You guys are the ones who claim to know the markets, the hustles, getting an edge & all that

So, if you're so smart, what is preventing you from rolling out a "poker renaissance" that transcends past this insulated community, & breaks right on through into mainstream pop culture awareness? Wouldn't that be profitable? W/ all that you guys claim to bring to the table?

So look. From what I can see, the entertainment/pop culture game is different animal. It requires a different set of skills to pop off in that realm that what you have labbed up.

So, bring in an *entertainment specialist*. Don't you know that's a thing? Somebody the casuals would wanna watch. I mean, all of the casuals.

Alright. That's all I wanted to say right now. & can the mods get right off my stones & let this stand. Ty

Poker was already big time mainstream with countless poker TV shows and huge fields at the WSOP. Then the powerful forces like Adelson's money came out of the woodwork and shut down a lot of the industry. Power likes the status quo and doesn't want it to change.

But as more states start legalizing online poker (to get that much needed money), and with Interstate poker now legal, it's probably just a matter of time before America's game returns to its former glory.

The best poker has is Landon Tice and that's the problem

I appreciate the couple of responses I've got here

But, to make it more clear, I'm saying, if you could upstage like, a "Lady Gaga", wouldn't you just do it? By now? & take over.

The ppl who are really smart & are pulling the strings will understand. Thanks

In short poker player aren’t that smart cuz if ur smart u wouldn’t play poker for a living in today’s environment. Way more money in other industry than poker now. 10 years ago or even 5 years is a lot different unless ur a live crusher. Ppl grinding online poker in 2021 is terrible unless u live in a 3rd world country or u live in PA or some America state that is soft as f or u have juicy home games. If ur grinding on stars for a living I feel bad for u. Prayer �� u find another skill n make more money in that industry than poker

It’s been tried and failed. Sure you can pay CR7 and Kevin Hart to promote poker. But then you realize it’s all just insufferable slobs with terrible hygiene and the illusion gets shattered pretty quick. Poker isn’t cool, young people aren’t into it. If they want to play some casual poker they will just play socially with friends. There are a lot of more attractive ways to make money if you’re young and intelligent. Look at the demographic when you walk into a poker room. A lot of old, fat, smelly guys who you’d actually have to pay someone to get near. I feel sorry for you if you’re holding out for a second poker boom.

Poker doesn't need some mainstream pop celebrity, do casuals really want to watch Dwayne Johnson donk off a bunch of money to pros?

The lack of interest in watching poker streams is a problem. Which is probably a result of most poker streamers lacking much personality. Poker needs a Dr Disrespect/XQC type of streamer who can attract the eyeballs of younger people on Twitch.

The best thing that could happen to poker is someone like XQC deciding to get into it for even just a few months. Maybe GG or Stars should look into putting together a streamer tournament, similar to the Pogchamps events for chess.

Chess went thru a huge boom during the pandemic by attracting popular streamers from different games to compete against each other.

Its not good enough to invite a few streamers like Alex Botez and Hafu to a 25k buyin WPT Heads Up event where they are playing true pros and get crushed in Rd 1. All the eyeballs they brought for that match left as soon as they were eliminated.

Re: you need your own "Dr. Disrespect"

That's exactly right. But why bother trying to entice somebody already, if you could just create your own mega-superstar? You guys have the infrastructure & the means to do it easily. You just need to find the person w/ the chops to actually pull it off.

Who is suitable? I'd argue, it would be somebody that has planned up a career's worth of meta-leading entertainment strats for 20 years. It's like, the only thing they've done. But they pulled it off. So when they emerge from their secret lab deep in the woods & showcase a miraculous string of moves, the likes of which has never been seen from a "Nobody", coming from an angle that nobody on Earth expects, then, if enough ppl just "play along", & go w/ it, 💥boom💥, it's done.

That would be such a legend, if it actually happened, the thing would snowball on its own. & yah, somebody like that would know exactly how to get the youth on board, too. You just gotta do things in a unique way that isn't been done before.

But alright, thanks for responding. I think I've said enough for now. Just a guy taking a shot here, that's all🎩peace

Why would someone want to stream poker when they can stream slots and blackjack tho? The gambling sites even give them tons of money to blast. No one wants to watch some idiot fold 80% of the time just to play a monumentally boring hand once every hour. Seriously, not even poker players want to watch poker on twitch. To the average viewer there’s as much skill involved in slots as there is in poker.

And there are some pretty significant distinctions between chess and poker which allowed chess to take off. I don’t think poker would experience the same growth even under similar conditions.

If poker had another Rounders or Queen's Gambit it would be super huge again. Chess YT channels get 1mm++ subs now.

It's not easy to make a great movie or show. They had been trying to adapt Queen's Gambit for film/TV for >30 years before it was released on Netflix. That type of thing is mostly RNG.

Casinos also don't promote poker like they used to. I never see ads for poker in PA but I see tons for sports betting and casino games which is unfortunate but whatever. If they just shifted their marketing budgets slightly poker would be in a sick place.

