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Old 10-11-2019, 07:43 AM   #76
Javoc
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Quote:
Originally Posted by bolillo420 View Post
I think more than 30% are bots. A lot of weird stuff happening to me also.

1. Various time, I go all in vs bots in mtts and when I lost, the hand will not show up in the HH.
Number 1 is what aggravates me the most because MOST of the time they win with rags and/or runner runner - this is one of the sickest things on the site, in my opinion.

edit: I'm having better win-rates on other sites now.
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Old 10-11-2019, 08:37 AM   #77
cneuy3
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

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Originally Posted by bolillo420 View Post
2.Two player from Israel all in preflop for 100bb each, deep in an MTT.

3. Same two players registered on the 25 jackpots, then they go all in with each other to play HU vs 3rd player 2-1.
They wouldn't really gain anything from this sort of supposed cheating. Especially the #3 example. They still both have to pay $25 to enter the tournament and these tournaments are winner take all so chips=$. Going up against the 3rd player with a 2-1 chip lead isn't an advantage as they still need to win the tournament 2/3rds of the time+ to breakeven or make money.
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Old 10-11-2019, 08:45 AM   #78
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

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Originally Posted by cneuy3 View Post
They wouldn't really gain anything from this sort of supposed cheating. Especially the #3 example. They still both have to pay $25 to enter the tournament and these tournaments are winner take all so chips=$. Going up against the 3rd player with a 2-1 chip lead isn't an advantage as they still need to win the tournament 2/3rds of the time+ to breakeven or make money.
Not to mention that if you play a $25 jackpot and the prize pool is only $50, you aren't gaining anything colluding with another except rakeback. Which may or may not be paid to you.
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Old 10-11-2019, 10:59 AM   #79
bolillo420
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

I get your point but the hands they play against each other are just weird. Also they are from Russia, Belarus ect... Somehow they are making it profitable.

Normally when both of them show up the rate of the jackpot being 4x or better is sick. I played like 10 the other day and 7 or 8 came up with 100 to 150 on the $25.
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Old 10-11-2019, 02:19 PM   #80
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

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Originally Posted by Javoc View Post
Number 1 is what aggravates me the most because MOST of the time they win with rags and/or runner runner - this is one of the sickest things on the site, in my opinion.

edit: I'm having better win-rates on other sites now.
The hands not showing up happens to me as well, but i'd just like to note that it happens when I win the pot just as frequently as when I lose and it isn't exclusively non US players . Also, sometimes it misses pots that are tiny. When you go to check the hand histories in the file, it is always missing a letter or character somewhere in the history, it's not always the same one. Can't explain why it happens though. ACR has tons of things that are bad about them, including obviously all the bots, but I don't think anything nefarious is going on with the HH files here.

Last edited by gdsfather; 10-11-2019 at 02:25 PM.
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Old 10-12-2019, 09:37 AM   #81
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Bots are out in force today -- I spotted a table with three bots.
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Old 10-12-2019, 01:47 PM   #82
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

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Originally Posted by Chaos_ult View Post
Bots are out in force today -- I spotted a table with three bots.
Even after their new "bot defense" of putting a few unchanging dots on the screen?
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Old 10-14-2019, 12:01 PM   #83
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

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Originally Posted by gdsfather View Post
Even after their new "bot defense" of putting a few unchanging dots on the screen?
Yes the bots are still playing. The dots only serve to make the bet sizes and pot size fonts unreadable
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Old 10-14-2019, 02:04 PM   #84
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

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Yes the bots are still playing. The dots only serve to make the bet sizes and pot size fonts unreadable
It really makes me question wth they are doing when 100 bots have already been accurately identified but have been playing for years, most at the same stake the entire time even with a big wr. Then they make this clearly ineffectual update. Definitely looks like they are just feigning interest in stopping bots by adding a few things that obviously don't work and claiming they actually are, knowing they won't.

