius; Chris Moneymaker, Greg Raymer, Peter Eastgate and most other WSOP Main Event winners; etc, etc, etc. have been net losers in live MTTs since their one big win. Most live MTT regs and so-called "pros" cannot beat the rake and expenses enough to make a living, and need other source of funds to keep taking shots at multiple reentry donkaments, such as staking or being profitable enough at cash games.

At the time I did this article on players from the WPT leaderboards, with stats from Season XII, Kessler had won $548K on that circuit, in 114 tournaments. He was second in the number of cashes and fourth in the number of tournaments entered, but that was only cashing for $4.8K/per tournament entered, on a circuit where many if not most of the events in the first dozen seasons were $5K and above.

lol im talking out my ass but your equating cashes with profit....righttttt

If you're going to name names, you might want to make sure you're doing so accurately. I have about 2.5M in wins since the 2004 main event, and I assure you my buyins have not totaled anywhere near that number.

Cheers, Greg Raymer (FossilMan)

might as well mention the buyin totals too

Not to mention that Eastgate made two EPT final tables and then quit poker fulltime about a year and a half after winning the main.

It's funny because his point is correct but some of the names are not.

Read the sad article about Eastgate's addiction and gambling degeneracy that led him to quit playing poker until I saw him at WSOP-C Tbilisi in March. You can also see the huge losses of many known live MTT pros when Sharkscope and WSOP used to include the buy-ins instead of just very misleading cashes.

You can also see an interesting sample of data the 130+ pros who played 50+ tournaments during the 2011-12 WSOPs that was put together by the German site PokerOlymp. Those were the years the WSOP was publishing entry lists for tournaments and a couple of enterprising programmers scraped the PDFs to build databases of buyins (for some reason, the WSOP stopped publishing the entry lists in 2013).

The database QuadJacks put together had both buyins and cashes, but the buyin-only wsopdb.com is still online.

The PokerOlymp piece is in German, but the chart at the end is easy enough to understand, even if you don't deutsch sprechen. If you exclude the outlier $1M Big One for One Drop from both buyins and winnings, there are 136 players with a total of 7,926 entries. Just over 30% of them turned a profit over the two year span. 14% made a 100% profit or better. 6% made better than 200% profit.

Might also check out my writeup of the Main Event prop bet Limon put together last year.

I think you should update your location to :



as well just to be sure. Better safe than sorry

After reading that article, I'm not sure if I'm happy or sad for him.

Tables that quote 'lifetime cashes' or 'lifetime winnings' are completely misleading. It doesn't take into account buy ins. Unfortunately, most people are too stupid and take these tables at face value.


For example, Negreanu has ~$20 million in cashes, but when you take into account all the buy ins he would have paid (had he paid 100% of all the buy ins by himself), I reckon he would be negative lifetime earnings. Same goes for many other tournament players. It's like a cash game player only quoting the pots he won, but ignoring the ones he lost - you would never do that, so why do the same for tournaments? This is the point that Eastgate was trying to make in his interview - there is such a lack of information, it's unclear who is actually in profit and by how much.


The poker world is full of smoke and mirrors. Behind all the sponsorships, staking and misleading graphs, the vast vast majority of players lose money or break even, and the ones who do make money are making far less than people think. Most so-called "crushers" are staked and in a ****load of make-up.

#hottake

You're insane. How about that?

Could write a very different article with a very similar title.

Why you'll never make a living playing poker if live poker tournaments didn't exist.

Almost all new players are attracted to poker by the dream of the life changing tournament cash. And truth be told no matter how much fun is made of them the fact that so many cash game poker pro's rock up at the main event every year is proof that the dream never quite disappears no matter how disillusioned you may be with tournament poker.

To the point of the article though I think there is enough evidence that live tournament poker is beatable - but hell - it takes a special kind of person to maintain the on and off table discipline required day after day, year after year, bad beat after bad beat. If you that dedicated a person, there are probably easier and more enjoyable ways to make your money.

Fair enough I didn't know about how bad it was. Though technically it wasn't MTTs that turned him into a net loser.

so much wrong here. lol. tournaments do almost nothing for pro poker players, some of us played before the boom, the games were just fine thank you and we stacked piles or mounds or whatever the kids are calling it nowadays. My hourly would go UP (dramatically) if all tournaments ceased to exist.

I came up with a pretty easy equation that can be used to show most tourney ballers are making no real money. Just take their ROI in tournaments CASHED and apply a realistic ITM% for a "top pro" (around 20%).

And don't forget that tournament rake has probably doubled at most non-WSOP venues since the 2004 boom. So that's even more money that never makes its way to the cash tables, and also making tournaments harder to beat.