If the guy who has the video is legit, he can just pm joey on instagram, twitter, YT, or e-mail him and figure out a way to get the video to him. No need for BIG.

What I have been telling your and others for years is that a new paradigm shift might arises that FORCE sites and players to work together in this regard thus bring back much value to the industry as a whole. And I have been other player about how emerging poker site busimodles and their technology is soon allowing this.

Is there someone you have passionately try to show you something, so important, that you ARE looking for, that you refuse to give the time of day to?

Maybe your eyes closed, maybe heart head is not open, maybe you need to use a more proper definition of GTO and actually get into the nitty gritty of it rather than just papi this and papi that GTO ya!?

I had been thinking alot recently that we were due for a donkament scandal and seems like that might be part of it, i cant remember the last big one. multiaccounting/ghosting/collusion/etc etc. I was honestly expecting some big scandal from stars to emerge

i bet there is alot of collusion in live mtt's too, all the way up to the highest stakes.
the backing/swapping stables can be shady af, greedy af, and thirsty af.

The stronger conjecture is bots will be undetectable.

I think rather you are missing nother conject that humans will tend toward GTP more than ever before because of emerging software. Not further.
When Joey who doesn't know what GTO is, he has no basing for identify these future pots you need both analysis and based on a GTO approximation.

I think you have mad cotratpoints and return to my conject 'bot will be undectable'

@joey, in regard to the use of the world "GTO" Wil Tipton seems to have a revant different explanation:

So he is literally saying we need a least a good understand of GTO to recognize it. This observation goes completely against the crux of this thread.

Can you refute that observation please?

All HH #s and names will certainly be hidden. Those were the terms I agreed to with him. He says the video is years old so IDK if those hands can even be pulled up anymore. He also mentioned the video is about a server-side issue so this could be a death punch if true.

Not to spam here but worthy of a post.

I created the "Bots in SNG games" thread in the WPN sub-forum. Yesterday the Belarus bots mentioned in my thread were nowhere to be seen and they play literally 24hrs/day. This would be the longest break they took since they joined Q4 last year. They are not in play today.

The Russian bots in my post were playing yesterday and I have not seen them this entire day. So both bot rings who play 24hours/day are not in play today.

You are doing gods work Joey. Maybe you already triggered something.

The graphs/images posted ~100 posts back look like they are ~10NL if my math is right. If the alleged accounts are operated by the same bot on an 8 hour shift, essentially playing for 24 hours straight, even considering varying room traffic patterns, 600k hands in a month seems reasonable.

That 8.5 bb/100 winrate doesn't seem like much @10NL, but 85 cents per 100 hands adds up.

~$5300 pre-rakeback over 600k+ hands
$12,600 raked x 60% rakeback (might be low estimate with high-level VIP) = ~$7500

That's ~$13,000/month, or ~$150,000/year. Programming a computer network to beat $10 max buy-in No Limit Texas Hold'em cash games on the internet. Damn.



Joey, thanks for posting the video. I only have anecdotal evidence, but I found myself nodding along with your description of value bets on the river - against a normal person you win some & you lose some but on this site there just seems to be some accounts that never get the money in bad on the river. Or maybe I just suck.

Superusing, of course, is a possibility. This is just pure speculation, but is the ACR software old? Seems like old software would be ripe with exploitable vulnerabilities re: the RNG, etc.

Collusion between bots is probably more likely. As others mentioned, with "anonymous" crypto-funded accounts, one could VPN multiple laptops with accounts, etc. and end up with many accounts at the same table. It's not that unusual for regs from across the world to battle each other on multiple tables at once, so cover is good.

Even with verified documents required for withdrawal, there appear to be a myriad of ways you can easily get around this and "consolidate" funds into one account to withdraw.

This stuff gives the great game of poker a bad name. Having played in a live game where I witnessed cheating, as well as seeing some interesting things while playing online for over a decade, I'm left wondering: are there any actual "honest" poker games? (What does honest mean anyways?) I'd like to believe this is the case, but as I get older, the more the answer appears to be "no"

This is exactly how I feel. Anyone that has played a bunch of PLO on the site will understand exactly what I am talking about with an unnatural dynamic. I would imagine that some tweaks will be made in whatever is going on and that will probably become apparently pretty quickly if so. Once I started paying hyper attention to this, I would note the players who a natural dynamic were in place with and also observe them against these accounts. It is just the strangest ****ing thing and really got into my head. Every player I know IRL I have a very authentic dynamic with them. You win some, they win some when you're both near the top of your bluff catch range, they try to make a play and end up having to fold, etc. etc. I'm not really sure how else to explain it, but the dynamic between players on the untracked American sites and ACR are like two different worlds. I have heard from some other players that I respect a lot that they've felt similar in other game formats.

I thought the only ppl that still play online poker are Site owners, colluders, bot runners, and players so addicted they can't stop no matter how much they lose.

Victim blaming with a first post. Nice.

some of us make money doing this...

Joey it's time to lay off the Cannabis. Paranoia is one of the side affects, maybe reduce your usage to once a week or less.

It's far more likely that your computer is infected with Malware than a superuser existing on ACR. Maybe start by formatting your computer and making sure your network is secure.

