So you would chose to play on sites that you dont win on?

I am not being sarcastic, just trying to see your reasons.

@godevils

if you keep winning at ub and withdrawls work smooth for you then just keep what you are doing.

The software plays big role in this. TBH I havent even tried many other sites but I know that I won't be able to play as many tables on other sites than FTP/Stars. Traffic plays a big part, I want to be able to play my micro-donk tables at any time, not all sites have 20+ tables of those running at all times of the day

edit: It's 3:40 AM here and I'm drunk as heell, you might as well ignore whatever I'm posting (seriously), gnight

Thx for cereus reply, I appreciate it. I can see why stars/ft is good for you. I never play more than 6 tables and have no probs on ub with my games filling up.

I guess I probably should not have posted that I play on ub. I honestly feel empathy for the people ripped-off by ub/ap and that is why I feel conflicted playing there. However it is one of two sites (other site has very low traffic) that I consistently win on.

Personally I hope that UB goes broke, but given your situation I wouldn't put a significant amount of monies on the site, and keep doing what you are doing till they burn you, and hope its not for significant $$$. Might want to look at doyles room.

From what I can gather it is not a matter of if but when. For this reason I never keep more than 50 buyins in my acc.

Also fwiw I have lost my br 3 times playing their casino games (obv drunk).
So in my personal opinion I think some of the games are shady ( i mean how many times can 3/2 favorite lose in a row? 13 times actually)

Despite being someone who will point out the issues with Cereus at any suitable opportunity, I can certainly understand your dilemma. Have you looked into Merge and Everleaf?

cereus has a security token aswell so you shouldnt worry about your money there or do you think they could go broke everyday or just wont let you cashout?

quit poker if you cant beat ft or ps you arent meant to play poker for a living. Supporting UB/AP is scummy so decide between your love for the game and your morals - if you really have any.

who is questioning who's ability to think critically?

To my mind, point 2 proves that point 3 is just random run good, which you'll eventually experience wherever you play. I realize that there are sometimes other explanations for beating one site and not another (availability of the games you play, opponent types, etc.), but if you can't identify these reasons for yourself then it's back to my first sentence.

Many of us have been able to solve this problem. STW.

If you have to ask these things on 2p2, you deserve whatever responses you get. Superstishy fishies would continue to play at UB until losing and then move to another site. Decide for yourself if that's you.

Sorry for participating in derail, just randomly opened to last page and saw this discussion.

Could you please point out where I stated I play poker for a living? Because I fail to find that piece of information. Reading FTW. LMAO

I am a rec player. If you think I should quit poker bc i am not a winning player on ps and ft, you are a narrow-minded person.

I play because poker is fun for me. "love for the game" pleeeeeeeease. poker is about winning $.

People like you, who are so enveloped with the idea that your morals and standards should be the litmus test for all other people, makes me sick.

Re-read some of your posts and maybe, i repeat maybe, you will see what I talking about.

Please save yourself from further embarassment

I am fairly certain the reason I am winning on ub as opposed to ps/ft is the quality of players. Did you not understand this in my first post?

I was asking these q's on 2p2 for a discussion on the subject. I did not realize 2p2 was full of cynical morons that were not interested in discussing matters but intent on adding nothing to the subject but hate.

Please next time dont participate. You are adding nothing to the conversation.

I am questioning your ability.

Also your reading comprehension.

You don't state this claim in your first post. If you believe this is true, then you still have to make your own decision. I can tell you that it's generally true in my experience that most winning players eventually average out to be winners on all the sites they play, not just one of them.

You seem upset. When presented with facts and opinions, you respond with insults and name-calling. I don't hate you at all. You asked for our opinions and I provided mine.

Sorry for any offense given. I did ask for opinions and you gave yours. I respect that.

I didnt specifically state that players on ub are worse on average than ps players, but I was trying to imply it. From my own experience, ub and other site (yes 2 sites), are noticeably softer that stars/ft. I could be wrong but this is what I beleive.