You'd think the easiest thing to do is get rid of the list already compiled by you(thank you) and players. But even if you didn't compile the list, if they actually had a security team monitoring game these players would also be the easiest to spot. It seems clear they do not have anyone watching these games or actively want to keep them there.
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Old 10-14-2019, 02:32 PM   #85
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

I feel pretty strongly that they can't see past the first level thinking* of losing the bot rake vs actually hiring a bot detection team and therefore boosting their online profile.

The idea of growing their business through good business practice is a bit more of an abstract idea in comparison to the rake that these bots are generating. Like, they can point to the bot rake and say "Well the bots are creating this much rake. Losing them will hurt our bottom line"

It's a lot harder to quantify how much money they'll make by actually doing good things and being smart about bot detection

Personally, I believe that if they were to invest in some good personnel and marketing, they could easily become the site with the most traffic.

Last edited by Chaos_ult; 10-14-2019 at 02:35 PM. Reason: * Either that or they're being shaken down by the russian mob.
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Old 10-14-2019, 03:11 PM   #86
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Quote:
Originally Posted by gdsfather View Post
It really makes me question wth they are doing when 100 bots have already been accurately identified but have been playing for years, most at the same stake the entire time even with a big wr. Then they make this clearly ineffectual update. Definitely looks like they are just feigning interest in stopping bots by adding a few things that obviously don't work and claiming they actually are, knowing they won't.

You'd think the easiest thing to do is get rid of the list already compiled by you(thank you) and players. But even if you didn't compile the list, if they actually had a security team monitoring game these players would also be the easiest to spot. It seems clear they do not have anyone watching these games or actively want to keep them there.
100%. Actions speak volumes and they have not banned a single account in well over 5 months. It is clear that security is either completely incompetent at detecting bots or they know which accounts are bots and choose to let them stay. Seeing they did ban 4 of the over 100 accounts 5 months ago it must be the latter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos_ult View Post
I feel pretty strongly that they can't see past the first level thinking* of losing the bot rake vs actually hiring a bot detection team and therefore boosting their online profile.

The idea of growing their business through good business practice is a bit more of an abstract idea in comparison to the rake that these bots are generating. Like, they can point to the bot rake and say "Well the bots are creating this much rake. Losing them will hurt our bottom line"

It's a lot harder to quantify how much money they'll make by actually doing good things and being smart about bot detection

Personally, I believe that if they were to invest in some good personnel and marketing, they could easily become the site with the most traffic.
Phil Nagy has the time preference of a house rat. His business acumen is laughable. The longer they decide to go on defrauding players and allowing for millions of dollars to be siphoned off by the card-sharing botring the lower the chances they have to ever be the number #1 site.
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Old 10-14-2019, 06:15 PM   #87
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

So here is something that I posted in
https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/2...l#post55510785

I took last week beast table and current (around 2pm pst) and wrote a piece of software to run whatever checks we want to run.

Obviously it's not near end of the race, but I think someone who was in the top 200 most likely will be at least in the top1000 next week.
Disclaimer: I am not implying that people on this list are bots. I just present some facts.

So here you go. People from top 300 last week who are not in top 1000.
I will do this analysis later this week again. It's easy and I will be doing it every week from now on.
77 accounts from top 300 last week are not in top1000 this week

