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07-04-2014 , 05:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dantes
Actions speak louder than words obv. I think what he wrote makes sense, I've never argued that DNegs is perfect and the fact that he may have been dishonest in the past doesn't invalidate what he wrote. Just like the fact that Colman was an ass in the past doesn't mean he's not trying to be a nice guy now.
So his actions in the video, in which he lied to the floor person, speaker louder than his words in his blog.

What is important is what you do, not what you say that you will do.

I got it.
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07-04-2014 , 06:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrgr33n13
I really don't owe anyone an explanation but Ill give one...

First off, I don't owe poker a single thing. I've been fortunate enough to benefit financially from this game, but I have played it long enough to see the ugly side of this world. It is not a game where the pros are always happy and living a fulfilling life. To have a job where you are at the mercy of variance can be insanely stressful and can lead to a lot of unhealthy habits. I would never in a million years recommend for someone to try and make it as a poker pro.

It is also not a game where the amateurs are always happy to be losing their money for the sake of entertainment. The losers lose way more money at this game then winners are winning. A lot of this is money they cant afford to lose. This is fine of course because if someone is dumb enough to gamble with money they cant afford to lose, that's their problem. Im not really buying that though. In a perfect world, markets are based on informed consumers making rational transactions. In reality sadly that's not the case, markets are based on advertising trying to play on peoples impulses and targeting their weaknesses in order for them to make irrational decisions. I get it if someone wants to go and play poker on their own free will, but I don't agree with gambling being advertised just like I don't agree with cigarettes and alcohol being advertised.

It bothers me that people care so much about poker's well being. As poker is a game that has such a net negative effect on the people playing it. Both financially and emotionally.

As for promoting myself, I feel that individual achievements should rarely be celebrated. I am not going to take part in it for others and I wouldn't want it for myself. If you wonder why our society is so infatuated by individuals and their success, and being a baller, it is not that way for no reason. It is their because it serves a clear purpose. If you get people to look up to someone and adhere to the "gain wealth, forget all but self" motto, then you can get them to ignore the social contract which is very good for power systems. Also it serves as a means of distraction to get people to not pay attention to the things that do matter.

These are just my personal views. And yes, I realize I am conflicted. I capitalize off this game that targets peoples weaknesses. I do enjoy it, I love the strategy part of it, but I do see it as a very dark game.

Happy to read any ones opinions that could convince me otherwise of my views.
A good amount of this is true. I support your decision.
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07-04-2014 , 06:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jigsaw
So his actions in the video, in which he lied to the floor person, speaker louder than his words in his blog.

What is important is what you do, not what you say that you will do.

I got it.
The video is absolutely ridiculous-his intent was clear (but he was dumb as hell to try and speak all cool and two put the chips in the way he did) I won't argue about the validity of call or his lie there. Say it's a lie say he was shooting an angle and rather then altering the way it was said in the slightest way while not completely altering initial way he just outright lied about it all. Wtf does that mean? Someone can't lie once and change? Someone can't at one point in life have a view and then change it? We can't grow and change as we age? We can't speak to integrity or honesty at all if we've ever lied? Or only if we've been caught lieing on tape?

It was a well thought out and written blog-likes him or not and whether he's ever told a lie or not his point is still pretty valid.

It's insane to me the crap people pick and choose to have an issue with..from this stupidity to the idiots calling him out online because 'how many 350 lb high school football players are there'...people seem to go out of there way every chance they get to ignore the message and find **** to target.
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07-04-2014 , 07:47 PM
I still can't believe Ole Schemion didn't play, he would have crushed the entire field, including Coleman.
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07-04-2014 , 08:14 PM
.........or maybe he wouldn't have
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07-04-2014 , 11:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frenbar
You are making an argument against capitalism, not an argument against poker. The blurb you wrote could just as easily apply to mortgages and stocks as much as it applies to poker. At the end of the day we live in a ****ty dog-eat-dog society that is based on the clever and the powerful taking advantage of the slow and the weak. I don't begrudge you for pointing this out, but people who think this is somehow specific to poker are ignorant or deluded.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The4thFilm
Well, it's a free country and people should be able to spend their entertainment dollar on what they want. What do you expect single men in the 40s-50s to do in their spare time? Drink themselves to death? What about retired guys? You can't play 4 rounds of golf in a day. Poker is social, uses your brain to ward off alzheimer's, and is slow enough that degenerates almost always choose something else for their fix. That's just my alternative viewpoint.

I think your views are perfectly valid and your behavior was fine.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schneids
Allow me to play a bit of devil's advocate... To date, this game of poker has given you so much. A swanky place in Rio Di Janeiro that has a rooftop pool. The freedom to take months off whenever you want. All of the traveling you've gotten to do. Millions of dollars.

