I think most people are well aware that howards using misdirection. It's obvious that the board of directors was totally incompetent and apathetic and basically didn't care what was going on as long as the money was coming in and they did as little work as possible. I've said it before but this can't be understated, letting poker players run the company doomed them from the start. Stars knew better, they used them to endorse but never to actually run the company, nor did party poker.

Thanks for the clarification on the Gus Hansen situation
Great guy indeed
wow Erick lindgren is one big POS

just saw on twitter, if allready posted plz delete

The Lederer Files: 30% Truth, 30% Plausible Deniability, 30% Lies, and 10% ****ing Bull****.

Source: http://www.reddit.com/r/poker/commen..._30_plausible/

Unless the 2nd amended complaint (I haven't had the time to study it yet) mentions more unidentified co-conspirators (UCCs) then there are references to two specific UCCs. Given what these two are alleged to have done, most likely UCC #1 is Lederer and UCC #2 is Gil Coronado.

Other than this small point, IMO you have been spot on ITT.

Given what has been alleged, I really don't understand why Coronado isn't facing charges in Alderney. If I had to guess, I'd say it was because Alderney is more anxious to hush up problems with its licencing of gambling than it is to seek justice for players or against licensees.

The money came from Chris Ferguson

lol at Juanda, 2nd biggest shareholder did not want to sign the deal then going on record saying he was happy the deal was done lol bible salesman FTW

FYP

DTM you are correct about the criminal complaint referencing only 2 UCCs. I missed this error in my pre-post review of the post. Thanks for catching it.

What I should have said was that it likely the UCCs from the criminal complaint are HL, CF or RF. More likely HL and CF. I did not consider Gil Coronado, but he's certainly on the short list for consideration. Given the allegations he and HL do seem the more likely suspects.

And yeah, Alderney just wants it all to go away.....it wasn't supposed to be this hard!

Kind of late for me to think this one thru straight so feel free to reinterpret. Ferguson has 9 million that he hasn't taken out of the company and roughly 5 million recently paid. This is soon after BF.

It seems to me every amount in someone's name isn't worth the face value once the company can't pay people. It's just non-randomly assigned numbers at that point.

For instance Howard's 300K extra payment is because player accounts are just unbacked numbers at that point.

So why should Ferguson get much credit for "giving the 9 million back" to the company? I mean yay he wasn't a scumbag for EDogging it but this isn't some huge magnanimous gesture imo. The company owes more than they have- thus any money they currently have wrt to any particular individual isn't equal to face value. It's just a name and a number sitting there, albeit possibly in an account that hasn't been seized.

They asked the entire player base to go without their complete balances, and somehow Ferguson saying ah yeah that disbursement I would never ever take that I probably have no legitimate claim to now- go ahead and use it productively for the company- I mean that's the ****ing best anyone does?

Don't get me wrong it's a massive massive number, and includes 5 million real money shipped back, but pales compared to the shortfall, and basically they said hey Chris do you mind not being a complete scumbag and he said okay sure.

It's telling of the enormous douchebaggery they had in ownership that somehow that act is a glorious shining moment among all acts.

And somehow Howard feeling bad for Chris being in that position irritates the hell out of me because it implies to a certain degree that Chris got shafted because he hadn't taken and spent/buried/edodged/notmyproblemed the money yet.

Actually, you're one of the few that has displayed such childlike naïveté. Or am I mistaking disingenuousness for naïveté?

Don't know why Juanda didn't want to sign the deal or if that is even true. However Juanda is probably super pissed that the concerns he initially raised about Bitar being not the right person to the head a very large and growing company were correct and not being able to apparently do anything about it cost him probably hundreds of millions.

All of you praising Chris Ferguson for living frugal and not being greedy is insane. He was in charge of a company that swindled over $300 million dollars and he spent $40 million instead of the $52 million he alloted himself (or thereabouts). I wonder if Howard Lederer could convince you all that Bernie Madoff was living frugal because after he stole $100 billion he only spent $2 billion and kept the rest in company accounts?