St3p04ka - last week (1) - current week >1000
Play0rleave - last week (3) - current week >1000
The Grinderr - last week (10) - current week >1000
Cherdark - last week (16) - current week >1000
Mangetsu - last week (17) - current week >1000
Omgnhlol - last week (19) - current week >1000
Ospiel888 - last week (25) - current week >1000
Wyattp - last week (38) - current week >1000
Ihasubeat - last week (39) - current week >1000
Chrisbee11 - last week (41) - current week >1000
Fazekbandi - last week (45) - current week >1000
Soreman - last week (48) - current week >1000
Vovaster - last week (57) - current week >1000
John_Mambo1 - last week (72) - current week >1000
Rakegrinders - last week (75) - current week >1000
Plshold1time - last week (82) - current week >1000
Marioncotillar - last week (83) - current week >1000
Esauplz - last week (86) - current week >1000
Movfwdjmpbkwd - last week (87) - current week >1000
Bluffing Every Hand - last week (88) - current week >1000
Johndoe12345 - last week (89) - current week >1000
Quirkel - last week (91) - current week >1000
T112913m020915 - last week (94) - current week >1000
Mementofoldi - last week (110) - current week >1000
Tom_Brady - last week (111) - current week >1000
Poppyharlow - last week (116) - current week >1000
Foxtail - last week (118) - current week >1000
Australiaonelove - last week (121) - current week >1000
Stopyellingatme - last week (124) - current week >1000
Solidmove - last week (146) - current week >1000
Chintrogdin - last week (152) - current week >1000
Luna_Bear - last week (164) - current week >1000
Kwtvs - last week (174) - current week >1000
Knotb - last week (178) - current week >1000
Disgruntled - last week (182) - current week >1000
Avatar Evan - last week (191) - current week >1000
Ironanus - last week (192) - current week >1000
Dr0p796 - last week (193) - current week >1000
Firstclan - last week (194) - current week >1000
Imperceptible - last week (205) - current week >1000
Whizkid777 - last week (209) - current week >1000
8888Rock8888 - last week (211) - current week >1000
Electrobolt3 - last week (214) - current week >1000
Floptimus - last week (216) - current week >1000
Dopeflop77 - last week (218) - current week >1000
Hsif - last week (219) - current week >1000
Mysticfj - last week (221) - current week >1000
Phenomenai - last week (226) - current week >1000
Scamp1 - last week (227) - current week >1000
Gaboo85 - last week (229) - current week >1000
Crowe10 - last week (230) - current week >1000
Alexovechkin - last week (239) - current week >1000
Beatme31 - last week (240) - current week >1000
Waffentrager - last week (242) - current week >1000
Thinkingahead - last week (243) - current week >1000
Lifesgood18 - last week (247) - current week >1000
Sbgeorgi - last week (249) - current week >1000
Thegentlemanjack - last week (252) - current week >1000
Latereg - last week (253) - current week >1000
Taino44 - last week (256) - current week >1000
Rollthedice456 - last week (262) - current week >1000
Kevinoleary - last week (264) - current week >1000
Jordanbelfort - last week (266) - current week >1000
Dagoat77 - last week (267) - current week >1000
Amo4sho - last week (268) - current week >1000
Groblegroble - last week (269) - current week >1000
Chloe113 - last week (270) - current week >1000
Pscud - last week (272) - current week >1000
Taturade - last week (275) - current week >1000
Uallinicall - last week (282) - current week >1000
Strongcoconut4 - last week (283) - current week >1000
B1aderunner - last week (285) - current week >1000
Rusty4orange - last week (293) - current week >1000
Tballer - last week (295) - current week >1000
Plamia79 - last week (296) - current week >1000
L0rdginge - last week (297) - current week >1000
Transgressor - last week (299) - current week >1000
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Old 10-14-2019, 06:29 PM   #88
niosocket
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

I ran accounts that HOG specified on the first page of this thread.

