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Old 06-09-2010, 08:44 PM   #1
ElevenGrover
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The CEREUS Leaked List/Wicked Chops Poker on the UB Superuser scandal

I'm starting a new thread for this because it really has nothing to do with the Potripper situation and because there is some behind the scenes jockeying I don't fully understand.

For the record, an individual near and dear to 2p2 hearts who has a famous poker playing father and receives compensation from CEREUS sent two seperate files to Mookman containing user names, account IDs and the online screennames they were associated with.

In the files were several fake names which one might assume the cheaters created. In addition there are several names such as the Makars and Bajayo who have long since been outed on 2p2.

Finally there were a few additional names which probably would not surprise people who know Russ Hamilton. They appear to be friends and business acquaintances and seem to fit in to the puzzle. Two of those were revealed in the previous thread; Natalie DiGioia and Ron Saccavino. These folks are now allegedly cheating entities based on information provide by CEREUS; ie CEREUS is alleging they are cheaters.

We have no idea about many things concerning this list but one thing we do know is that the supplier could not have provided it to Mook with the expectation it would remain secret, hence it is an officially leaked document.

Second, we have no hard information about what the names mean. No IP or iesnare screens to back up their activity. While I applaud Haley for her efforts she seems to be suggesting she knows information about these names without providing any background on where the information is coming from. To my knowledge she got the list from Mook.

Third, I applaud Mook for continuing to struggle with this. I would imagine the threat from Ron got him thinking a little. He has stated anyone who wants the list should PM him.

The list I have seen has 22 individual names and seven names of people connected to the company with more lack of clarity why they showed up. Lyle Berman is in this second group but if anyone is ever able to pin a tail on that horse, then they have a career ahead in private dicking. Those names seem to be in the list to me just to confirm various individuals with a peripheral connection to the case who 2p2 identified from their efforts vs an actual confirmation by the company.

Its not about what you know, its about what you can prove.

Last edited by ElevenGrover; 06-09-2010 at 08:51 PM.
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Old 06-09-2010, 08:55 PM   #2
Gugel
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

so from what i gather, you claim to have seen an internal UB list with 22 alleged cheaters? there's no actual proof of cheating, it's just a list. am i missing something?
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Old 06-09-2010, 08:58 PM   #3
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

cliffs op
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:00 PM   #4
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Nope, you are exactly right. So the first question is why did UB release a partial list of cheaters with real people attached to accounts known to cheat? In the case of the one name above, the player did win a 10k aruba satty on a cheating name and did show up to play it so there is some compelling circumstantial evidence with him and another name on the list.

I think this is why the list remained confidential for so long. Nobody really understands what Cereus is trying to do with the names and well afterall they are Cereus so its hard to give them the benefit of the doubt as to their motives.
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:13 PM   #5
bigtex21
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

is the list going to made public?
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:15 PM   #6
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

So basically they outed a list of accused cheaters consisting of names already outed by 2+2 community, with the exception of a couple, and no real useful information, a summary of what we already know. I wonder how many names are missing that are still connected with Cereus, or have interests with Cereus. Throwing the 2+2 community a bone and hoping it's not hungry for more and will accept this as final findings ?
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:21 PM   #7
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

So the thing is; the list has 22 names with the KGC report saying there were 31 names. The list doesn't account for all of the screennames obviously so we are left with the fact that CEREUS outed several people previously unconnected or at least not connected directly. Most of these names are not heavy players and have businesses which might suffer under the weight of incriminations so it almost seems like a dare of some sort by the company.

Last edited by ElevenGrover; 06-09-2010 at 09:26 PM.
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:24 PM   #8
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

So, does this document Sebok sent have all 31 names?
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:24 PM   #9
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Well since I was the one the list was sent to, and I already pissed off enough people, I see no reason why I should not just post the lists. I had them since February and nothing has come of it, except me getting threatened, called untrustworthy, etc.

UB Cheaters Names Part 1

UB Cheaters Names Part 2

My Research Into the names

So Part 1 and Part 2 are the first two links. These are what was sent to me.

The 3rd link, which right now is not working properly, is my own research into the cheating names, as well as other names that have come up. It was an MS Excel document. If there is another site to post it please let me know, scribd seems to not take Excel.

I am not directly accusing anybody in the 3rd document, it is just a combination of data available by searching the internet combined with 2+2 theories. It also includes some other info that was just interesting, helpful, or people that may know something, or who could be of some help. Not all the people I have included would be guilty of any cheating
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:30 PM   #10
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

yawn
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:30 PM   #11
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mookman5 View Post
Well since I was the one the list was sent to, and I already pissed off enough people, I see no reason why I should not just post the lists. I had them since February and nothing has come of it, except me getting threatened, called untrustworthy, etc.

UB Cheaters Names Part 1

UB Cheaters Names Part 2

My Research Into the names

So Part 1 and Part 2 are the first two links. These are what was sent to me.

The 3rd link, which right now is not working properly, is my own research into the cheating names, as well as other names that have come up. It was an MS Excel document. If there is another site to post it please let me know, scribd seems to not take Excel.

I am not directly accusing anybody in the 3rd document, it is just a combination of data available by searching the internet combined with 2+2 theories. It also includes some other info that was just interesting, helpful, or people that may know something, or who could be of some help. Not all the people I have included would be guilty of any cheating
way to go mook! let's see what 2p2 can do with the great start that you provided.

just curious, why did you sit on this since Feb?
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:39 PM   #12
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Quote:
Originally Posted by woodersonp View Post
way to go mook! let's see what 2p2 can do with the great start that you provided.

just curious, why did you sit on this since Feb?
I was going to work on something with a few people. After a long time had passed, not much communication, and Haley's latest blogs that proved Paul Leggett likely lied and that the new management at UB were involved in some sort of coverup, I did not like what was going on.

