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Old 05-16-2015, 12:50 AM   #1
Popetman
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35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

TL;DR - Cliffs at bottom

First off - I'm not sure of two things

The first is where to put this – it feels like big News [So I posted it here NVG]. But also maybe it should live in B&M [or whatever that forum is calling itself today]

The second thing I’m not sure of, is – exactly the truth. In fact this OP is because I would like to know the truth.

I was told this, as it is [apparently] common knowledge, by regulars in the game/casino this happened, and seems to have happened within the last few weeks.

I have to say that it’s good that the casino banned the players, if they cheated, and shows that they won’t just hide this sort of thing under the carpet.

So as I think the casino deserves praise, I will name it. Also as everybody has been talking about it – it’s no secret anyway.

The casino is Palm Beach in London. The smallest game they run is 5/10 NLH. It is for higher stakes players. I was a semi reg, but found better games [softer/more fun] elsewhere – so rarely play there myself now. 1/2 players elsewhere always go on about how easy the games at Palm are. But I never found the games to be anywhere near as soft as people suggest.

So it’s a classy venue that runs the bigger games.

I haven’t been told why the players were banned, other than ‘for cheating’, hence my making this post to find out more.

Complaints I have heard in the past have been that when a whale turns up, people text others and suddenly the table is all young pros playing against the whale on one bank roll.

On the rare occasions that I have been there and a whale/recreational player has sat in – I have been surprised at how badly [some of] the regs have spoken to the whale. Saying things that will cost the whole table money. I can imagine that the whale would be worth much more to the Palm [table game losses] than the young pros – so if they were being rude – then maybe that would be a reason? In fact it was a particular occasion where this happened [where I was the only person at the table trying to stop the berating of the recreational players play] that made me decide there was a reason other games were more likely to be better [softer]. So it has been a large reason why I rarely go to Palm now.

I’ve also not liked how, in the past, the players [regs] have had the power to ban players. If enough of them complain then certain winning players would be told they were no longer welcome. This happened to a few players who would play short stack, double up and leave. It’s a casino, not a private game… hmm. I know players get annoyed by this, but ganging up to ban players??? It’s a casino. The players shouldn’t have that power.

Anyway – for any casino to ban 35 players [in one go] for cheating – is a bit shocking. Does anyone know the reason, how they were cheating, or how long they had been going there?

If it is a team, does that mean they will all now go to another Casino and continue what they were doing? It would be interesting to know [what they were doing and who they were], but also it would help knowing to not get caught out [by their cheating] myself in the future.

And if they cheated [35 people????] and won money, were affected players compensated?

CLIFFS
35 ppl banned in one go by casino for cheating
Don’t know what they did [what flavour of cheating]
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Old 05-16-2015, 01:44 AM   #2
macgyver72
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

People cheating at poker?!?!! I'm appalled!
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Old 05-16-2015, 01:56 AM   #3
sb77
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

first the masseuse gets the blame but really it was other players cheating. terrible
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Old 05-16-2015, 02:12 AM   #4
luckbox888
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

i think you are misinformed the players were banned for being total live bumhunters insta breaking games when fish left, hanging around the poker room not playing waiting for spots to show up etc.
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Old 05-16-2015, 04:25 AM   #5
Smoking Dough
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

May have seen something similar to this happen on FTP several years ago when a massive whale was playing 500/1k rail heaven
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Old 05-16-2015, 05:16 AM   #6
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

Always wished that names would be released when this happens.
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Old 05-16-2015, 05:59 AM   #7
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

From what I've heard something along these lines isn't unbelievable, although an outright ban seems strange if they're just bumhunting.
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Old 05-16-2015, 06:12 AM   #8
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

This has been going on for years in London. It used to happen at the Vic when the bigger games ran there more frequently. The Greek whale would turn up, the same few young regs would txt spam each other, get to the venue and he's then convinced to move from the 5/10 that was running to 10/20 they've started. Rinse/repeat over and over for every whale.
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Old 05-16-2015, 08:57 AM   #9
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

Story is true, however, it isn't really for cheating.

Palm Beach banned a bunch of short stacking and bumhunting regs (primarily Spanish, I believe) because they were affecting the nature of the card room and making long standing regulars who play for fun there feel uneasy and ruining their experience.

Most regs in London, including myself, were loving it. Live poker at the end of the day is an experience, particularly for recreational players and the idea that at the end of the day a bunch of pro's go the grimmest way about relieving long term punters of their money isn't one that'll go down well, particularly in long standing and high end establishments such as the Palm Beach.
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Old 05-16-2015, 01:35 PM   #10
DonkPredat0r
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by luckbox888 View Post
i think you are misinformed the players were banned for being total live bumhunters insta breaking games when fish left, hanging around the poker room not playing waiting for spots to show up etc.
this

I have experienced it a few times at Palms. So annoying
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Old 05-16-2015, 01:45 PM   #11
Doorbread
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

what games usually run at palms?
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Old 05-16-2015, 01:58 PM   #12
DarkMattersMan
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

So happy they got banned. Disgusting. Nobody likes to feel like they are the prey. Sounds like these losers were overly blatant about it. Bout time online sights start doing the same.
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Old 05-16-2015, 03:25 PM   #13
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by luckbox888 View Post
i think you are misinformed the players were banned for being total live bumhunters insta breaking games when fish left, hanging around the poker room not playing waiting for spots to show up etc.
I heard about this in February, and ran into one of the guys who was banned from Palm Place when we played together at the Vic. He admitted he was bumhunting, but he also claimed that the management at Palms Place wanted to kick out all of the wining players. If the latter part of his claim is true, this sets a very bad precedent. Poker Rooms should not ban players for winning... its ok to ban a player for being bad for business due to behavior but winning should never be a factor.