PLO_ALLEGED_BOTS = ["Crazyhooch","Hhodor","beaverr","kobretti","famili er","Lexum","SnowJohn","feralturnskin","Hyperion11 5","PortgasAceAce","I_hold_it","k4m4z","ropedancer ","gladiaTHOR1","flakeoutZzz","Tojagar","SafeBYRYN DY","fata1hand","zoltanPK","maniac115","Gefest","N YMph49","phanatik","interpidtracer","Alkea101","iB etUfoldt","Evilskill","wrestlertruth","evergreenwi n","Slackbreaker","Lincolion","pknsha","pushkan"," oddi","Zergwentape","NimbleBeck","Wishko","PotBeMy ","dikobrazzers","Illcallback","Jiraffe","TheUnlim iteD","stoicwise","aceeater","Ludoman","glowworm", "bardos11","NoDose","kr0na","FeelGod","hophey68"," scabbydog","needurnrj","Superfisher","redAppl","la zycroc","technokrat","MrLarson","Blimey","Ca11MeBa by","gloomypapa","Quakeeeeeee","homyakubiytsa","de admanshand76","rightdecision","pennyHill","Insecto r","Smart1One","Shtilter","cashbang","imPekabu","b aikal77","kigdin","Loktar","DaggerGT","klarSSon"," KyleBroflovski","dancingQQ","Besmily","temerarious 5","teslaM77","BurningManKK","wolf_DDDDOG","carrdS harrk","groundsquirrel","Gelllemar","ObeTwice","wi ldpokem0n","Toughie","Trickset","Jokers_Grin"]

PLO_ALLEGED_BOTS_NEW = ["RibaFishKKa","dashforward","DaRkDailo","TinnySun" ,"StubblyPan","betH0ven","dilemmafixer","zvezZz da"]

and got following from comparing this week and last week beast race
It looks like the UI change didn't affect majority of these accounts beside
kigdin and ropedancer

pennyhill - last week (49) - current week (127)
zvezzzda - last week (64) - current week (33)
stubblypan - last week (98) - current week (105)
ribafishkka - last week (108) - current week (270)
beth0ven - last week (127) - current week (110)
toughie - last week (160) - current week (280)
dashforward - last week (161) - current week (225)
temerarious5 - last week (280) - current week (106)
familier - last week (340) - current week (208)
dilemmafixer - last week (457) - current week (789)
tinnysun - last week (462) - current week (478)
kigdin - last week (530) - current week >1000
theunlimited - last week (548) - current week (541)
ropedancer - last week (590) - current week >1000
darkdailo - last week (781) - current week (579)
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Old 10-14-2019, 07:52 PM   #89
HandOfGod666
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Quote:
Originally Posted by niosocket View Post
So here is something that I posted in
https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/2...l#post55510785

I took last week beast table and current (around 2pm pst) and wrote a piece of software to run whatever checks we want to run.

Obviously it's not near end of the race, but I think someone who was in the top 200 most likely will be at least in the top1000 next week.
Disclaimer: I am not implying that people on this list are bots. I just present some facts.

So here you go. People from top 300 last week who are not in top 1000.
I will do this analysis later this week again. It's easy and I will be doing it every week from now on.
77 accounts from top 300 last week are not in top1000 this week

