As I said above post you can't prove no chips were introduced day 1. Maybe 200k were introduced and 800k it's to messy. Everyone seems to be on borgataa side and it's sickening they messed up. Who knows when we were actually cheated and who did it and how many when did it happen... So many people will revolt they probably did some chips day1 not day 2 when there's less people and it's easier to count up the stacks.

It's still just ~1% of the total chips in play. The play is corrupted in the sense that it would have played out differently had the chips not been introduced, but do you think discounting an entire day's worth of play (~800 players) is fair to those who did well on day 2? if so, what if the total were .1%? If the chips were in play and not identified by Borgata staff until the day was over, I don't think the players who did nothing wrong by winning counterfeit chips should be penalized, especially when it didn't affect many players.

The best way to prevent this type of thing from happening is for dealers to have an electronic device that registers players when they sit down at their table. Each player is accounted for in a computer system along with their chip count when they sit down at the table and when it breaks. Whenever a table breaks, each player must have an official chip count inputted into the system. That offers a better way pick up foul play. If a greater amount of chips are in play when a table breaks, then obviously their a problem. However, the amount of time it would take to do this could result in a problem.

Also, I don't think the 27 will only receive a refund because whoever busted 28th still got a full payment for their spot. It's impossible to rescind any payouts, it would cause an uproar. I just hope they catch the *******(s) who did this.

Everyone needs to just stop defending borgata and let them man up about it that they messed up and need to refund for their messed up tournament.

Obviously it would be hard for them to pinpoint the time that the tourney was compromised. Technically no one busted before the tourney was compromised deserves a refund, and although I'd obv be happy to receive the money back I don't expect to be paid anything back. But since the tourney was cancelled and they would be doing a payout to avoid lawsuits/negative image than id say that if they do pay out people they are likely to pay them all instead of trying to establish some unreliable line in the sand of when the tourney was compromised.

Because:



He seems a decent enough writer, but pretty long-winded at times. His last post basically said "Casinos don't make a lot of money from poker rooms and have considered closing them in the past. If this imbroglio results in lawsuits, the Borgata might decide it's not worth having a poker room any longer".

Agree that imbroglio is a nice word. But I also agree with Allen Kessler that we don't need to see this in every post:

Wow, I find myself agreeing with two AK posts in a single day!

...so....if there are a few reports of entire tables starting w/a single extra $5,000 chip.

1 $5k chip, x 400 players (40 tables) = $2mill extra chips.

Is it possible, there is/was no counterfeiting, and instead this was all a big Casino screw up ?

obviously not when they said they found counterfeit chips in the field, they know their own chips.

That's what my friend who played day 1b and started with 25k in chips instead of 20k thinks.

What I find interesting is nobody is saying the chip counts were correct at the end of 1a 1b or 1c. That implies to me that no counts were done till the end of day 2. IMHO that is what has the Borgata on the hook for the whole thing.

Thank you LAS.

I agree with people saying it seems impossible they could prove with certainty all fakes were introduced day 2.

If they find out who introduced the fake chips they can track backwards to the first point they were introduced. OR ASK THE PERSON WHEN THEY STARTED. I'd assume whoever did this wouldn't add a chips at 100/200.

Gambling is a sin. We're all going to Hell!!!

.....but there have been multiple reports of people starting the tourney (and one report of entire table) starting w/an extra 5k chip

Does Men have a package to invest in??? He's a guaranteed winner wherever he plays.

Reserve all.

I don't get how a 4800 player tourney got down to the final 27 before a major red flag went up. Shouldn't the TD bust out into a cold sweat at the sight of the first discovered counterfeit chip? Then they start looking around at other tables, and they find them scattered all over the room like bedbugs. Shouldn't heart attacks ensue?

I have a lot of sympathy for the players, but really none for the Borgata. The staff, especially floor personnel should be exceedingly familiar with what the chips look and feel like, and should have reacted much more quickly IMO.

Meantime, Matasow makes a good point about these tourneys where you bring your "largest" chip stack over to day two, after playing any or all of the day ones. Seems to make cheating extremely easy. Here in Florida we had a tourney with ten day ones and you bring over your two largest chip stacks. Its getting ridiculous, and hopefully TDs around the country will reassess their tourney procedures to ensure fairness to all.

Remember these guys?
http://articles.philly.com/1997-01-0...ns-slot-tokens

The fakes were so good, the casinos couldn't out them, they just knew they had more tokens than they had minted. They had to do destructive testing to tell the fakes from real ones. There was a slight difference in the metallurgy, the real ones were made of a protected alloy, the fakes an almost identical one.

Yeah let's trust the cheater to tell the truth about what happened who was involved a camera can't see all 1 million bring out into play that's at lest two rack of grays not just some 100k chips or 25 k.

can someone post a link to Matusow's interview

I hear the Westboro Baptist church is all over this

Not only were the floor personnel spread thin, they were dealing with constant dealer mistakes from probably on average the least experienced dealing crew in poker tournament history.

They have insurence against fraud. That will cover the loss .

That's pretty lame but a 4th degree felony in NJ is indeed just 18 months maximum. Now it's possible that additional charges will be filed. Ronald Dale Harris the Nevada Gaming Control Board employee who rigged slot machines and Keno games was given the harsh sentence of 7 years prison time and only served two years. He was given that sentence because he was in a position of public trust and took advantage of that by rigging slot machines. It's very likely that the cheaters will do very little jail time or none at all if they are first time offenders.
They will be put in the New Jersey Gaming Black Book banning them from all NJ casinos.

"Chip Smuggling"

http://youtu.be/k_avWpch5kg

They don't need to trust. They can take what he says and then check the cameras. Have you ever seen what a security camera can do? They can zoom in and read your text messages. It won't be difficult to account for all the chips through footage.