this is just a useless forum full stop imo

Clearly you are an IDIOT Clayton. This is the correct forum for this specific thread, and what's ******ed is that you'd even question if it meets the gossip requirement, how ghey.

LOL, you wrote this.

david - why not make a new thread called 'Are the math players taking over?' with a similar premise and see how that does?

seems the only way to be sure

joe: ya its 5am and im back from a birthday party grinding 2p2, who cares, im just trying to elaborate why david's threads seem out of place in NVG; all they do is leave readers puzzled and annoyed. thats what the SMP forum is for, obviously.

This is the right forum if you want to reach the widest audience. This may be the wrong forum (or at least the wrong way to write the original post) if you don't want the discussion to center around the anonymous person whose opinion you are citing. It's the difference between how things "ought to be" and how they realistically function.

Have you found this attitude in younger non-math-oriented players (who are the most recognizable players who fit this label?) or is this belief generally restricted to much older players?

I suspect that some people on this forum don't think highly of Andy Bloch's game, at least, based on his televised appearances. If given the opportunity, some people (but not I) would probably label him a ridiculous calling station.

If there is a reasonable criticism of game theoretical players, I think it is something that Matt Matros (a math-y player in his own right) pointed out in his book The Making of a Poker Player: some math-based players are exploitable because they are incredibly bad at putting their opponents on a reasonable hand range. (Matros also seems to believe that some notable math players are "tell stations," so it doesn't matter if they use optimal bluffing frequency against an expert player. This criticism probably has some merit, so perhaps more players need to adopt Chris Ferguson's ritualistic approach to playing.)

FWIW, Clayton is a pretty nice guy, AFAIK. More than a few 2p2rs would say the same, IMO. ATM, I'm agreeing with Clayton's post, LOL.

Plus, look at the guy's avatar. Come on...

David, I'm not going to hate on you personally, just please consider what people's responses will be before you make threads like this. I can understand how in your mind this story sounds juicy and newsworthy, because you KNOW who the person is that made the comments. Since we don't, this thread becomes a failure.

I rather enjoyed this thread.

actually many people who have read David's past threads already know the answer. This is an old topic revisited, and I find it much more interesting than talking about XYZ who doesn't wash his hands after going to the bathroom at the Bellagio.

Where's that guy who thinks the posters on 2+2 who are atheists are just copying Sklansky because everyone on this site shamelessly worships DS?

I am talking about these three players specifically. None of them play a highly volatile game so their immense success cannot be attributable totally to luck. My guess is that part of their success can be attributed to well timed but rare bluffs. In any case it is dumb to believe in the face of great evidence that these guys don't know something most pros don't. (Example: You are in the cutoff with 8 big blinds. You know that the three players behind you will call a move in with any pair or any two cards above a nine. Should you move in with K4 suited? I guarantee Chris Ferguson knows the answer and the fellow I was talking to doesn't.)

I actually argued this point with him but he remained adament that his overall impression of them makes up for things like that. But results say otherwise.

I'll ask him today if I can out him.

The foreign idioms and accents ITT are hard for me to understand, but I think, if "pooh pooh" = "1, 2 teddy", then OP is saying that at least one tunamelt hotshot is continuing to pwn the mathy types.

Should you raise 2.2 bb ?

Shipping is so 2006.

The thread is not that bad if you only read the 1st and last page. No wait I changed my mind. it still sucks

lolol

most likely ppl to have said this

phil hellmuth
mike matusow
haralobob

See the 01/01/07 episode of The Circuit, w/ special co-host Daniel Negreanu and guest Bill Chen.

corrected for the math guys

lol. give me a break.

the sklansky hate is misdirected imo.

Thanks Daniel, post more! So that's who OP is speaking of, Phil Ivey?

Pretty sure its Joe Sebok.

*

FYP