St3p04ka - last week (1) - current week >1000
Play0rleave - last week (3) - current week >1000
The Grinderr - last week (10) - current week >1000
Cherdark - last week (16) - current week >1000
Mangetsu - last week (17) - current week >1000
Omgnhlol - last week (19) - current week >1000
Ospiel888 - last week (25) - current week >1000
Wyattp - last week (38) - current week >1000
Ihasubeat - last week (39) - current week >1000
Chrisbee11 - last week (41) - current week >1000
Fazekbandi - last week (45) - current week >1000
Soreman - last week (48) - current week >1000
Vovaster - last week (57) - current week >1000
John_Mambo1 - last week (72) - current week >1000
Rakegrinders - last week (75) - current week >1000
Plshold1time - last week (82) - current week >1000
Marioncotillar - last week (83) - current week >1000
Esauplz - last week (86) - current week >1000
Movfwdjmpbkwd - last week (87) - current week >1000
Bluffing Every Hand - last week (88) - current week >1000
Johndoe12345 - last week (89) - current week >1000
Quirkel - last week (91) - current week >1000
T112913m020915 - last week (94) - current week >1000
Mementofoldi - last week (110) - current week >1000
Tom_Brady - last week (111) - current week >1000
Poppyharlow - last week (116) - current week >1000
Foxtail - last week (118) - current week >1000
Australiaonelove - last week (121) - current week >1000
Stopyellingatme - last week (124) - current week >1000
Solidmove - last week (146) - current week >1000
Chintrogdin - last week (152) - current week >1000
Luna_Bear - last week (164) - current week >1000
Kwtvs - last week (174) - current week >1000
Knotb - last week (178) - current week >1000
Disgruntled - last week (182) - current week >1000
Avatar Evan - last week (191) - current week >1000
Ironanus - last week (192) - current week >1000
Dr0p796 - last week (193) - current week >1000
Firstclan - last week (194) - current week >1000
Imperceptible - last week (205) - current week >1000
Whizkid777 - last week (209) - current week >1000
8888Rock8888 - last week (211) - current week >1000
Electrobolt3 - last week (214) - current week >1000
Floptimus - last week (216) - current week >1000
Dopeflop77 - last week (218) - current week >1000
Hsif - last week (219) - current week >1000
Mysticfj - last week (221) - current week >1000
Phenomenai - last week (226) - current week >1000
Scamp1 - last week (227) - current week >1000
Gaboo85 - last week (229) - current week >1000
Crowe10 - last week (230) - current week >1000
Alexovechkin - last week (239) - current week >1000
Beatme31 - last week (240) - current week >1000
Waffentrager - last week (242) - current week >1000
Thinkingahead - last week (243) - current week >1000
Lifesgood18 - last week (247) - current week >1000
Sbgeorgi - last week (249) - current week >1000
Thegentlemanjack - last week (252) - current week >1000
Latereg - last week (253) - current week >1000
Taino44 - last week (256) - current week >1000
Rollthedice456 - last week (262) - current week >1000
Kevinoleary - last week (264) - current week >1000
Jordanbelfort - last week (266) - current week >1000
Dagoat77 - last week (267) - current week >1000
Amo4sho - last week (268) - current week >1000
Groblegroble - last week (269) - current week >1000
Chloe113 - last week (270) - current week >1000
Pscud - last week (272) - current week >1000
Taturade - last week (275) - current week >1000
Uallinicall - last week (282) - current week >1000
Strongcoconut4 - last week (283) - current week >1000
B1aderunner - last week (285) - current week >1000
Rusty4orange - last week (293) - current week >1000
Tballer - last week (295) - current week >1000
Plamia79 - last week (296) - current week >1000
L0rdginge - last week (297) - current week >1000
Transgressor - last week (299) - current week >1000
Why are you attempting to sully the names of innocent players? You stated that was not your intention but it will have that affect. The week is not even halfway over so what is your actual intention of posting this?

You have no clue about bots and seeing that you built an absolute joke of a piece of software that doesn't surprise me. Also fresh bot accounts are constantly being made and older ones retired for unknown reasons.
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Old 10-14-2019, 08:21 PM   #90
niosocket
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

I am not claiming to know anything about bots.
I just wanted to see who is not on the beast table after the ACR update.
Because I've seen multiple accounts that were playing basically any time I decided to play and suddenly they all took vacations.

I don't know why you are so mad, but whatever.
I'd suggest to you to be a little less arrogant as it's not helping in solving issues, but it's internet so who the **** I am to tell you anything.

Peace.
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Old 10-14-2019, 08:25 PM   #91
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Quote:
Originally Posted by niosocket View Post
I am not claiming to know anything about bots.
I just wanted to see who is not on the beast table after the ACR update.
Because I've seen multiple accounts that were playing basically any time I decided to play and suddenly they all took vacations.

I don't know why you are so mad, but whatever.
I'd suggest to you to be a little less arrogant as it's not helping in solving issues, but it's internet so who the **** I am to tell you anything.