Botting and collusion are standard across all sites. Some of the names of the accused are laughable and deformation without concrete evidence is not a nice thing for someone to endure, it could also be enough for any user accused to seek legal action.

You should apologise to ACR and the names of people accused by other users of ACR when you get clean.

Why is that guy with the cat avatar so hung up on someone's usage of the acronym 'GTO'? Here's a new one for ya: STFU

This.

Also to add to the topic; if all else fails and we see the death of online poker due to the robot invasion we can always get out of our parents basements and go to the casino.

Enough of the deformation talk no ones getting sued. Fun shill post

Bear in mind that those people telling you that you shouldn't give a **** about poker because no one else gives a **** about poker, are exactly the people who don't give a **** about poker.

I'm sure that you're close to many excellent poker players, but perhaps you should choose to be close to more excellent people instead.


“Knowing what’s right doesn’t mean much unless you do what’s right.”

- Franklin Roosevelt

https://youtu.be/B4UEj9Znxng?t=48m45s

He loves it.

ive played 600 hands with 44bars at plo and have never suspected anything. He has berated me after hands so hes obviously a human. Ive played shorthanded with him when I know (through the grapevine, not personally) who the other players are. Ive also played hu with him. Hes down a chunk im database so if hes cheating hes not doing it very well. All these particular accusations are a bit out of line. No one is doubting that collusion and botting is occurring but calling out specific people with nothing more than a hunch is a bit out of line

BTW of all 630 hands I have on him only a very few contain hands with createmyownenergy and none with greenspirit

I would just make all the Eastern European "grinders" stream on webcam. Wouldn't take long to clean up the mess.

Thanks for signing up if only just to admit the massive amount of ignorance you have.

In this case doing what's right means getting the **** out of poker. Literally everything about online poker is just aids. There's no denying it. There's not even a hint that it's going to change for the better. How many poker pros with morals have fought the good fight and won? None. They've all resigned sponsorships and or left the poker world. And the poker industry just keeps on getting shadier.

At this point Joey is a fool for staying around for so long despite having insider knowledge about the state of the games. He's clearly made more than enough money to pursue whatever he wants outside of poker... so why the hell is he still playing for a living?

The sooner he gets out the better off he will be.

Listen, I realize Joey has a lot of "GTO" fanboys, that I guess probably also don't understand the significance of my point, but he also has a lot of influence in the community.

I already posted about a quote by a respected author that explains we use GTO to assess our opponents play. If Joey doesn't understand what GTO means, he isn't able to assess them, and then this thread is not an exposay but rather a political/market stunt for Joey and he gets TWO thread in NVG rather than his obligatory one.

Telling me to "STFU" doesn't really change the obvious point, Joey isn't technically capable of detecting bots, he simply doesn't realize he is not. If so, he is sort of abusing his celeb status and creating buzz marketing.

And for all this and the past fiasco's he was involved in, I'm more inclined to think he's done some boardline stuff on the table's and just also willing to call out others for doing the same stuff. Like your girlfriend accusing you of cheating when really she just feels guilty.

This thread is not good for game. It's bad for the game. It's immoral poker, not based on a proper understanding what game theoretically optimal poker ACTUALLY means and how it is to be used.

If I were wrong, it would be quite easy for Joey to explain what GTO means and how it applies (as I already did with my citation). I don't think he will though, because I think he knows I am right. Or we could have some well established pros and coaches confirm or deny what I am suggesting.

This thread is a wild accusation and there are tangible efficient changes to the game and community that he/we could ACTUALLY bring awareness to and spend energy on. If I am wrong, by all means refute me, this is after all a forum, but I think that should be enough with the ad hominems.

^^^

Dude, if you've ever listened to a single episode of Big Papi's podcast, you'd know that he doesn't use "GTO" literally as in meaning nash equilibrium unexploitable.

GTO is just a saying and a way of life. Here are some examples to illustrate:

-Bro, my girlfriend is GTO. She's letting me spend all weekend grinding PLO and is even bringing me some McDonalds on her way home from work so I don't have to leave the apartment

-Chad is a GTO drinker. He can pound 12 beers and still be grinding at the gym by 8am the next day

-Hey man, what garbage computer chair do you have there? Everyone knows the IKEA Markus is GTO. You gotta upgrade it will change your life

I have watch some of his vids. I watched the one where dnegs sold to the players the lie that increasing rake is good for the game. I watched ansky rage fit about pokers *'s changes that affected HIM that year (but he ignored the changes that didn't affected him in the previous player boycoct) and then went on to get wine and dined by PS anyways finally signing an NDA so he can't talk about his trip or what was discussed on the table w/poker stars hq. I've watch him help put starregsproblems into the hot spot and let him take the heat for what seemingly obviously a seating/bumhunting/multiaccountring that many of joey's "peers" were participating in.

I could prob remember some more....

Anyways so you are a poster @Crowe Capatil that confirms Joey doesn't seem to know what GTO is, and that suggests, when I call him on it, most of the fanboys in this thread probably don't realize I am CORRECT.

It's a very important point to establish, because Joey's claims lose their credible otherwise. And then it because an immoral act in the poker world under the disguise or a moral action. Much like a PR stunt or an indirect threat. And Joey probably doesn't realize you need a proper understanding of GTO to look for bots.

Prior to this you just looked like an idiot. Now you look like a troll. Congrats