We all know there's a dark side of poker. Denying the interview for these reasons make it seem like you think you're better than everyone else and appears quite standoffish. It feels like you're just putting on a charade trying to sound profound. You in fact, have benefited from poker more than 99.9% of the poker playing population.

It's hard for your message to have any level of sincerity when you are well known for trying to tilt your opponents in chat; for trying to slowly goad them into playing you for higher stakes HU in your cunning sly ways you do... At best, you could've done an interview and admitted to being a bit self-loathing because you believe poker has been a net negative for too many lives, even if it has been a tremendous positive in yours. You could've easily said stuff like that, while graciously acknowledging "but it's fantastic that at least this event was able to raise $4.6 million dollars for such an important cause, so even if there's plenty of darkness in this game, I'm happy that poker has put me in a position to be able to play in a $1M tournament that benefits charity."

If you really do truly believe what you're saying about poker, I hope the one drop was the last hand of poker you ever play. Between your online success, the EPT SHR win weeks ago, and now this, I presume you should have several million in the bank... That's more than enough to start making a positive difference in this world, while still being able to make some money for yourself. Among ways you can help the world:

- Get a real estate protege. Go into real estate in a low income, depressed area, and buy up the whole block. Rehab the places a bit, rent them out. You'll easily cash flow them, you'll help community revitalization and help low income people live in acceptable housing.
- Start a charitable organization for whatever cause is close to you, and be the president of it. As an employee you can still be paid a fair salary.
- If you can't think of anything specific to do with the money, just get out of poker and do some habitat for humanities, volunteer at food shelves, etc., until something comes to you... Invested properly, the interest from all your spoils should be easy to live off with a minimalist lifestyle.

Anyway, if you really do believe what you said, you really dropped the ball. You could've become an ambassador to the game that truly did preach responsible gambling, first and foremost. Instead, you'll be remembered as that punk rebel who was too good for everyone. I don't mean this to come off as an attack; I don't even know you, and heck I even agree with a lot of your thoughts.
Great posts^^.

I have no issue with not wanting to give interviews to the poker media but given Dan's online reputation, his "statement" is one of the most hypocritical things I've ever read. Maybe he didn't want to give an interview because he didn't want to be asked about being one of the most predatory (to put it kindly) HU players in online poker history.
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07-04-2014 , 11:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NLSoldier
Great posts^^.

I have no issue with not wanting to give interviews to the poker media but given Dan's online reputation, his "statement" is one of the most hypocritical things I've ever read. Maybe he didn't want to give an interview because he didn't want to be asked about being one of the most predatory (to put it kindly) HU players in online poker history.
Link to this, or did I just have to be there?
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07-04-2014 , 11:59 PM
So the final takeaway is that poker is a super dark game and Colman is the leading arcane practitioner of poker's black magic?

OK, then. Cheers!
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07-05-2014 , 05:46 AM
everyone who's commending him for "doing the right thing" and "writing such a great post": do you realize that the problems described in colman's post had the potential to reach a much wider audience and consequently widen the scope of discussion if he had done a post-win interview?

if he truly cared about the issues as much as his post makes it seem, he should have used the moment where everyone would cling onto his every word to expose them to the whole world.

regardless of whether or not one agrees with his actual views, making that post on 2p2 makes him dishonest.

Last edited by invictus-1; 07-05-2014 at 05:58 AM.
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07-05-2014 , 07:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by brandonruns
No one's perfect, but I don't see what people want out of LeBron and company. There's just no way they can please everyone all of the time. Each of them had a dream, they worked hard to fulfill their dreams, and now they're making the most out of it. Good for them! Even if I don't like everything they say or do, good for them! If they believe in what they're doing as a profession, why shouldn't they talk about it?

I don't agree with everything Daniel Negreanu says or does, and I know a lot of people think he's annoying and that he talks too much, but I for one respect that he's vocal about his beliefs (i.e., even if we're going to "hate him" for it, lol), owns up to his mistakes, and yadda, yadda, yadda.
LeBron fulfilled his dream of being the best basketball player in the world and winning a championship, I don't see how a ginormous marketing contract with a multinational running sweatshops and obligatory interviews with a media monopoly have to be part of that. If I were him, I'd pay the fine for not talking to ESPN every game, he can afford it.
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07-05-2014 , 12:17 PM
Daniel Colman- EAD!
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07-05-2014 , 12:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by reziduer
Daniel Colman- EAD!
classy guy right here.
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07-05-2014 , 12:31 PM
Who cares what one person thinks...I'm just glad he voiced his opinions on 2+2 and not in an interview. It's easy for him to say everything he did after he's made his millions, poker could end tomorrow and he would have nothing to worry about
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07-05-2014 , 01:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nit Bag
This is a misguided view of capitalism as wherever capitalism has been allowed to flurish the massses became better off, not worse. Poker is a contest like any sport, there are winners and losers. The losers don't go to loser hell, some realize they should be doing better things with their lives and benefit from the experience, others are motivated to improve and become winners and others believe the lossses are a fair trade off for the challenge and chance of winning. Losing and pain makes systems and individuals stronger and better on balance, not weaker. Look at sports over the past 100 years, there is a loser for every winner yet athletes at every sport and every level are considerably better over time.
It's amazing how free-market capitalism, the greatest generator of a rise in standard of living (for every class), is so often denounced/condemned by the dishonest left and their horde of useful idiots (look for a Howard Zinn book or a Che Guevara shirt).