Peace.
I'm mad because I have been defrauded of thousands of dollars worth of VIP points over the past 5 months. I'm mad because I've been cheated out of hundreds of thousands of dollars by the PLO botring over the past 3 years. I'm mad because the previous software was great for multitabling and had few glitches, the new software is CPU intensive, laggy and extremely glitchy and has costed me thousands of dollars due to constant disconnects, crashes and malfunctions not to mention my volume has also decreased and I have to work many more hours to achieve the same amount of Beast points as I did on the old software. I'm mad because the employees and CEO of the Winning Poker Network are not only arrogant and deny the cheating and fraud, they also pretend that they are trying to get rid of bots and pay players correctly.
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Old 10-14-2019, 08:49 PM   #92
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Quote:
Originally Posted by HandOfGod666 View Post
I'm mad because I have been defrauded of thousands of dollars worth of VIP points over the past 5 months. I'm mad because I've been cheated out of hundreds of thousands of dollars by the PLO botring over the past 3 years. I'm mad because the previous software was great for multitabling and had few glitches, the new software is CPU intensive, laggy and extremely glitchy and has costed me thousands of dollars due to constant disconnects, crashes and malfunctions not to mention my volume has also decreased and I have to work many more hours to achieve the same amount of Beast points as I did on the old software. I'm mad because the employees and CEO of the Winning Poker Network are not only arrogant and deny the cheating and fraud, they also pretend that they are trying to get rid of bots and pay players correctly.
Agree with every word.
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Old 10-14-2019, 09:42 PM   #93
MISFITS
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Anyone got an extra bot or two you can hook me up with? I'm ready to get them plugged into ACR so I can start collecting checks while I sleep. TIA
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Old 10-15-2019, 02:19 PM   #94
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Quote:
Originally Posted by HandOfGod666 View Post
I'm mad because I have been defrauded of thousands of dollars worth of VIP points over the past 5 months. I'm mad because I've been cheated out of hundreds of thousands of dollars by the PLO botring over the past 3 years. I'm mad because the previous software was great for multitabling and had few glitches, the new software is CPU intensive, laggy and extremely glitchy and has costed me thousands of dollars due to constant disconnects, crashes and malfunctions not to mention my volume has also decreased and I have to work many more hours to achieve the same amount of Beast points as I did on the old software. I'm mad because the employees and CEO of the Winning Poker Network are not only arrogant and deny the cheating and fraud, they also pretend that they are trying to get rid of bots and pay players correctly.
And yet you still give WPN your $$$.
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Old 10-15-2019, 03:35 PM   #95
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Has there been any discussions on how to exploit the bots?
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Old 10-15-2019, 03:48 PM   #96
carterswidler
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Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 4
Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

was sitting with 600$ today at an omaha table, reged for a 109 sng and a 40$ jackpot sng. the software was acting weird, so i unreged the 109 and and 40$ sng, left the omaha table and logged out. the total was 749$ and when i logged back in the money was not in the cashier. i called the live help line and only after 20 minutes on the phone with them did the 749$ reappear in my cashier. there is no history of this in the financial history tab. this was a rare occasion that i didnt have way more tables up, so i was able to notice the exact amount missing from my account and was luckily able to somehow be refunded. after this happened i find it extremely hard to trust their shitty cashier and am scared that this has probably happened many times before without me noticing.
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Old 10-16-2019, 03:19 PM   #97
ARCANGEL0
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

You all getting cheated and keep playing? Fully knowing you are getting cheated?

Come on guys!
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Old 10-21-2019, 06:15 AM   #98
HandOfGod666
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Location: Land of Destitution
Posts: 976
Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Still short thousands of dollars worth of combat and rank points from last month.
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Old 10-21-2019, 09:23 AM   #99
Carl Trooper
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

Quote:
Originally Posted by ARCANGEL0 View Post
You all getting cheated and keep playing? Fully knowing you are getting cheated?

Come on guys!
Truly is amazing isn’t it.

I did a perm self ban here , and love it.
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Old 10-21-2019, 10:55 AM   #100
GarbageReg
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Join Date: Apr 2019
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Re: Bots and player funds misappropriation on WPN

How are botters able to verify multiple accounts so easily?
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