You make a lot of good reads here imo. What poker can have - easily - is the meta leader of rock music kicking unbelievable ass, where the poker community is the *backdrop*. Therefore, you can get an unfathomable amount of 👀 on it *vicariously*. There's a lot more to it, even.

There's a lot of dominos already set up. I'm talking some complex blueprints. But it all checks out. All poker would have to do is push em over. & it'd be as easy for them as a flick of their pinky finger.

But alright. I mean, it's outta my hands at the moment. But hopefully, you'll see some of what I'm talking about in effect soon👍thx for the comment

A poker streamer tournament should be hu knockout. Maybe first have a group format to give everyone a bit of airtime, just like it was in pogchamps. It would be even better if the game was something fresh and new. Like if you win a pot you get to shoot their tank. I think the reason why casinos aren't interested in creating more skill games is that some of the money would leave the platform. Slots make more money for the owners. Still, I do think this is a small market hole. Some up-and-coming gambling site might be interested.

It comes down to swag aka what you bring to the table. Being good at poker is the wrong side of the brain to be entertaining/extrovert.

I don't make the rules.

Also you're from Prov? I'm from Newport.

You would need a hybrid that can both conceptualize deep concepts and be funny.

That is super hard to do. You might have 10 people in the lower 48 that can actually put pen to paper. Not an easy task.

Most good players are nerds, most bad players are scrubs.

There's a few in between but if you are talking about elites, don't hold your breath.

Lmao. Casinos don’t promote poker like they used to because it’s a terribly inefficient use of their advertising resources. It’s not a difficult or complicated concept. Slots + table games generate a boatload of revenue. Poker is a tiny fraction of that. It’s like you’re first picking the kid in a wheelchair while they get Lebron.

If I understand your post correctly:

The persona in question, & the premise of the programming, has no interest in being "good" at poker. They play for fun. So that should cover the concerns you raise here.

@edenrockscorp on the bird app, if you wanna meet up & talk shop. That might be cool. Just suggesting that based on the novelty of us being in the same space👍peace

Eden, your response makes sense, however the mechanism and scale of marketing has changed IMO. I don't work in marketing, but to entice a boom you need to execute on the level ledn mentions here.

(I also have RI ties - Gansett, be there next month, small world)

There's a lot of people that are somewhat good at poker and entertaining.

You have guys like Doug Polk or Dnegs that while good at poker, when it comes to banter. Will get spin cycled.

A lot of people that are well known would crumble against someone that knows how to get under someone's skin.

Good to see some RI people representing.

I'm talking about someone that is both entertaining and good at poker. There's not many people like that in mainstream poker.

Alright, I guess we gotta hold a council of the RI Poker Ppl Meeting of the Minds next month😂& delegate huge decisions

To hammer another point down, being "good" at poker is entirely irrelevant w/ regards to what I am proposing. In fact, I'd argue that the premise of having the game so figured out is actually a deterrent towards growing interest in the game, & intimidates casuals on various fronts (as well as being extremely boring to them). So, having somebody big represent the completely opposite position could work wonders🎩

But alright, thx

The problem with poker is that there's too much money involved for any casual person to get into. It's the same reason you won't see a "golf renaissance" or a "horseback riding" renaissance. Many are risk averse and would rather throw away 200 dollars on a night out than use 200 dollar to buy into the local 1/2 game.

It's because people don't like hustlers. They respect honesty and hard work, and they generally can't conceive of much else. I have a phonebook / contacts list full of people who don't have health insurance, hardly pay taxes, and are constantly asking me if I have people for their app game.

Don Johnson (of Atlantic City blackjack fame) says it best. You can't build a business based on other people's demise.

The problem is, whoever this mythical person is, they have to:

1) Be good enough to play high stakes
2) Be engaging and entertaining enough to attract viewers
3) Be hard working enough to have consistent streaming

The great poker players make enough from poker and value their individual freedom too much to focus on 2+3. The people who fit 2+3 usually can't meet criteria #1. Lex is probably the closest to meeting all the criteria you've asked for here.

The difference with (say) chess, is that it's frankly way more lucrative to be a successful streamer than kill yourself to get to be #50 in the world in chess. People like Botez are (in the chess world) frankly small potatoes, and she has way more financial incentive to build a channel than try to improve her chess. For a poker player, spending that time getting better at poker is much more likely to lead to financial reward.

.... and their marketing heads would be in a new place, out looking for work.

Casinos "used to" promote poker to bring bodies into the place.

The key you ignore is that online/mobile sports betting and casino are more profitable for an operator who can offer them on mobile/online now than is poker, live or online.

The best players in my live games hardly say a word at the table and just silently take other peoples' money. It would be boring as f for your average rec. Live pros seriously need to work on the entertainment value they bring to the game. Or they should just play online. That was the appeal of personalities like DNegs and Hellmuth - they were characters who entertained with their antics. Today's poker personalities are a far cry from the legends of the past.