absolutely

Does anybody have a clue if/what sort of legal action can be taken here?

[3:05:42 AM] Nick Frame: yeah
[3:05:43 AM] Nick Frame: fwiw
[3:05:49 AM] Nick Frame: jungle knows weve been looking into this
[3:05:51 AM] Nick Frame: as does sauce
[3:06:01 AM] josé maria macedo: yea
[3:06:20 AM] Nick Frame: and NoahSD
[3:06:28 AM] Nick Frame: and i believe geeforce was pmd by matt todayy

Is this accurate noah?

This makes Jungle/DiH look super shady. Why is it that Jungle/DiH wanted to live with Girah so bad???

There definitely has to be some sort of legal action these guys can take. No way somebody can blatantly steal, then just pay everything back and make everything 'okay' without facing some sort of legal consequences. Sorry is not enough.

No he's definitely Portuguese, as in there's no doubt about it. He went to St. Julian's which is an international school for rich/smart kids where everybody speaks perfect English. So he's not going to have much of an accent being exposed to the English language every single day for the past 10 years or whatever. Plus, Cascais (where he lives) is a bit of an international area, and he's definitely got more international friends (assuming he's got any left and didn't scam the **** out of anybody that ever liked, respected and trusted him) than Portuguese friends.

Hopefully people can stop commenting on his English now, and why it's so 'suspiciously' flawless.

As for this whole mess, it's unreal. Unreal, and entertaining as hell. Reading those chat logs I couldn't help but feel a bit sorry for him, at that point he must've realized he was ****ed. He's probably crying his eyes out right now and must be contemplating suicide. I can't believe how someone so intelligent could mess up this badly, you'd think he'd be able to construct a more, I don't know, less disgustingly obvious masterplan. It's probably an age thing, and there's no doubt in my mind this kid will continue to try and cheat and scam people for the rest of his life, and his scams will only get more and more sophisticated. What is it people say, once a cheater, always a cheater?

Should be interesting to see what DIH has to say, considering he seems to be a bit of a disgusting lowlife as well. I kind of doubt jungleman had anything to do with this, although he might've known about it, I mean the guy seems like a bit of a pussy (judging by the interviews I've seen), so even if he knew he probably didn't have the balls to do anything about it.

I hope no one ever trusts this kid again.

His apology is clearly bull**** - his chat logs prove that the only thing he's sorry about is getting caught, not his actions. He actually has the balls to beg them not to make this public by citing his disappointed mama and the damage it would do to his reputation. Anyone who believes a word of his self-serving post is just foolish.

Just another young, entitled punk who thinks that rules are for suckers and other people who cares only about himself. I feel sorry for his future victims, of which I'm sure they'll be plenty - he's already demonstrated himself to be an unethical scumbag at such a young age that a lifetime of scamming people and running angles seems like a lock.

lol.

"don't ruin my life guys!". i feel like whatever the poker community can do to Jose is nowhere near what would happen to him in the real world, e.g. going to jail.

i find this person to be the most disgusting kind of human on the planet. as someone who was robbed by the ultimate bet superusers, i can say that what Jose did is even worse. Trying to hustle, cheat and steal from the people who had helped him improve as a player, boasting about it to the community to bolster his rep, it makes me totally sick that such a person exists.

I'm surprised "Papa Bear" wasn't able to guide him away from such madness.

sick find

Edit: look at date of post

Gentlemen,

Thank you kindly for the abbreviated version of the other thread, it is very much appreciated. The other thread became a very tiresome read as it degenerated into a soapbox for, well, quite a few people of visibly below average intelligence.

I feel terrible for everyone involved, from those who've suffered financially, to those who publicly and privately naively supported Mr.Macedo. I cannot begin to imagine how badly this has hurt those who trusted him, believed in him and befriended him only to find out months down the line that he was nothing more than deceiving con artist. Financial loss is one thing, and is apparently going to be dealt with, but being stabbed in the back by what you perceived to be a friend is certain to leave a residual mark on these people going forward. Reputations have been put on the line for this man and they will suffer due to their association with him going forward, and I truly do feel sorry for those who were naive enough to publicly associate themselves with him.

I do not believe this to be a forgivable "mistake" by Mr.Macedo. Young, naive people, and especially young men, do stupid things. That is a fact and most of the time these silly things can be forgiven and forgotten about. In this case, it was in no way a "mistake". It was malicious deceit over a wide span of months based on taking advantage of these young guys kindness and human side for his own financial gain. If anything, it is akin to the acts of Mr.Bernie Madoff, a man who was both loved and trusted in his circles before it was exposed that he had been destroying them financially behind their back all along.

As such, I don't believe a mere apology and "compensation" is appropriate, as Mr.Macedo is extremely likely to go forth and rip people off again. Indeed, I think it would be most appropriate if those involved with him gathered facts, worked with PokerStrategy and Lock Poker to gain more information and presented the evidence to the Portuguese police so that he may be tried under the law of the land and brought to justice.

If it were a once off, desperate act, then it would be forgivable. However, such a cruel and calculated act sustained over months should be punished correctly.

On a separate note, I don't believe that this event and its discussion should be used or seen as an opportunity for the anti-online poker crowd to voice their mantras about coaching sites, HeadsUp Display software, results tracking sites or similar. As such, I would urge those considering posting such tripe to just not do so. It rendered the other thread unreadable. Similarly there is no grounds to support the theory that there is some form of high stakes scamming ring in operation, asserting such at this time is completely unproductive and off-topic.

