In hindisght it's amazing pokerstars actually had segregated player fund's imo. And yeah very naive of us to trust a bunch of poker pros with our money.

Pokerstars and Amayastars are two very different beasts.

Full Tilt was a circus. It was all about watching the company owners throwing their customers money to each other at the nosebleed tables.

Absolutely this. There is way too much hate for Chris here.

Hope he goes b2b for POY.

Jesus Christ!

Hi Fletch:

Your point is correct but in this case keep in mind that the US Attorney in New York who handled this case tried very hard to come up with charges against Lederer and others, and that never happened. So it makes me think that fraud was not committed.

I would like to hear what others think of this idea.

Best wishes,
Mason

Thanks for your contribution to this thread. Like any other poker player in 2009 wouldn't accept the same red pro deal if presented to them? What more do you want from me I acknowledged it was a cushy deal? ...Until it wasn't, because my money (and time lost chasing this fools's gold) got siphoned by the government and/or Bitar/Lederer/Ferguson's bank account with all their extravagant dividends they gave themselves and kept without remorse. I say without remorse because did you watch that Ferguson video?

And to address TheFly

I've been over it for a long time but seeing his smug insincere face telling me everyone got paid back and he was "so sorry" just really rubbed me the wrong way and brought it back.

My loss was mid-five figures. Enough money to matter to me but not enough to ruin my life. It's angering knowing he pocketed a huge amount of ill-gotten money out of it and seeing so many people defending him about it. Until he puts his money where his mouth is and returns that money back to some of the chunks of people who didn't get reimbursed (yeah right, never happening, I know), he can shove it about how sorry he really is because I don't want to hear it -- it's meaningless drivel lip service. I've had many people who weren't even red pros reach out to my twitter posts today saying they didn't get paid over things like wearing a ftp patch at a wsop final table (which FTP paid them on their account). No wonder the poker world has scammers everywhere....Chris doesn't deserve any of this ire, he was innocent in all of this...?

@Schneids,

serious question here. what if Jesus gave a substantial (7 figure) donation to a charity in the name of poker (fighting hunger, homelessness, etc.) as a gesture of goodwill? did something positive with a portion of his ill-gotten net worth ...

would this make you feel any differently about the man?

All fair points Schneids, and if I'd lost in the neighborhood of ~$50K I'd still be salty too. I was under the impression when Stars bought FTP out, and with the help of DOJ, arranged for the payout of everyone's account balances that most were made whole. I know I received a check for my account balance after filling out the necessary online paperwork. I just assumed not many were stiffed since that was the whole point of the Stars buyout, right??

In any event, I think the point some people are making is Chris was probably furthest away from the horrible business decisions to dip into player funds for shareholder bonuses, ongoing operations, etc. Doesn't mean he doesn't have any culpability, but the vile hatred may be better placed at more appropriate people who actually authorized these decisions and perhaps even covered them up to the rest of the shareholders.

I always thought Fergusen was the pro who had the most say of how things were handled. With Lederer the only one close to the same power. so **** him imo

Again, you didn't read his post in post #5 of this thread.

Quoting it below because the internet is hard, and also bolding the part that is clearly relevant to your confusion.

Even a player like myself, a decent % of my $9k balance I had left on the site come black friday would have been accounted for from my regular rakeback deal.

not sure if your responding to me or not. That has nothing to do with I said/meant. I'm talking the way Tilt was handled that led the problems in the first place.

no, hes obviously just getting set to run for president in 2020

Given the difficult nature of being able to personally connect with anyone/everyone still missing their FTP balance, yes, I would accept this. I can't speak for anyone else who feels robbed, but for me, that would be enough to say ok I believe you're sorry and forgive you.


Sure it very well can be he was clueless about it all and his only real fault was being ignorantly uninformed about how the company was ran and where the money was coming from that was padding his bank account (by the multi, multi millions) -- yet, until the full story comes forward, I'm going to follow the money and he was near the very top of the list of who benefited financially from FTP. Him, Lederer, and Bitar all deserve plenty of ire to go around from those of us who got the shaft from their ponzi site.

friggin robot....please don't harass me this year at the wsop

indeed. a gesture like this would go a long long way in the poker community imo.

as you allude to, making remaining victims whole isn't practicle. but making a 7 figure donation to charity (in the name of poker) is doable.

the ball is in your court Jesus. how sincere are you for what transpired under your watch? step up and do the right thing. create a positive poker related headline before the WSOP kicks off May 29th.

Guys I said I was sorry what more do you want from me? You invested in me and my buddies so we could play high stakes and live lavish lifestyles.

meh, thats like bankers making billions and then paying a $100 million fine. BFD. If he actually was actually culpable its ****ing meaningless, and if he wasn't it's just extortion.

Grreg Raymer, Doyle Brunson, Phil Hellmuth, Mike Sexton, are all respected and been around the pokerworld forever and all stand behind Ferguson. I think that means something.
Theres noway someone like Ferguson and Lederer decided to just screw everybody over.

Those 2 guys lived poker, were heavily involved in the poker scene, had fans and had liives, and were super super rich. I highly doubt they just decided to scam the pokerworld one day. I Think they both have bad people skills and how they present themselves but to blame them so much is outrageous. I think Chris is a huge victim.
The mistakes that were made werent his fault.

if i had to bet my networth id bet Brnson and Hellmuth know exactly who is at fault but sworn to never tell, on Chris behalf.

So, if you are going to apologize for losing tens of millions of dollars of other players money at best negligently, at worst, fraudulently, you should probably not sound like a tour guide.

^Russ Hamilton was also heavily involved in poker.

When the face of the poker site even shadier than FTP stands up for the face of FTP, that's quite the vindication for Ferguson.

I'd rather him just admit that he ****ed us. "Haha yeah sorry about that guys, my b." At least then I'd feel like he's being honest.

i love chris. he can cut watermelons with cards. hot women feed him fruit salad too. what a legend!!!

No, just about right