Thanks for your input and I am done derailing this thread

If you guys are going to continue can you please take it to PM. Thanks

BTW In case you didnt notice I am new to 2p2 and online poker (less than a year). I am not completely in the loop on everything up/ap does. I am slowly learning about internet poker and the scandals.

So I ask, please bear with me and dont assume everyone knows everything about the shady side of online poker. I am still learning.

This is a ridiculous argument. For one, do you really think they properly implemented the token technology? It is not a cheap or easy process to do it correctly. It is easy to cut corners to make it appear as adding a layer of security. The layer of security it does add if implemented properly makes it more difficult for a random person to hijack your account. That's it. Far from the low hanging fruit on the tree of vulnerabilities at a site where employees have gotten away with stealing money from customers and acknowledge they have no audit trail to be able to pin the crime on the people who did it.

To the guy (godevils) who says he's beating UB but not stars/FTp

I had the same issue for 2+years where I absolutely destroyed midstakes mtts on UB and lost my ass everytime I tried stars/FTP.

This was before the Cereus merger. Post Cereus I continued to win there for 6+months. I then started losing pretty bad, according to HEM i was under EV on allins and on close inspection was also running into a lot of "coolers".

I left UB and started playing stars, won on stars for a while, started losing, moved to FTP. won there, then moved back to UB when I started running bad. Won a UB for a while. rinse lather repeat. Im a winning player on all sites now and I continue this pattern of play. I started this pattern because I believed the sites were all rigged and I would reward them with play when I was running good, and punish them with withdrawel when I ran bad My logic was if the sites were NOT rigged my strategy should have zero impact on my chances....while if the site WAS rigged in a way that stole back winnings to redistribute across the player pool or rewarded returning players in any way, then my cyclical play/withdraw strategy should be close to optimal.

fast forward....I still believe this pattern of play is optimal FOR ME but not because the sites are rigged. Its because all 3 sites have very different tournament structures (with stars being best for better mtt players) and I do best when all of the games I'm playing have the same strategy/payout/player tendencies as opposed to having the right decision be different for 3 different tables im playing at the same time.

loose description of tourney structures:
UB: Most starting chips compared to starting blinds and middle length intervals
endgame: normally shallow effective stacks for most games (but better
than FTP)
FTP: Probably what most people consider the best STARTING structure with
good chip:blind ratio and very progressive blind jumps. Problem is almost
all endgames are played with chipleader at 30-40bbs and shortstacks
around 10bbs.
Stars: deepstacked for first 2 levels then the blind jumps are large compared
to other sites BUT the intervals are 25% longer. You have to get
lucky early on in stars tourneys to get your stack to 6k. However
theres more room for play (3bet/folding and 4bet shoves with fold
equity) in the midlate/endgame stages and final tables almost always
have deeper effective stacks for the top few contenders at least.
Stars final tables have more room for play when the big money is on
the line so I believe they are the best structure. edit: although their payout structure is by far the worst so this somewhat takes away from them)

cliffs:
1. for some moving money site to site may be optimal but only because
you arent good at playing multiple structures/opponent types at once or
2. Having your whole bankroll at one site so your balance is big compared to
the buyins you are playing may be more comfortable/confidence inspiring
than having 3 small rolls on 3 sites. (ie if you play $50 games having 5k on
stars may feel different than having 2k stars, 2k ftp, 1k UB rolls even tho
its effectively the same thing)
3. if you're a winning mtt player on one site (not if you are just on a heater)
and not the others its either just variance or you aren't adjusting to the
different structures well.

Use the search function BEFORE you post next time. Being new isn't an excuse

Come on guys ITT we wait for the refunds "UB will obv be repaying".
I am sure there is a general UB shadiness thread you guys can continue this.

i got a refund of 2 dollars today

Don't spend it all at once.

When I first saw Noah's tweet and blog post title yesterday, I was sure it was an April Fool's.

Congrats to everyone who got their several dollars back.

Now we just sit and wait to see what the next big bombshell is...

http://www.nsdpoker.com/2011/04/ap-keno-update/