I told the people I was working with I did not trust the list, and that more info was needed. After not hearing much from my source, I decided to send it to Haley since she was making the most ground. When I sent the list, it pissed of my source who then got upset with me.

Haley proved many of the names were indeed fakes.

I chose not to sit on it any longer and something needed to be done, so Haley went to work on it. This thread just made it seem logical to post, since it was coming out anyway.
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:43 PM   #13
ElevenGrover
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Quote:
Originally Posted by woodersonp View Post
way to go mook! let's see what 2p2 can do with the great start that you provided.

just curious, why did you sit on this since Feb?
I'm sure he was concerned it might piss some people off. And it did when Ron threatened to rip his ****ing tongue out.
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:43 PM   #14
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pussy Palace View Post
yawn
Hello Russ!
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:47 PM   #15
parker_posey
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

I dunno if this means anything but the name of Thomas King from List #1 has an address listed in Miami, FL which doesn't exist in a zip code code which isn't in Miami.

I assume a bunch of those addresses and phone numbers are either incorrect or ficticious, so if that's the case, then my findings don't account for ****. Sorry for wasting ur time, lol.
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:52 PM   #16
Mookman5
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

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Originally Posted by parker_posey View Post
I dunno if this means anything but the name of Thomas King from List #1 has an address listed in Miami, FL which doesn't exist in a zip code code which isn't in Miami.

I assume a bunch of those addresses and phone numbers are either incorrect or ficticious, so if that's the case, then my findings don't account for ****. Sorry for wasting ur time, lol.
No Kidding, Please Read Haley Hintze's Blog about this

http://haleyspokerblog.blogspot.com/...es-plenty.html
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Old 06-09-2010, 09:55 PM   #17
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Looks like 2p2 burned Joe down a bit too soon, this information could provide very very useful.
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Old 06-09-2010, 10:00 PM   #18
haley44
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

I miscounted by one, and if you see the format of one of those lists, you can see why. All told, I believe there are 28 names in these lists, including the two listings for Natalie Digioia. I blogged two weeks ago that the nature of these lists makes their source highly suspect, and I don't mean the person who gave them to Mook. (That's a separate item.)

The fact that the KGC and Cereus willfully included 11 obvious fakes while continuing to sit on three real names is a huge point in favor of those who believe the motive for these lists being leaked is something other than the open and complete truth in the matter.

Several of us who have been vetting these lists in recent days believe we know who the remaining three names are, though why they have been omitted from these lists remains open for conjecture. I will add here that there are at least two more names besides the three that we know about who should have been included.

As for me not naming my sources, that's correct. There are several sources I've used (at last count, nine), and I've found many ways to test the accuracy of what I've written about in recent weeks. So far my multiple sources have withstood the challenges, and I've yet to catch any of them in a willful lie.
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Old 06-09-2010, 10:07 PM   #19
ElevenGrover
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Quote:
Originally Posted by haley44 View Post
All told, I believe there are 28 names in these lists, including the two listings for Natalie Digioia
There is only 28 if you count Jim Ryan (CEO of Excapsa), Lyle Berman (poker world icon), Carolyn Heick (Fraud Manager who didn't manage fraud very well). None of these come with userIDs so it seems clear they were not intended to be counted in the list.

There are 22 names which do include a userID. UserIDs can be directly cross referenced with the KGC report to determine which accounts played on that ID.

As to names you have received outside of the list, the source will be important since naming these cheaters creates a liability. In this case that liability is squarely on Cereus shoulders since they gave the file to an employee who released it as factual.
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Old 06-09-2010, 10:20 PM   #20
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Quote:
Originally Posted by IPlayDonkaments View Post
Looks like 2p2 burned Joe down a bit too soon, this information could provide very very useful.
It sure does Barry, it sure does.
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Old 06-09-2010, 10:35 PM   #21
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Has anyone outted who the software masterminds of this grand scheme were? One thing i know for sure is it sure as hell wasn't Russ Hamiltion acting alone. He isn't even half smart enough to have done this on his own and yet everything seems to point at him. I just wonder where and who they are working for now.
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Old 06-09-2010, 10:56 PM   #22
ElevenGrover
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Correction. I was going back through the KGC report and they actually stated 23 account names. So Cereus believes this list to be the final list of the actual cheating ring accounts; except of course its 22 and the KGC says 23. So one name seems to be missing. And I have just had it pointed out to my dopey self that Russ is not on the list so that gives us 23. You know 23 is a magical number, right?

The 31 names came from a later paragraph which states
"including 31 names who were associated, to varying degrees with Russell Hamilton, the cheating accounts and/or transactions related to the cheating accounts"

Last edited by ElevenGrover; 06-09-2010 at 11:06 PM.
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Old 06-09-2010, 11:37 PM   #23
CoopDaddy1
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Mook is a genius...just sayin'.

It's incredible the amount of work he has put into this. Thank you Mook.
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Old 06-09-2010, 11:53 PM   #24
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Yup, thanks for stayin' strong Mook!
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Old 06-10-2010, 12:01 AM   #25
rookiepsu
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Re: The CEREUS Leaked List

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mookman5 View Post
The 3rd link, which right now is not working properly, is my own research into the cheating names, as well as other names that have come up. It was an MS Excel document. If there is another site to post it please let me know, scribd seems to not take Excel.
You can use zoho.com. You can sign in using a google acct if you have one, or just create a free one, then import the excel into their software and share it out.
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