the most violent act in well months, but still, was how the DNC went about the most recent election day. first by closing tons of voting precincts and thus forcing more people together for longer and next by putting them at lower income areas and esp at lower income old folks homes.

how many deaths did they cause?

how many deaths did Gov Dewine save by refusing to cave to Democrat pressure to hold the elections in state that at that time had estimated around 1% of its population was carrying the virus?

I understand a little more than you do.
You don't even know the DNC is openly playing favorites, which is odd because they admit it.


It's hard to say if you're a Trump voter or work for the DNC/Biden/Obama because you would say the same things in either case. The rigged election or Trump win won't change your life if you're a neo liberal who's in the top 5 or 10% in terms of wealth. Only the other 90% have a stake in the game.

Is the bolded really the premise of a new thread in this forum? The idea that Biden might drop out and leave Bernie as a nominee is a complete pipe dream. Biden isn't dropping out. And even if Biden dropped out or died, there is almost zero chance that Bernie would be the nominee.

I also see no evidence that voters have buyer's remorse. It's fine to say that Bernie would have been a better candidate in the general. I don't agree, but none of us can know for sure. And it's fine to think that Bernie would be a better president than Biden. But what is the evidence that Bernie would do better and Biden would do worse if we held all the primaries and caucuses again? If anything, I suspect Bernie would do worse in Iowa and New Hampshire. The underlying premise -- that voters are more likely to want a revolution during a period of crisis -- seems very wrong to me, at least as limited to the U.S.

I don't mean to compare progressives with the Christian right per se.
Just that the party seems to use us in a similar way.

And we are being pandered to right now. It won't last though.
The establishment Dems thing they have to run left in the primaries then 'pivot' right in the general. That way they can lose to a real Republican. smh.

Why do so many stoop to ad hom attacks, when someone states facts?

I'm not American.

The media have been silent over Altzheimers Joe, yet spent weeks on Trump allegedly having dementia.

Elizabeth Warren has claimed to be an American Indian.

So this Joe Biden sexual assault is really bad. Esp great that the #meToo organization the victim reported it to was hostile towards her and helped cover it up.

Lol Dems always and forever. No bigger collection of hypocrites in history.

Everything original position posts reads like it's coming out of the mouth of a DNC corporate establishment shill. No one who follows politics believes all the bs he's been selling. I just don't get why he slangs bs on his free time.

If Biden dropped out or died, why wouldn't Bernie be the nominee?

He's definately lost touch with reality -

Joe Biden - "when I left the United States Senate, I became a professor at the University of Pennsylvania."

a) He never taught a class
b) He was given the honorary professorship after he left the White House, not the Senate.

He's cancelled live talks for today. They realise they have to hide him again.

What I mean by lol at democracy is not just another gripe about how other people are hypocrites, but rather the view that democracy is a joke, that the US is only a fake democracy, and the outcomes of elections are not decided by voters.
We probably disagree about what counts as illegitimate voter suppression as I tend to be more permissive about what are acceptable campaign tactics than most Bernie voters. But yes, it's wrong to close voting stations if they are needed. Voters should not have to wait in line for hours in order to vote. Both Democrats and Republicans should be condemned if they cause that to happen. I think Republicans have a particularly bad record of this when it comes to immigrants and ethnic and race minority voters in the last few years.

The party hyper-partisans made their choices and then a huge swath of media treated those election results like business as usual. Running around having “winners” parties while people were still panicking for toilet paper. Foul.

Biden does prove the old saw that every little boy can grow up to be president.

There is that.....

How is "democracy is a joke" not a valid sentiment when the DNC only pretends to support democracy when it is convenient for them? People from the DNC have openly admitted the 2016 primaries were rigged. Stop gaslighting. You seem smart enough to understand how the world works behind closed doors.

I admittedly haven't done the math, but I assume we are past the point where Bernie could get enough delegates to win the nomination outright. And if we are past that point, do you like the odds of the party getting behind Bernie as the nominee in a contested convention scenario?

I mean, there is a reason that Cuomo has better betting odds now than Bernie.

(As an aside, I am NOT a Cuomo fan. He seems attractive at the moment because he is not Trump and because he predictably is more decisive and effective than De Blasio in a crisis. But he is an autocrat and a bully at heart. A good president needs to be good all the time, not just in a crisis.)

Bernie wouldn't concede in that case, and neither would we.

Now if only the large majority of voters could view "good all the time" as anything other than "non-existent" in the Trump reality TV era.

Agreed that the left hasn't rejected democracy.

Trump himself I'd guess would cheat if he could get away with it in the general election. I also assume that regardless of what happens, win, lose, big or small, he will complain about how he was robbed and disrespected. However, I am doubtful that he can successfully cheat in a large way. Rather, his abuse of power will be more over things he can control, like the Burisma/Biden stuff.

I don't really agree with your central claim here. Russia's elections don't appear free or fair. You can't keep jailing your main opponent and get to appear as such.

As for questioning the legitimacy of our election process - isn't that what most of the Bernie supporters in this thread doing about the primary election? Doesn't seem that unspeakable to me.

Just so it's clear, I don't think the Bernie Sanders movement will become violent anytime soon (barring CV19 and its effects becoming much worse). My remark to victor was a response to him directly and his comment, not a general indictment of the American left. Yes, I think it would be a huge mistake and tragedy if the left gave up on democracy, and would probably lead to many of them to becoming communists, with all the problems historically associated with that ideology. But I'm quite confident that Bernie is a committed to democracy, which is why I was prepared to support him against Trump in November.

Become communists? You're hopeless. We are the only ones still fighting for democracy.

Btw, Our House supports ousting Biden at the convention for E. Warren. Go democracy.

Obviously the members of the DNC have preferences in the primary - most of the DNC are senior politicians of the Democratic party, of course they have preferences. I have no problem with that; that is how a party is supposed to work imo. I also don't have a problem if they orient the parts of the primary within their control, such as the timing of debates, to advantage the party leadership favorite. I would have a problem with a primary where votes aren't counted accurately, especially if this affects the outcome significantly. I'm not aware of evidence that the DNC has been miscounting votes in a significant way in this primary.

Why are you bragging about your inability to make basic US political identifications? Ordinary voters in conversation with me are able to very quickly identify my political allegiances and who I vote for. Why can't you?

Fundamentally, your problem here is also why you are ignoring the chart I linked. You seem blind to the existence of more than half the voters for the Democratic Party because you think the party establishment doesn't have democratic legitimacy as leaders of the party and so can't acknowledge all those non-liberal voters who support the current party establishment as being actual members of the party. It's really weird.

First, the election isn't rigged. Second, nah, I'm fairly ordinary middle class American in wealth terms. Fourth, you don't even believe this as you think the top 5 or 10% in wealth also have a stake in Trump, just a positive one.

Do you understand how conditional statements work?

I said it would be an incredible strategy, not that I support it democratically.

But, assume he mentally declines to the point of incapacitation in August. What's the play?

It doesn't matter whether Bernie would concede in that scenario.

Did I demonstrate a lack of understanding of conditional statements?

What makes you think that Bernie supporters would ever turn to communism?

Jailing opponents is part of the game there, and isn't seen as cheating the same way it is in the US.

TBH, I wasn't even considering that. Russia actually rigs the ballot box, and a good chunk of the population is in denial. Putin has a ton of support as well. I mean, they do intimidate people when they're polled by phone, but regardless, they still have their own version of our 30%-40% blind Cult45 support.

"Strong" leaders are viewed way more positively than they should be.

If he were incapacitated, he would have to resign.