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Old 10-19-2016, 11:36 AM   #726
stillerfan
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

not reading anything on this forum until ESPN gets to November 9, but I must say Will Kassouf is my favorite poker player ever. **** the haters, he is immensely entertaining. all I see is whiners like Josephy. clearly he has gotten in their heads and that is exactly what he wanted to do
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Old 10-19-2016, 12:12 PM   #727
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

Engaging with a wide variety of personality types is just a part of poker. Kassouf is a troll talker. The more you give him back the more he feeds off it. Types like his are easy to deal with. You just play your game, and give him a friendly line or two every once in a while to keep him around. But you don't indulge his every whim when he opens his mouth. That was Matuson's mistake. She let the audio waves around her affect her decision making, and lacking that ability to focus on the hand is a leak. You can be weak-minded in many different ways.

He's basically Jamie Gold with a ****ty accent.
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Old 10-19-2016, 01:49 PM   #728
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

^^^Come to think of it, didn't WSOP enact some kind of Jamie Gold rule? Or am I thinking of Hevad Khan and the "Bulldozer" excess celebration?
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Old 10-19-2016, 01:59 PM   #729
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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^^^Come to think of it, didn't WSOP enact some kind of Jamie Gold rule? Or am I thinking of Hevad Khan and the "Bulldozer" excess celebration?
Yeah the Hevad Khan rule
I don't think jamie Gold was anywhere near as annoying as Kassouf. For one Jamie didn't tank like Will and Jamie didn't rehash the same ten phrases over and over.

That said as mentioned already there's definitely gonna be a 'William Kassouf rule' in place next year.

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Old 10-19-2016, 02:01 PM   #730
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

Pleased to be wishing for a Shot Clock in 2017 am I.
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Old 10-19-2016, 02:22 PM   #731
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by LOLNHDONKWP View Post
Yeah the Hevad Khan rule
I don't think jamie Gold was anywhere near as annoying as Kassouf. For one Jamie didn't tank like Will and Jamie didn't rehash the same ten phrases over and over.

That said as mentioned already there's definitely gonna be a 'William Kassouf rule' in place next year.

That was incredible thanks for sharing, haha.
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Old 10-19-2016, 04:06 PM   #732
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

Khan was much much more entertaining than Kassouf.
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Old 10-20-2016, 12:54 AM   #733
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

If the guy tanks too much, call the clock on him. And if he tanks all the time, call the clock on him all the time. There's literally a mechanism in place to deal with this sort of thing.

I did just watch the 33 hand and while I think will should have made that decision in 3 seconds, literally everyone at the table (except maybe the floor dude will was trying to engage) looked terrible. The TD especially, but the way ESPN had seemingly everyone mic'ed up so they could capture all the beta af comments afterwards was terrible. Like, the fact that some dudes are going to walk away from the table muttering about how bad other people are is literally the reason recreational players stay away from poker. Like, seriously, that dbag talking about 10 dolla whatevs did more damage to poker in two seconds than will could ever do.

We can sit back and say that there's some things you shouldn't be allowed to do at a poker table. Profanity for sure, yelling at people, making threats, then we move it to mocking people, getting in their face, and that's all good. We shouldn't be doing that. But in the StaceyAcey hand, he isn't doing any of that, he's saying something in a calm voice. Sure, he's annoying, but he's not in her face, he's not raising his voice, he's not mocking her, what exactly do we think he's doing that could annoy her other than being better at poker? There's no way that the's actually influencing her decision, unless she is terrible. The other guy in the 33 hand is all in! There's no way he's influencing his decision there. But obv JE has to come to the guy's defense.

I don't know if I have an actual point, but if we're going to sit here and turn poker into an "us vs them" type game where us and them are just defined as "people we like" then you're going to see a drop off in player enthusiasm over the next year unlike anything you've ever seen before.
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Old 10-20-2016, 01:00 AM   #734
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by LOLNHDONKWP View Post
That said as mentioned already there's definitely gonna be a 'William Kassouf rule' in place next year.
Wasn't there gonna be a 'Zvi Stern' rule this year?
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Old 10-20-2016, 01:15 AM   #735
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

After Will folds the 33 hand Cliff Josephy says "It's okay we're all on same team". That is blatant collusion and he should have been penalized.
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Old 10-20-2016, 01:34 AM   #736
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

