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Old 06-01-2012, 07:53 AM   #101
Blizzuff
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Originally Posted by LOL POT-ODDS View Post
what point are you even trying to make in this post? i bet you're the kind of guy who insults young players when they sit down at a poker table in a hoodie and shades...

but hey like 95% of this forum must be wrong right? i guess we're all just 'haters'.
lol @ you thinking I'm some old bitter poker player.

You should scroll up and read Matt Glantz's post a few times until it sinks on. Actually, don't do that, just keep playing the role of cliche 2p2 poker guy, thanks.
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Old 06-01-2012, 08:48 AM   #102
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

Just wow. Did he misplay those hands? Yes. But who here hasn't made epic mistakes when they were new to the game. If he's succesfull: good for him. Why all the hate, I thought good players don't tap the glass.

Andy, I sincerely hope you win another bracelet this season just to piss off all the haters.
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Old 06-01-2012, 09:25 AM   #103
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Originally Posted by llllegolas View Post
Frankenberger can crush your soul.

Skip to 14.50...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6fbGSrdBOM

lol hilarious
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Old 06-01-2012, 09:27 AM   #104
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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ROFL

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Old 06-01-2012, 10:15 AM   #105
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

I love Andy because he made Feldman cry.

I coudn't care less how good or bad he is, who should care about this anyway?

Just let him win his WPT's WSOP etc.. dont be frustrated
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Old 06-01-2012, 10:20 AM   #106
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

I know the guy has made some bad plays and got lucky some, we all do, but he has had an amazing couple of years and consistently making deep runs. He must be doing something right.
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Old 06-01-2012, 10:25 AM   #107
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Originally Posted by Matt Glantz View Post
It's is important to realize there are many different ways to win at poker. Most big winning players have sound fundamentals and take what are considered by most of us as 'standard' lines almost all the time. But there are other big winning poker players like Andy, Grinder, Hellmuth and Gus Hansen that come to mind. These players rarely take the 'standard' line and are successful due to things that are harder to quantify, but just as effective.

Whenever I see any of these guys make a play that I don't understand and it looks bad on its face, I always try to break it down and figure out what they were doing. Obviously everyone makes mistakes and sometimes the plays are just bad, but most of the time I wind up coming to a conclusion that further educates me about the game.
This x 10000

I am amazed at the hate/jealousy towards Frankenberger itt. sure he's butchered a few hands along the way (unlike everyone itt of course) but he's clearly doing a lot right, hence the continual strong results. It's just that he plays a very unorthodox style, and appears to play on feel a lot. Not suprising that internet crowd struggle to get this.

His utter crushing of Feldman heads up (loved it when he folded pre flop like one time, and Feldman happened to have AA) is one of the most soul-owning displays I have seen in televised HU play.

As for the qq fold, i think people are being really harsh here - yes it was not his finest play, but he's still pretty new to the game, right? Flanked either side by world class players, utg Mizzi opens, Frankenberger 3 bets from utg +1, timenshenko stays in play. frankenberger presumably manages to convince himself that he's up against AA/KK after such strong early action hasn't chased everyone else out of the hand. I know that he still has to call given the pot odds alone, but as said, he appears to play primarily on feel - and it works for him. (Disclamier - not excusing the play, just trying to understand his thought process.)

I'm a fan. just imagine what a beast he could become once he gets his fundamentals right - that's the easy part. the part the he already seems to be strong at, well..... hard to teach that shi-iit
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Old 06-01-2012, 10:33 AM   #108
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

I like Andy, I think he's a good guy and I hope his rush can continue, but I also think he overrates himself

Quote:
Andy Frankenberger ‏@AMFrankenberger
To the fantasy drafters who passed on me two years in a row: thank you for the added motivation!
I can't help but wonder if he really is serious: sure he has won an event, but that was his only cash in 2011 and he only had a small cash in 2010.
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Old 06-01-2012, 11:24 AM   #109
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Originally Posted by never fade View Post

His utter crushing of Feldman heads up (loved it when he folded pre flop like one time, and Feldman happened to have AA) is one of the most soul-owning displays I have seen in televised HU play.
You call K10 beating KQ all in pre utter domination? I'm glad he beat Feldman too but let's get real here.
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Old 06-01-2012, 11:30 AM   #110
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

Frankenberger is the Tearjerker


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X6fbGSrdBOM
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Old 06-01-2012, 11:40 AM   #111
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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You call K10 beating KQ all in pre utter domination? I'm glad he beat Feldman too but let's get real here.

No. i call that ONE hand
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Old 06-01-2012, 11:50 AM   #112
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

I love the way people are calling his play creative and unconventional as if he's a level 6 thinker or something.

The guy's just clicking buttons FFS
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Old 06-01-2012, 11:52 AM   #113
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Thumbs up Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Originally Posted by ineedacoach View Post
You call K10 beating KQ all in pre utter domination? I'm glad he beat Feldman too but let's get real here.
Have you watched the entire HU? He absolutely crushed Feldman, put him on complete tilt and made him cry. He destroyed him.
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Old 06-01-2012, 11:59 AM   #114
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Have you watched the entire HU? He absolutely crushed Feldman, put him on complete tilt and made him cry. He destroyed him.
Yeah, I've watched it and I agree with you. I loved seeing that jizzrag getting torn apart, but in the K10 vs KQ hand, Feldman would have had a big lead if he had won. I wouldn't call that destroying him. It was getting lucky in a huge and vital pot.
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Old 06-01-2012, 01:41 PM   #115
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Glad to see Matt G give his thoughts on this. Well respected.

