I think it’s wrong to exclude black women from womens sports, because they are women.
I think it’s wrong to exclude trans women from womens sports, because they are women.

That theory you made up never made any sense. It's not clear why women with potential chess skill wouldn't also be turned away by the rampant sexism that's been a problem with organized chess.

No, I genuinely don't care too much. I'm much more interested in matters of class/wealth than the identity stuff. I just like to argue, and it seems like you're there with me on that.

If you include the low ratings of all the girls/young women who give up earlier than the boys (which is primarily because of the social aspect, as far as I can tell), that may be true. All you need for a rating (like 90% of tournaments in the US aren't ELO-rated, they are USCF-rated, a similar system) is to play one single rated tournament, and you keep that rating forever.

Chess.com and lichess' ratings aren't ELO ratings, and I doubt either place knows the gender identity of every account. Ten points is such a small amount, less than a full game's swing. Particularly with the chess.com (and formerly ICC) rating system which is inflated all the way to ~3200 rated blitz for the top few.

I think I didn't make myself clear, but I'm referring to adult women who take competitive chess somewhat seriously. That's a stronger group than adult men who are the same. I can't be bothered to look for evidence beyond my anecdotes atm, but, as someone who's been to hundreds of live chess tournaments, the countless number of dudes who stick around forever and are rated between like 900-1400 must have an effect. Like I inferred earlier, if they were girls, they'd be more likely to quit at 500-1000 instead (and not because they're just too shitty at it) and keep that rating forever as a bit of data in your study.

I'm not qualified to speak to the role testosterone plays in physical activities like sports and a board game that produces physical effects in a serious player like chess. I neither believe nor disbelieve the stuff you're saying on that.

Rampant is a pretty good word here. Go to any large tournament and you'll see implicit sexism all over the place and explicit sexism occasionally. Give a GM a few shots at the bar and see what happens. This is, again, an extremely socially dislocated group of people we're talking about.

At a chess tournament, I'm one of the more normal people within the group. Me.

The language isn't clear here and/or the logic is invalid.

My step-sister liked chess, played one or two small tournaments, then quit. She explicitly said she didn't like being the only girl there. This is when I was maybe 16 and she 14. She was an intelligent person; I've no doubt she could have been an alright player.

Oh, btw, she came out as trans later in life, got disowned (literally or not, not sure) by her bigoted Army ******* of a father, felt complete non-acceptance from the rest of her right-wing family, and eventually committed suicide. Just, you know, one more bit of data.

oh noes, the trans women have RUINED chess with their unstoppable +10 ELO advantage, how can us cis people ever compete, waaaaaaaah

God, were people this whiny and annoying when they let black athletes compete for the first time?

Read my earlier posts. I specifically said that testosterone and physical stamina have an effect on chess performance, i.e., men are somewhat better at chess, just the difference is not as great as in most sports.

However it is also true that at most amateur chess tournaments the average rating of the women playing is higher than the average rating of the men. This is because almost all of the less serious recreational players are men/ boys, whereas most of the women/girls tend to be more serious players.

We mean to divide people based on biological/genetic advantage . Such a distinction creates a general indirect distinction between woman and men. Where you identify with the later has nothing to do with the former.

Thats ludicrous lunacy to suggest otherwise.

There is no reason lia couldn't have comfortable just competed with the guys in ncaa swimming. In fact it makes more sense since she is a male. What is the problem with a trans woman competing with the men?

Its the people trying to push gender off as the distinction of sex that have the mental problems. For some its because they have their emotions tied to their sleeve. They dont' care about sports they are only thinking of victims in their brain, just like climate change protesters lying in the streets-they work themselves up with sadness. For others its a mistake in logic that they go with. Often because of the misuse of language.

But some, and some here even, are purposefully vengeful and nefarious. Those leading the twitter brigade took pleasure in the pain they were inflict on others form the confusion and lies.

There is no reason lia should have competed against woman in the ncaa champs. It was only because the committee was exploited. Its hilariously laughable that anyone would try and defend it. Lia is known narcissist. She got off on it. Called every one transphobes.

Its a topsy turvy world when you can't call cheating what it is. When you can't be supportive of trans people but criticize the obvious ridiculousness of the situation. Where separating by sex based on bio advantage then somehow means gender but only for some people and calling it logic and reason.

Why can there not be women on the men's hockey team? We seperate by male and female. EVERY player that isn't trans is separated by male/female. Why is it wrong then to have a men's team that has men and women but all males? Then to have an all female team that has men and woman.

The only reason to not do this is narsisistic.

There actually can be women on the men’s hockey team. There is no such thing as a men’s sports team because all men’s teams are actually in an “open” category, meaning anyone is allowed to tryout and play, man, woman, anyone. It just rarely happens because women are not good enough to compete with/against the men.

No one is stopping you from starting your very own cis-only hockey league.

My leagues had transgender people in them. Whats ur issue with reason?

You clearly don't like logic and reason.

The real danger in this world isn't that there people trying to assert transgender people don't exist. There seems to be far less of that than those that are willing to use special groups to accuse others of bigotry order to stifle proper dialogue (and get opposing views canceled).

Thats the real danger, and thats what you are doing here.

Its disgusting.

Trans women are still biological males which gives them an advantage over women in competitive sports so it's nowhere near as simplistic as you're making it out to be.

sick bump corpus

Sorry I thought was the trans visibility thread. Washoe quoted him in that thread and when replying I ended up here.