Once again, thank you for posting the short version of the events that have been uncovered, along with the relevant chat logs. I look forward to following this as it unfolds, however I do so in hope that this thread does not degenerate as the last one did.

Finally, and once again, my sympathies to all involved. I hope everyone gets repaid and that the only residual cost is a few bruised egos.

Cordially,
ANobleGent

IDD

if jungle/sauce are in fact involved in this mess at a deeper level (as implicated by the suspiciously self banned gregorio), they are likely the ones who tipped off jose that moss and the boiz were suspicious and investigating him, which prompted him to come forward with his "confession" via skype at the extremely suspicious/peculiar time that he did

I approached Jungle 4 or 5 days ago about this. He said he agreed it looked weird, and would look into it. I didn't speak with Haseeb before he entered our skype chat and said what was pasted in this topic already.

As for the tipping off; Nick brought it up with Jose, Haseeb joined the conversation and they spoke in a skype call (I think). Neither Daniel or Haseeb tipped Jose off as far as I know.

Also, I just want to add that Daniel seems like a stand-up guy and I doubt he's involved in the multi-accounting that seems has taken place, but I don't know anything more than what's been posted. That's just my interpretation of how he's acted and what's happened.

So if I am to understand correctly...
A few HS guys created a fictional character, than brought it to life, and exploited the **** out of it for personal gain?
Pretty brilliant if you ask me. Scummy and wrong for sure. Still, not so easy to conceive a scheme like this from scratch, and dupe an entire community.

One thing that I get that doesnt make a lot of sense is that Girah if he is in fact a great high stakes player, WHY would u ever say that you are willing to LEAVE poker for GOOD. Surely even though one's reputation is ruined, going onto another site like pokerstars and beating 10/20nl or something for well more than his "2k monthly living expenses" would mean something.

Of course, if he wasn't all that great of a player and was merely someone built up and had a well established reputation so that others could play on his account then it would make a lot more sense to try to keep things private so the high stakes players would not be revealed and his own personal reputation would have more value than continuing to play poker.

I dont believe that dogishead or possibly even Jungleman ever intended on Girah scamming others. However I do believe that they may have vouched for Girah in order to use his account from time to time to get action. It is also disturbing to consider that Girah has 80 students who were being charged money for coaching services and this was likely known by DIH as well...

Ugh, reading those chatlogs left me feeling weirdly very uncomfortable and voyeuristic

At this stage of the game, anyone who doesnt believe they were all in on it, is either willfully blind, or smoking too much weed.

Maybe he can find some poster on his wall, or inspirational quote from his Mum, to keep going.

omfg

thanx for ur answere. the impression i got from the logs was, that girah himself brought it up:
[12:36:37 AM] josé maria macedo: you here?
[12:36:43 AM] Nick Frame: ye
[12:36:58 AM] josé maria macedo: got a confession and need to sell action too
[12:37:06 AM] josé maria macedo: so basically
[12:37:13 AM] josé maria macedo: theres a really rich kid in the private school i go to

After reading gregorio's post, a Very respected self banned mod, for those that don't know him (I'll post it again because I think it's significant) I'm starting to go with my gut that Girah may have been a pawn in a much bigger scam.

I wouldn't be surprised if he acted on his own with regards to what was revealed today but the writing is on the wall that there's a lot more to this story than just him scamming some people out of 45K

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...postcount=1540

My guess is more like they were somewhat scammed by him into thinking he was the real deal, but also wanted to promote him for their own purposes and so were pretty easily duped. And that he's probably a super-charmer in the way only a true sociopath/*rich kid always looking for a shortcut in life* can be.

Jose contacted me first, and he said he had a confession (I believed what tipped him off what the fact that dollarman account was under investigation by merge and they requested documents). We had that long chat convo that was posted. Then Haseeb and Jose called me on skype and Haseeb was filled in as to what was going on. Haseeb seemed to not have a clue as to what was going on with this. Then the following day Haseeb told us that after our skype call he pressed Jose for more information because he felt the evidence against him was pretty bad. Jose then broke down and admitted to Haseeb there was cheating.

h/o I'll get chat logs.


[8/4/2011 10:58:50 AM] DOG: but here's the bottom line, i spoke to jose and nick and nick told me all of the evidence, and jose of course denied any and all allegations
[8/4/2011 10:58:54 AM] DOG: well listen
[8/4/2011 10:59:20 AM] DOG: after i got off the phone with them we agreed that we'd need to look at HH's for conclusive proof since it'd pretty much confirm or deny any superusing claims
[8/4/2011 10:59:26 AM] DOG: cuz jose siad he could get them
[8/4/2011 10:59:42 AM] DOG: after i get off the phone, i talk to jose privately and confront him, because i felt like the evidence against him was pretty strong
[8/4/2011 11:00:03 AM] DOG: and after some strongarming, he confesses to the cheating and starts crying and ****
[8/4/2011 11:00:21 AM] DOG: now obviously i'm telling you guys this in confidence and this should not be leaving this skype chat until everything is resolved
[8/4/2011 11:01:03 AM] DOG: but basically he admitted to the cheating. he gave me some details about it but i cuoldn't get a lot out of him because he was acting pretty delirious