While Bitar may not have been paid as a director of Tiltware, he was paid something between $55K and $110K/month as a director of Pocket Kings, in addition to his salary.

FYP

I agree with this. Noah, any good guess what is going to come of those board members in the shadows with their millions right now? (guessing nothing of course)

Ok what I don't get about all of this and its prob minor at this point but....
Someone borrows money then receives their full payment and gets to repay loan whenever they want? I don't know but isn't it logical to hold payments until loans are paid back? Ok don't want your pro walking around broke.. Take half maybe?

Another thing that is odd to me and Barry G is a good guy and I almost hate to question his intent but he is guilty of this. Say I borrow money from a friend who has flaws. If I don't agree with what I think he is going to do with the money when I pay him back, I don't have to pay him? Or I can say go to rehab and I'll pay you? I don't know I think some prob had good intentions but in the end they gave the scumbags an out. If a upstanding guy like Barry in the poker community is doing it, then the scum can do it and it's hard to question them if Barry gets a pass.

Heard Edog bet $2 million that Richard M. Nixon's middle name was Moe.

I agree with apefish and Rob999 about Ferguson.

HL claims that CF received 5 million in April'11, and still had 9 mil in a FT bank account. I just don't see how it makes him a goddamn saint to return stolen money, when he was legally and morally obligated to do so.

Guess Howie feels it is ok to keep stolen money, apparently the DoJ does not as they are going after his assets now.

I think this is a very interesting point. What was the date he resigned?

+1. Howard saying something to the effect...(I don't know anyone on the planet that would be this magnanimous.) Let's see they stole $300 million and Chris' cut was about $55 million. He leaves $12 million behind to try and save the company so maybe he can make millions upon millions more. WOW!! What a guy.

Is this the same James Bord behind the Pokerfarm? Didn't he have an altercation with John Juanda at the WSOP in 2011?

Sigh,

I'm so depressed about all of this stuff. I used to stand up for poker players to everyone who asked me about them. "A poker player's word is trustworthy." "Why would sites cheat when they are just printing money." etc. etc. Now, I just hang my head and sigh.

I have always enjoyed my conversations with Howard. Someone in this thread mentioned that he doesn't seem intelligent. Howard is almost always the smartest guy in the room. Because of that, I have no reason to believe that any of the stuff he's saying is true. There's no way he's not up to his neck in all of this. "I don't know." "I can't speculate." "I wasn't involved in that." I felt like he was more genuine in part 6, but the amount that he seems to be shirking responsibility really gets under my skin.

RE: Lindgren, similar thing. I always liked Erik and we've always been friendly in our interactions. He's been around the San Diego area the last few months, since not long after the fantasy football thread came out. I haven't seen him the last month or 2, but he told me he moved out to Rancho Santa Fe where the San Diego elite live: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rancho_...Fe,_California I dunno why I'm sharing this, I guess it just depresses me that people could be so casual about the money they've taken and just not think they did anything wrong.

Then again, I'm not sure what I'd do if I were the average share holder in FTP. I probably would have been complacent and happy that all this money was coming in and I really had to do no real work to receive it. I'd like to think I'd give whatever money back that I still had, but when it really comes down to it, everyone who's saying that it would be super easy and automatic is kidding themselves. It's hard to give up that much money just like that.

I used to kick myself because I had a bunch of money laying around having just won a WSOP event at age 22 and FTP was just getting off the ground. It would have been easy to invest I'm sure. I'm glad I didn't get involved, otherwise I'd be in this mess too.

The way I understood what Howard said is that the 9 million wasn't in an FTP player account, it was in a bank account earmarked for Chris. It was money that was "owed" him in disbursements he hadn't taken yet. Therefore, it was 9 mega in real money that was "his" and he allowed them to use it to bridge the gap to a Stars deal.

Someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but he never resigned from the BoD.

i assume part 7 isnt up yet?