At the time I considered creating a thread in NVG about this, but I did not have enough facts to proceed. I still don't, I don't want to jump to conclusions without facts.
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Old 05-16-2015, 03:41 PM   #14
coordi
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

You can't ban all the winners cause then you have no one left in the end
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Old 05-16-2015, 03:51 PM   #15
Make Them Dig
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

For people who don't know Palm Beach runs £5/£10+ cash games, all games have uncapped buy ins.

These people weren't banned for cheating. They were winning players who were banned for short stacking, hit and running, berating fish, being antisocial, strat talking endlessly. The room still has lots of winning regs, they just have the good sense to try not to make the fish feel uncomfortable.
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Old 05-16-2015, 03:52 PM   #16
Make Them Dig
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigAisaOK View Post
Story is true, however, it isn't really for cheating.

Palm Beach banned a bunch of short stacking and bumhunting regs (primarily Spanish, I believe) because they were affecting the nature of the card room and making long standing regulars who play for fun there feel uneasy and ruining their experience.

Most regs in London, including myself, were loving it. Live poker at the end of the day is an experience, particularly for recreational players and the idea that at the end of the day a bunch of pro's go the grimmest way about relieving long term punters of their money isn't one that'll go down well, particularly in long standing and high end establishments such as the Palm Beach.
Missed this post before, +1 to everything here
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Old 05-16-2015, 04:22 PM   #17
tercet
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

I was in London last summer, and half of the 5/10 table at The Vic were Spanish dudes that took turns playing sunday million on one guys cell phone. They were talking spanish all day too, had no clue what they were saying. Probably same group of guys?
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Old 05-16-2015, 04:36 PM   #18
DirkkDiggler
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

why they shortstacking vs a whale ? cliff about shortstacking strategy ?
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Old 05-16-2015, 06:50 PM   #19
Tutejszy
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

wow, can anyone think of a worse thing to do with your life than live, shortstacked bumhunting?
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Old 05-16-2015, 07:00 PM   #20
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by Make Them Dig View Post
For people who don't know Palm Beach runs £5/£10+ cash games, all games have uncapped buy ins.

These people weren't banned for cheating. They were winning players who were banned for short stacking, hit and running, berating fish, being antisocial, strat talking endlessly. The room still has lots of winning regs, they just have the good sense to try not to make the fish feel uncomfortable.
Im starting to love the palm beach casino. Basically how a private or hosted game is run. the boom is over kids....
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Old 05-16-2015, 07:07 PM   #21
insyder19
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by inavacuum View Post
This has been going on for years in London. It used to happen at the Vic when the bigger games ran there more frequently. The Greek whale would turn up, the same few young regs would txt spam each other, get to the venue and he's then convinced to move from the 5/10 that was running to 10/20 they've started. Rinse/repeat over and over for every whale.
Exact same thing happened in Vienna last year. They also soft played each other and would always call each others raise whenever the fish was in the pot.
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Old 05-16-2015, 09:24 PM   #22
GamblinRick
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

This is actually fantastic to hear, but it was also in the casino's best interest to do this. I always appreciate when a company makes a controversial decision like I'm sure this one was, but that decision has both the longevity of the game and the interests of the players and venue in mind.

Many times companies are afraid to make these decisions because they fear the bad publicity. The only mistake here I think was being vague about the reasons. By doing that they caused at least some people such as OP to think that the players were banned for cheating and that could have been harmful to everybody there.

Great job otherwise though.
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Old 05-16-2015, 10:13 PM   #23
wormmis11
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

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Originally Posted by GamblinRick View Post
This is actually fantastic to hear, but it was also in the casino's best interest to do this. I always appreciate when a company makes a controversial decision like I'm sure this one was, but that decision has both the longevity of the game and the interests of the players and venue in mind.

Many times companies are afraid to make these decisions because they fear the bad publicity. The only mistake here I think was being vague about the reasons. By doing that they caused at least some people such as OP to think that the players were banned for cheating and that could have been harmful to everybody there.

Great job otherwise though.

Colluding is cheating, no?
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Old 05-16-2015, 10:16 PM   #24
GamblinRick
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

Quote:
Originally Posted by Make Them Dig View Post
These people weren't banned for cheating. They were winning players who were banned for short stacking, hit and running, berating fish, being antisocial, strat talking endlessly. The room still has lots of winning regs, they just have the good sense to try not to make the fish feel uncomfortable.
Where does it say colluding in here?
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Old 05-16-2015, 10:43 PM   #25
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Re: 35 people banned from UK (London) casino for cheating at poker

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You can't ban all the winners cause then you have no one left in the end
They are not banning the rake nor the tips...
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