victor if Belarus government had wanted to ally with Europe why the hell would we have organized a color revolution lol.

we did because the people wanted Europe, the crony corrupted leaders without popular support didn't.

the leaders managed to stay in power dictatorially, and then went allin pro Russia for self defense (of the leaders)

I expounded on it as did Luciom. What you said is nonsense. Do I really need to point out which parts are half truths and which parts are Victor anti west fan fic? If you want to leave it at this then fine. If you want to try to argue your ludicrous framing of what happened then feel free to do so.

Luciom: Victor is an imperialist bootlicker. Any attempt at overthrowing corrupt governments is automatically done by nazis (probably fomented by the west) and is an unlawful coup. Their only moral option in Victor's mind is to let it happen.

so no reasons, no cites. I guess we are done here.

I however, can provide them. bc I know more than you. I read more than you. I understand more than you.



https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...e-russia-talks



https://www.reuters.com/article/idUSKBN1WB2J3/



you think you can guess in this timeline when Belarus agreed to the Russian bases on their territory?

Cool, I never denied this. What point do you think you're making? I don't not see how this helps to prove your fanfiction that the west just denied Belarus (for reasons you neglect to mention although your article thankfully does) and then tried to "color revolution" (probably Victor code for coup) him.

Decided to trace a few of the more common Russian propaganda narratives we saw since aid was passed.

Current propaganda narrative straight from the Kremlin:

https://www.barrons.com/news/us-aid-...emlin-11253130












Amplified by far right and MAGA













Here Snyder breaks down the common Russian propaganda narratives, the first 4 of which were parroted by several ITT: Ukrainians are nazis, Nato caused this, Ukraine is corrupt, Democracies can't do anything to change the outcome. All 6 have been mentioned by at least someone itt.






Here Kasparov explains exactly what is happening here when these Russian narratives get amplified ITT whether the people gobbling up the propaganda are doing it knowingly or deluding themselves into thinking they came to their own conclusion and it just happened to coincide with Russian propaganda despite the mountains of evidence against:

Good news:

Not all of Ukraine or even any kind of majority or large minority was Nazi. However Ukraine did have a government funded and armed right wing Nazi battalion. That is Russian propaganda. It’s also true


To say there are no Nazis in Ukraine is western propaganda. It’s also not trie

What examples of untrue western propaganda have you seen ? What true western propaganda have you seen?

That is not true and we have been over this. This is why I asked you do define what a "Nazi battalion" actually meant. Because your own source said that when Azov was folded into the military estimates were 10-20% of it had far right leanings. Personally when i hear that there's a "Nazi battalion" I do not think that means that 10-20% of members are far right (not necessarily even Nazi).

There's far more interesting going on that rehashing arguments from the last thread which didn't really go anywhere. Plus as you note, it doesn't really matter. There's far more interesting things going on.

That’s not true and we have been over this. They were banned from fb for being Nazis and being affiliated with tons of Nazi groups.

10-20% is prob a lowball and is abhorrent

Also you’re not the defining authority on truth. You can state your opinion. You can also read Wikipedia and see why you’re opinion is wrong

Unless of course you think you’re an expert here and you have some credentials you’d like to share?



Here is a quote from their leader

In 2010, Biletsky reportedly said that the Ukrainian nation's mission is to "lead the white races of the world in a final crusade...against Semite-led Untermenschen".[41][42][43] Biletsky denied ever making such remarks.[44]

In a 2007 article, Biletsky stated that "Ukrainian racial social-nationalism" was the ideology of Patriot of Ukraine.

[45] During his speech at a 2009 general meeting of the party he said: "How then can we describe our enemy? The general regime in power are oligarchs. Is there anything they have in common? Yes, one thing in common – they are Jews, or their true bosses – Jews – are behind them. Out of one hundred published richest people in Ukraine 92 are Jews, and some others of Tatar origin".[46]



“ RAM is a white supremacist group headquartered in southern California. Its members posted photographs on their Instagram accounts of their Europe trip with the RAM logo and words like “RAPEFUGEES ARE NOT WELCOME HERE” and “REVOLT AGAINST MODERN … ACTIVISIM-ATHLETICS-VIRTUE … RIGHT SIDE.” 26 In Ukraine, RAM members met with groups like the Azov Battalion, a paramilitary unit of the Ukrainian National Guard, which the FBI says is associated with neo-Nazi ideology. The Azov Battalion also is believed to be training and radicalizing white supremacist organizations based in the United States”

https://www.csis.org/analysis/rise-f...-united-states

bro I am old enough to remember when Zelensky gave a standing ovation to a real life Nazi. just give it up.

also, lol

the former leader of their Armed Forces, who is still beloved, posted pictures celebrating Bandera.

its not even worth arguing anymore.

Being banned from FB does not make them a Nazi battalion. Still waiting to know what you think a Nazi battalion is, because it's clearly not what comes to mind when most hear the phrase "Nazi battalion"

I am not saying I am the defining authority, I am stating my opinion. I have read Wikipedia, I have read your own sources and I am quoting them now. As far as anyone here being an expert on Azov goes, it's pretty clear the foremost expert ITT for what that's worth to you. (You are way too concerned about appeals to authority.)

Your quotes are from 15 years ago. They were not government funded then.

I dont even understand why you care. if they are decisively proven to be "Nazi" by whatever moving target you throw out there, why does it matter? you would still support them. they could throw people in ovens and you would be like, ya but Putin and Russia propaganda.

the funniest part is that these guys absolutely side with Israel.

According to you own logic it's impossible for this man to have been a Nazi or to have ever worked with them.

I dont know what you mean by that but his bandstanding showed how they feel about these guys.

Sorry. Neo Nazi battalion

Also in 2015, the US Congress removed a ban on funding neo-Nazi groups like Azov Battalion from its year-end spending bill, said an article by The Nation magazine in January 2016. In July 2015, two Congressmen drew up an amendment to the House Defense Appropriations bill that limited "arms, training, and other assistance to the neo-Nazi Ukrainian militia, the Azov Battalion," but the amendment was removed in November following "pressure from the Pentagon," an insider told The Nation.


https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202203/1254217.shtml

https://www.congress.gov/114/bills/h...4hr2685pcs.pdf


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What is a neo nazi battalion? To me it's not a battalion with 10-20% of the people with far right beliefs, and that's from 2014. They have been further integrated, but a lot of the original core are now casualties, so that % is far smaller.

I believe the neo Nazi battalions group members’ increased due to exponential growth.

As the expert in the thread I can tell you that did not happen.



Do you think Ukraine is winning this war? Do you think they were in a strong position in 2014 when Russia began invading? Do you think that losing would mean the destruction of the Ukrainian identity due to Russian genocidal policies?

Please present expert credentials

Did you mean to say you’re an amateur who thinks he’s an expert?

It's pretty clear I'm the most knowledgable in this thread.



Do you think Ukraine is winning this war? Do you think they were in a strong position in 2014 when Russia began invading? Do you think that losing would mean the destruction of the Ukrainian identity due to Russian genocidal policies?

narcissism off the charts