America is now going through an extended period of wealth redistribution for the sake of buying votes/political power while discouraging self reliance, instead promoting dependence on govt handouts regardless of whether one has the power tobe self sufficient. The takers are taking over and one of their big weapons is anti-capitalism.

Be a maker, not a taker.
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07-05-2014 , 01:19 PM
Poker's best kept secret - The house always wins. Although this may be less obvious with poker, it's not less true.
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07-05-2014 , 03:09 PM
People still banging on about this?

It was last week ffs! The Main event is starting!
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07-05-2014 , 03:26 PM
Is Coaleman playing the Main?
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07-05-2014 , 03:30 PM
Colman giving interviews (beyond the one that he actually did give) doesn't promote poker, it promotes a sanitized, soundbite-ready portrayal of poker that's intended to make ESPN money. It hides the worst aspects of poker, as he said, as well as the boring parts like the hard graft needed to be successful. These format of these interviews and writeups means that any nuance is lost and facts are distorted or discarded for headlines - how many laymen are going to read 'Colman wins $1,000,000 buy-in event' or '23-year-old wins $15M' without having a clue about staking? Outfits that should know better often ask misleading or silly questions - Kara Scott asking Einhorn if he was going to go pro comes to mind. Even if Colman wanted to craft a better public image for poker, that's not on the table here. The best he can do is talk about the charity, and that's what he did.

AFAICT, most of these complaints are coming from players angry that Colman isn't helping to lure more fish they can prey on - thus confirming everything he says - and poker 'journalists' who somehow can't make the most expensive event in the calendar with a >$4.5M charity contribution interesting and blame him for it.
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07-05-2014 , 06:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by harkin
It's amazing how free-market capitalism, the greatest generator of a rise in standard of living (for every class), is so often denounced/condemned by the dishonest left and their horde of useful idiots (look for a Howard Zinn book or a Che Guevara shirt).

America is now going through an extended period of wealth redistribution for the sake of buying votes/political power while discouraging self reliance, instead promoting dependence on govt handouts regardless of whether one has the power tobe self sufficient. The takers are taking over and one of their big weapons is anti-capitalism.

Be a maker, not a taker.
It's amazing how people mistake the USA with a free-market, capitalist economy. In a free market interest rates are decided by supply and demand, not centrally controlled by the FED. In a free market, no mult-trillion dollar FED POMO, no central bank manipulation of currencies and commodities exists. In a free market economy, when you are insolvent you declare bankruptcy, rather then receiving multi-billion dollar bailouts from the government. The economy of the USA in no way resembles free market capitalism, and has not for many decades.
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07-05-2014 , 09:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sofired
classy guy right here.
Hey mr. class let me tell you something.

I am 29 years old cancer survior from a ****ty country.
I was born poor. I had ****ty childhood and no moeny for education.
I found poker and crushed the small stackes cash game on FT.
I started to go to universite I even bought a small aparment in a ****ty neighbourhood. Then I was diagnosed with cancer ! If not for poker I coulnd not pay the corupted doctors and hospital to give me treatment. I lost everything I had but my flat. But I survived!
My ****ty country is not even giving me pesnion and I am 60% invalid by EU laws. I can't work long hours or physical labor. Some days I don't have money for food. Nobody is helping me. I play poker and yeah it is stressful and is not good for me but if not for poker I won't be able TO BUY FOOD.
You people act like life is so hard in the USA. Daniel Colman opinion is full **** if u ask me!
Let me see you guys sent me money? I am suffering... Ofc no one will send me even $5 with which I can eat 1 DAY! MY life totally sux from day one!
If not for poker I would be dead and gone now! Come on let me see you guys help somebody like me or even the more needing kids in Africa?
Is this how u redeem yourself ? BY drinking coffee in starbucks buying into dumb ideology? Or by making idiotic statemetns like Colman? Last time I eated was before 24 hours... If not for poker I should be seeling drugs, robing people or selling my body as a man hooker. You think you cool cheering for this nonses? You are not cool you just don't know how hard life could be. Even a $200 can help me live for a month like a semi-normal person. With $500 i could even buy some needed medicine. With $2000 I would be most happy person in the world and I will probably donate $500 to a oprhan home. You think you cool? You think you got heart?
Help somebody like me once in your life... what souless people man. what souless world...