And some of these players berating Will are pros??? Seriously? This crap happens almost everyday in a poker room. Everyone was sounding like whiny little babies when they were teaming up against him during those few moments.
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Old 10-20-2016, 01:50 AM   #737
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

It's official the guy is annoying. However everyone can quit their crying until they implement clocks which has to be done. Fix the problem or deal with it.
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Old 10-20-2016, 07:27 AM   #738
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

The guys a moron, I think the most frustrating thing is that he seems to genuinely believe he's witty and funny and that repeating the same ten lines is "having conversation as oppose to sitting in silence" or something along those lines.
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Old 10-20-2016, 07:41 AM   #739
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by SuperSwag View Post
After Will folds the 33 hand Cliff Josephy says "It's okay we're all on same team". That is blatant collusion and he should have been penalized.
This is a ridiculous post. By 'team', it was clear he meant that they all felt the same way about his tanking, not that they should collude against him.

They were on the same team in terms of opinion.
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Old 10-20-2016, 08:40 AM   #740
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

Its no secret that pissing people off will get you action. Poker players are all bunch of pussies, so there will be no major repercussions to being an *******. Until someone gets killed, this behavior will continue.

You can bet the kids will emulate the ****-talking, just like Mike Mcdonald's stare-downs.
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Old 10-20-2016, 09:12 AM   #741
inmyrav
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

Phil Hellmuth basically telling his opponent he has AK or KK and then calls him an idiot five times. Apparently in front of Matt Savage (villian speaks to "Matt" midway through Phil's rant).

Granted it was 2008 but the rules were the same back then (post Jamie Gold) so far as I understand with reference to disclosing your hand and taunting an opponent.

Phil served no penalty.

Hand starts at 3:00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=289b...1278F484D4F55D
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Old 10-20-2016, 09:21 AM   #742
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by PeteBlow View Post
This is a ridiculous post. By 'team', it was clear he meant that they all felt the same way about his tanking, not that they should collude against him.

They were on the same team in terms of opinion.
It's not so ridiculous actually. Collusion can take many forms. In most forms it isn't penalized even though it's against the rules. For example, telegraphing your intention to 'check it down' when a player is all in at a final table by repeatedly tapping the felt without a break.

Cliffy's comment is clearly inappropriate as was the ganging up. Worth a penalty? Probably not, but worth a warning and I'd be worried about multiple callers with weak hands trying to get lucky on a flop to eliminate me by working as a 'team'.

Of course I sit in my hoody and sunglasses and never say anything to anyone. Which is just as bad with everyone here, can't win with some people.
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Old 10-20-2016, 10:35 AM   #743
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by illdonk View Post
Wasn't there gonna be a 'Zvi Stern' rule this year?
I'd imagine Stern didn't get the same treatment as Will as he looks like an ex Israeli special forces badass, whereas Kassouf looks like a 135 pound sissy boy manlet.

So yeah, definite bullying going on from Cliff and Jared.
Would you try and bully this guy?

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Old 10-20-2016, 10:49 AM   #744
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

I was referring to rules against tanking, which seemed imminent following Stern's play last year. Not rules protecting players who've spent days antagonizing their opponents.
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Old 10-20-2016, 10:53 AM   #745
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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If the guy tanks too much, call the clock on him. And if he tanks all the time, call the clock on him all the time. There's literally a mechanism in place to deal with this sort of thing.
that's the problem - there is no such mechanism. If you start calling the clock on him every hand, ******* like this will take full 60 secs on every decision, which will make the table even slower. The biggest issue everyone took with him was the fact that he took 10-20 seconds with action on him BEFORE LOOKING AT HIS CARDS. That's just attention seeking at psychologically treatable level.
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Old 10-20-2016, 11:06 AM   #746
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by illdonk View Post
I was referring to rules against tanking, which seemed imminent following Stern's play last year. Not rules protecting players who've spent days antagonizing their opponents.
I know yeah.
My comment was off the point a bit but I think it's true.
No way Cliff the sociopath, little pussy Moss, little wimp Vayo, and that prick Jared were taking the same line with Stern.

Last edited by LOLNHDONKWP; 10-20-2016 at 11:14 AM.
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Old 10-20-2016, 11:06 AM   #747
PhilHelmet
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by Keep Your Dreams View Post
Wow A8 suited ship with 9bb,must be tilted by the table fish (who tanks 12 minutes to fold for 10% of his staCk)

Wow both players river top pair decent kicker in a small pot and there's a bet and a call. Sick tilt
Or maybe he realized given they were averaging about 4 1/2 minutes per hand, that A8 was the best he was gong to get?

