What's the left's solution? - Page 2 - Politics and Society -- Two Plus Two Poker Forums

I think you all kind of need to look at plausible short-term solutions. Long-term policy initiatives like gun control are not going to do a whole lot right now. Besides, I'm not sure how you would enforce that without more police activity.

The reality is you have a demoralized police with demonstrable evidence of reduced policing, and corresponding increase in homicides. Should some mayors be losing their jobs right now?

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07-09-2020 , 11:12 AM

#27

lagtight

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Max Cut

wanted to throw money at education but the right balked. now we have "you".

Defunding public "higher education" would be kewl.

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07-09-2020 , 11:12 AM

#28

Max Cut

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Originally Posted by itshotinvegas

That's not the reality.

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07-09-2020 , 11:13 AM

#29

Max Cut

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Originally Posted by lagtight

Defunding public "higher education" would be kewl.

No, it wouldn't. But very significant reforms are warranted.

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07-09-2020 , 12:38 PM

#30

well named

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Lots of ideas about police reform have been posted elsewhere. I think social unrest leads to increases in crime. I also think police departments responding to protests by refusing to do their jobs is not something that reflects all that well on them (cf. this paper), but it's also not an argument against reform. You could take it as an argument for reform.

But I actually opened this thread to post this, by way of other ideas:

Joe Biden’s surprisingly visionary housing plan, explained

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According to original modeling by Columbia University scholars, it could cut child poverty by a third, narrow racial opportunity gaps, and potentially drive progress on the broader middle-class affordability crisis in the largest coastal cities as well.

The centerpiece is simple. Take America’s biggest rental assistance program — Section 8 housing vouchers — and make it available to every family who qualifies. The current funding structure leaves out around 11 million people, simply because the pot allocated by Congress is too small. Then pair it with regulatory changes to help the housing market work better for more people. It’s the general consensus approach among top Democratic Party politicians and left-of-center policy wonks.

In general, it fits with the idea I've advocated before of looking for ways to address economic inequality through universal programs. I was also a fan of Booker's baby bonds idea.

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07-09-2020 , 12:47 PM

#31

MrWookie

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Quote:

Originally Posted by lagtight

Defunding public "higher education" would be kewl.

Sorry bro, but we're gonna keep on funding public universities even if teaching people that the world isn't 6000 years old makes you sad.

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07-09-2020 , 12:57 PM

#32

RFlushDiamonds

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Quote:

Federal housing assistance is something of a patchwork of different programs that includes the Section 8 voucher system, which arose in the mid-1970s when the Nixon and Ford administrations introduced it to incorporate market-oriented reforms into the welfare state.

This whole using tax payer money to benefit slum lords who then complain the property taxes on their rental units are too high is just another example of corporate welfare.

It would be cheaper and easier for the government to build/buy/provide housing but here in the US we just can't do anything the easy way, can we ?

The title thread is what's the left's solution but that's an example of right wing nonsense.

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07-09-2020 , 01:00 PM

#33

RFlushDiamonds

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Quote:

Originally Posted by itshotinvegas

The reality is you have a demoralized police with demonstrable evidence of reduced policing, and corresponding increase in homicides. Should some mayors be losing their jobs right now?

Poor po pos.

When companies lay off employees and the stock price goes up should CEO's lose their jobs ?

Asking for a friend.

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07-09-2020 , 01:18 PM

#34

MrWookie

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Quote:

Originally Posted by itshotinvegas

In most professions, if workers stop doing their jobs, they're the ones who get fired.

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07-09-2020 , 01:35 PM

#35

Kelhus100

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Originally Posted by MrWookie

In most professions, if workers stop doing their jobs, they're the ones who get fired.

LOL.

NY is refusing to let officers retire right now.

They are trying to simultaneously cut police budgets, freeze hiring, reduce salaries, and wage a PR war against the department at the same time the job is becoming increasingly difficult due to public sentiment.

In most professions if companies management had such a strategy with predictably poor response from their employees, they would probably be the ones getting fired right now.

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07-09-2020 , 01:47 PM

#36

5 south

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Originally Posted by RFlushDiamonds

It's called the projects and I hear it's not a nice place to live. Shoving all the poor people into one place seems like it causes some issues. Would be nice to give some people the option to leave some of these neighborhoods like they probably dream of but doubt it's going to happen. What about my property values!!

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07-09-2020 , 01:48 PM

#37

5 south

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Originally Posted by Kelhus100

didn't know the police had stop loss

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07-09-2020 , 01:57 PM

#38

Kelhus100

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Originally Posted by 5 south

didn't know the police had stop loss

I admit I don't know what you mean with this statement. I am not saying you are right or wrong, I legitimately don't know what you are saying.

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07-09-2020 , 02:03 PM

#39

5 south

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Originally Posted by Kelhus100

I admit I don't know what you mean with this statement. I am not saying you are right or wrong, I legitimately don't know what you are saying.

Just saying it reminds me of the poor bastards during the Iraq war whose tour and time in the military was up but had to continue on because the military was spread thin. Stop loss

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07-09-2020 , 03:58 PM

#40

RFlushDiamonds

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelhus100

LOL

Poor po pos.

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07-09-2020 , 03:59 PM

#41

RFlushDiamonds

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Originally Posted by 5 south

That's a separate issue but yeah. No one said it's good to be poor, even if you get a hand from Uncle Sam.

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07-09-2020 , 04:03 PM

#42

lagtight

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Originally Posted by MrWookie

Sorry bro, but we're gonna keep on funding public universities even if teaching people that the world isn't 6000 years old makes you sad.

Hey, bro, I suspect you're right.

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07-09-2020 , 04:10 PM

#43

lagtight

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So, police can be FIRED, but can't quit?

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07-09-2020 , 04:19 PM

#44

Kelhus100

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Originally Posted by lagtight

So, police can be FIRED, but can't quit?

In NYC right now it appears this is exactly the dynamic.

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07-09-2020 , 04:23 PM

#45

goofyballer

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Originally Posted by itshotinvegas

If you don't come up with a message, Trump is going to pin it on the left.

Not sure why this sentence is conditional, Trump's statements aren't particularly connected to the truth or to what "the left" is actually doing.

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07-09-2020 , 04:24 PM

#46

EADGBE

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Source? All I'm seeing is stuff about retirements being way up and now there is a lag in processing. I don't see anything about they "can't" retire?

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07-09-2020 , 04:26 PM

#47

Kelhus100

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Originally Posted by RFlushDiamonds

LOL

Poor po pos.

Whatever your thoughts of police officers themselves, it is widely understood by most serious social scientists (with the notable exception of critical theory based disciplines) that an effective, non corrupt policing force is probably one of the most necessary components of a relatively peaceful, functional capitalist state.

And of course vulnerable, disadvantaged groups will feel the brunt of non having this the most, which is what we are seeing right now.

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07-09-2020 , 04:30 PM

#48

wet work

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelhus100

Right now in the city here they have a goal of having ~3500cops. When you account for guys out sick long-term/leaving/no one wanting to take the job anymore(not exactly getting the creme of the crop in that scenario--just looking for warm bodies

) etc the force is really ~22-2300 iirc. And it's not just a current event--it's been an issue building for years. "Management" has changed numerous times over the(and including several+ times in recent) years. The problems are much deeper than that.

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07-09-2020 , 04:46 PM

#49

RFlushDiamonds

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelhus100

You mean the vulnerable, disadvantaged groups will feel the brunt of not having a militarized police force riding through their neighborhood in armored vehicles ?

Your conservative compassion is touching though.
I have a little tear in my eye right now.