Fully believe a winning online player can be a winning live player especially with some adjustments with live experience etc (and not necessarily the other way around).

However, the two games are different. The player pool is different. Being able to see players adds another complicated dimension. What may be seen as a standard play online may not be best live play given the player type and dynamics.

I heard the Juanda was heavily criticized at WPT FT recently for several non standard plays. Really? The guy is world class. Yeah he might butcher one hand here and there. Who doesnt? But his feel is incredible. Watched his headsup bracelet win vs Hellmuth in 2-7 last year at WSOP. He was amazing.

I've made some ******ed looking laydowns, calls, and wierd lines that were optimal at the time given players and dynamics.

I played a sick 5-10 NL hand vs Dave Tuchman (LATB) couple years ago.

Dave checked the turn back on a wet, flush-straight draw board with a set-something that is defintely non-standard. I had flopped top set. I read him for major strength on flop and just "knew" he would never check turn so was going for turn CR.

River was a blank. I bet. Thought my flop read was wrong so looking to induce or get thin value. Dave made a long crying call with set and lost the absolute minimum. I felt like I got owned for not winning more as we both were deep. I was reading him for strength on flop but he mentioned later he read me for major strength as well. Hence his turn check.

The beauty of poker is its complexity- there are more than one way to successfully play a hand and certainly more than one winning style of play.

The other appealing aspect of poker is the continuous learning process. Having a rigidity in thinking that this is "standard" limits growth.

Matt Glantz echoes his thoughts on this in Cardplayer Scoop interview as well.

Good luck on continued success Andy...

Last edited by Captain Freedom; 06-01-2012 at 02:09 PM.
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Old 06-01-2012, 04:34 PM   #116
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

Did you and Dave make da love for hours after?
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Old 06-01-2012, 11:38 PM   #117
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

Glantz can post whatever but that doesn't mean he's right. Unconventional play is one thing, but ******ed is another. But hey, AF has luckboxed a handful of tournaments, so he must be doing something right. Nobody ever does that without some serious talent.
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Old 06-01-2012, 11:59 PM   #118
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Originally Posted by Captain Freedom View Post
I heard the Juanda was heavily criticized at WPT FT recently for several non standard plays. Really? The guy is world class. Yeah he might butcher one hand here and there. Who doesnt? But his feel is incredible.
Quote:
John Juanda ‏@LuckBoxJuanda
Thanks 4 the support @realcharder30 &everyone else. I did play poorly so deserved criticism.
Maybe you have to be good enough to know when you play poorly.
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Old 06-02-2012, 04:40 AM   #119
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

Knocked Andy out of a $525 stt last night at the rio. I can't recall any of his televised play so I can't comment on that but I didn't see anything bad in his play last night.
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Old 06-02-2012, 05:25 AM   #120
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

I have only played with Frankenberger once (lol sample size) but he seemed like a very nice guy, who despite having had a ton of recent success (this was last year during WSOP), was as focused and grinding as hard as anyone at the table.
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Old 06-02-2012, 06:14 AM   #121
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

He totally destroyed Feldman. The big bluff with A9o was the turning point in the match obviously. The hand worked out fine in the end for Frankenburger; nevertheless I think shoving pre would've been a lot better than just calling. If a non-paired board would've run out, shipping it after the second barrel with ace high is a lot tougher.
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Old 06-02-2012, 07:52 AM   #122
skJacob
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Originally Posted by chasepoker View Post
I agree bad players win tournaments however bad players do not consistently win tournaments.

Lol at your steps to be a HS tournament pro you missed work really hard at your game and have natural talent, but hey yeah apart from that its easy as...
The QQ hand pretty much shows he's oblivious to the concept of pot odds. Man, he must have worked hard on his game!

He clicks buttons based on his feels. His feels are probably naturally better than most people and he likes clicking raise, so when he runs good he can get a lot of chips and win.
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Old 06-02-2012, 08:27 AM   #123
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

Pic of me in HS:



NOT ANDY FRANKENBERGER! But we do look a lot alike.

If he's had more success in 2 years than I have in 30 plus .... he must be a calling station, donkey, luckbox on a heater.

I mean .... he must be doing SOMETHING right. Right? Besides being handsome, like me.

ETA: Quick answers to anticipated questions: 1986, The Subhumans, and yeah ... I prolly was one of the first ppl ever with a faux-hawk.

Last edited by afwoods; 06-02-2012 at 08:36 AM.
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Old 06-02-2012, 08:43 AM   #124
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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Originally Posted by skJacob View Post
The QQ hand pretty much shows he's oblivious to the concept of pot odds. Man, he must have worked hard on his game!

He clicks buttons based on his feels. His feels are probably naturally better than most people and he likes clicking raise, so when he runs good he can get a lot of chips and win.
I remember a conversation after a tournament I won once .... was either Stars or FTP. After the game, this guy messaged me, "You aren't as good as you think you are." and at one point I said, "When I am getting cards, I am unstoppable." and he said, "Everyone is unstoppable when they are getting cards."

I would disagree. Some people can't play good cards well. Because of their table image, they wont get paid off.
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Old 06-02-2012, 08:55 AM   #125
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Re: How does Andy Frankenberger do it?

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NOT ANDY FRANKENBERGER! But we do look a lot alike.
Yeah, you're like 2 peas in a pod....WTF
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