4.6 minutes/hand based on 26 hands played in a two hour level...
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Old 10-20-2016, 11:28 AM   #748
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by FreshThyme View Post
The tanking was a problem, but it isn't a problem that is unique to him. I very rarely play live poker tournaments any more because it is entirely too slow and boring. I have no clue why people think they need 10 minutes to make a decision. Like really, what are you getting in minute 10 that you couldn't have figured out in minute 2? It's ridiculous and the TD's around the country need to put an end to it.
Agree that TDs need to do something about it. It's not totally fair to blame players for doing it imo - as it's technically legal, there's $8m on the line, and it's extremely effective. There's just too many good reasons to tank:
  • You get more time to make your decision
  • It can put your opponent under a lot more pressure, especially if they have a medium strength hand, and give them more opportunities to level themselves internally
  • It creates the impression that you're very focussed, and less likely to be making mistakes / rash decisions
  • Many kinds of players are less likely to bluff you post-flop, knowing that they will have to undergo intense scrutiny

I've always been known in my circles for acting very quickly. In the same way that people try to throw people off their game with tanking, I used to do it with snap decisions. Rob Salaburu was my hero :> But in the last year or so, I've adopted a considerably slower/methodical/measured style, and the difference in the way people respond to me has been dramatic, seriously. I never ever hollywood, and I don't tank on preflop folds, but I've started taking 60-80 seconds regularly to decide on 3-betting someone with A10s instead of the 20-25 seconds the average player seems to, and people are sigh-folding 22-99 and AJs/AQo type hands wayyyy more frequently. I get semi-frustrated mutterings from players sometimes about the speed of my play, but the change in style has been a goldmine, so there's no way I'd change unless the casino changed its rules.
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Old 10-20-2016, 11:38 AM   #749
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

This just shows how big of babies a lot of poker players are. They expect the game to be played a certain way and then cry when it's not done that way. It was a terrible look for "pro poke players" in my opinion. Clearly they should be aware that he is doing nothing wrong by the rule book, just bad etiquette.

Will is a very smart guy. He knows the rules well, and uses them to his advantage. He got paid off twice in decent sized hands because of it. He even made the TD look like a moron when he was trying to explain what "one player per hand" meant.

I'm not a fan of his antics, and I wouldn't do them myself at the table. That being said, if someone does what he does, I would get frustrated but I wouldn't let that person know. I would just play my game and adapt to the situation. I would respect that he is playing by the rules, even though he is annoying. A lot of money is at stake, and if he can push whatever edge he can to get it, more power to him.

This reminded me of the Mayweather Ortiz fight. Ortiz was trying to give him a hug, and didn't protect himself. Good etiquette would have been to touch gloves and keep going. Mayweather knew the rules though, didn't care about etiquette, and knocked him out in 3 shots. He won the fight and the purse. People thought he was a dirtbag, but he followed the outlined rules and won.
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Old 10-20-2016, 11:47 AM   #750
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Re: "9 high like a boss"

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Originally Posted by boxcheck View Post
This just shows how big of babies a lot of poker players are. They expect the game to be played a certain way and then cry when it's not done that way. It was a terrible look for "pro poke players" in my opinion. Clearly they should be aware that he is doing nothing wrong by the rule book, just bad etiquette.

Will is a very smart guy. He knows the rules well, and uses them to his advantage. He got paid off twice in decent sized hands because of it. He even made the TD look like a moron when he was trying to explain what "one player per hand" meant.

I'm not a fan of his antics, and I wouldn't do them myself at the table. That being said, if someone does what he does, I would get frustrated but I wouldn't let that person know. I would just play my game and adapt to the situation. I would respect that he is playing by the rules, even though he is annoying. A lot of money is at stake, and if he can push whatever edge he can to get it, more power to him.

This reminded me of the Mayweather Ortiz fight. Ortiz was trying to give him a hug, and didn't protect himself. Good etiquette would have been to touch gloves and keep going. Mayweather knew the rules though, didn't care about etiquette, and knocked him out in 3 shots. He won the fight and the purse. People thought he was a dirtbag, but he followed the outlined rules and won.

Ortiz gave him a blatant and obvious headbutt though.
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