Last edited by reziduer; 07-05-2014 at 09:50 PM.
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07-05-2014 , 11:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by reziduer
Hey mr. class let me tell you something.

I am 29 years old cancer survior from a ****ty country.
I was born poor. I had ****ty childhood and no moeny for education.
I found poker and crushed the small stackes cash game on FT.
I started to go to universite I even bought a small aparment in a ****ty neighbourhood. Then I was diagnosed with cancer ! If not for poker I coulnd not pay the corupted doctors and hospital to give me treatment. I lost everything I had but my flat. But I survived!
My ****ty country is not even giving me pesnion and I am 60% invalid by EU laws. I can't work long hours or physical labor. Some days I don't have money for food. Nobody is helping me. I play poker and yeah it is stressful and is not good for me but if not for poker I won't be able TO BUY FOOD.
You people act like life is so hard in the USA. Daniel Colman opinion is full **** if u ask me!
Let me see you guys sent me money? I am suffering... Ofc no one will send me even $5 with which I can eat 1 DAY! MY life totally sux from day one!
If not for poker I would be dead and gone now! Come on let me see you guys help somebody like me or even the more needing kids in Africa?
Is this how u redeem yourself ? BY drinking coffee in starbucks buying into dumb ideology? Or by making idiotic statemetns like Colman? Last time I eated was before 24 hours... If not for poker I should be seeling drugs, robing people or selling my body as a man hooker. You think you cool cheering for this nonses? You are not cool you just don't know how hard life could be. Even a $200 can help me live for a month like a semi-normal person. With $500 i could even buy some needed medicine. With $2000 I would be most happy person in the world and I will probably donate $500 to a oprhan home. You think you cool? You think you got heart?
Help somebody like me once in your life... what souless people man. what souless world...
LOL @ WTF.... #NoOneCares
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07-05-2014 , 11:19 PM
lol hahaha
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07-05-2014 , 11:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by reziduer
Hey mr. class let me tell you something.
...
Keep fighting and nh beating the cancer.
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07-06-2014 , 12:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NLSoldier
Great posts^^.

I have no issue with not wanting to give interviews to the poker media but given Dan's online reputation, his "statement" is one of the most hypocritical things I've ever read. Maybe he didn't want to give an interview because he didn't want to be asked about being one of the most predatory (to put it kindly) HU players in online poker history.

Wait you mean HU poker is a predator sport...Whats next your going to tell me that all the good players avoid each other in an attempt to never put in a bad dollar? You mean they invest in programs that help them track and abuse fish?

Yea anyone with a clue knows that investing in HU poker is a joke (unless you got lots of hours to work hard and tons of money to loose in order to get better)

I'm not defending any players actions or statements, but lets be honest, we all know poker is predatory. I have heard the Doyle's and Barry G's talk extensively about how they don't make money off other pro's in the long run, but rather make the money off the rich fish and bad players that are the true life blood of poker.

I think its funny personally, but if the 10 best HU players were the only one's playing they would all quit. There smart enough to know that they are probably a draw at best vs each other and the rake would take all their monies in the end. my sum opinion is that if that were the case they'd all take their winning and smile knowing HU was a dead game.

Does anyone else think this is true ?
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07-06-2014 , 01:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slam254
I think Coleman refusing to do an interview and hold up the bricks of cash and pose for the photo is great for poker because we're all discussing it.

If 5,000 people enter a tournament, 4,500 go home with nothing, and 500 finish in the money. Should we feel bad about the 4,500 "losers" ? absolutely not. We all know the odds up front. They are the dark underbelly, the dead money. Hey, at least they took a shot.

It's no different than a guy borrowing $300k from Uncle Carl and opening a pizza joint. There is a pretty good chance it won't make it, but the guy took a shot at his dream. Opening a restaraunt is a losing proposition but people do it every day, and few make it. Same with drilling for oil or picking stocks or making a $100m movie. Hopefully Uncle Carl had all his mental capabilities and understood the odds and could afford to lose $300k.

It's called the FREE MARKET.

And thank god a young man didn't win it and do the Matt Marifiotti ( or whatever his last name is ) interview where he brags about $1,200 jeans and being a "baller". That was nauseating. **** that guy.

I picture Daniel Coleman sitting at his laptop grinding online poker because he's smarter than the guys he's playing against. He's not a social guy. He doesn't want to get bottle service at the strip club. He doesn't want to do a little video for ESPN about his beachfront home in Malibu.

Then he wins the One Drop and declines to do the obligatory dog and pony show, I got no problem with that.

All he owes "poker" is the buy-in. Everything after that is purely voluntary.
very good post
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