We don't have an omnibus thread for discussing issues as they relate to sports and we could use one. There were a couple of times during Wimbledon where I came across some articles I might have wanted to post about but did not, so I'm creating this thread for such purposes should they arise in the future.

I don't have any intention of any sort of long and well-thought-out-post, but i do think the situation with how Russian and Belarusian players have been treated is absurd moral grandstanding. In 2022 they were banned from competing altogether at Wimbledon, and this year they were allowed to play but not under the flags of their countries. They are also being banned from representing Russia and Belarus at the olympics. Why not also ban China and Iran I wonder? Why not all the BRICS? But certainly if we're banning athletes from countries that support war, then the US needs to be the first country that should have its athletes forced to compete under neutral flags.

There has also been plenty in the news in recent years about the Saudis, the PGA tour, and the upstart league tour the LIV-- not something I care about but that's definitely something that could be discussed here, or about issues related to the NBA and China.

My general stance is that athletes should be free to express themselves as they see fit without fear of recrimination from their leagues or organizations, but that excluding players from competitions because of the sins of their countries is a line too far. So please use this thread to discuss these things, or any other topic as it relates to sports as long as it's not about males competing against females as we already have a thread for that.

Great idea on the thread. May add in all the Eco Protesters gluing themselves to roads at races or throwing stuff on the courts .

I have no issue with banning the Russians from the World Cup or the Olympics I do not agree with it happening at individual sport level or per say a Russian Athlete in the NHL

I actually agree with most of the OP. I could imagine edge situations in which it might be appropriate to ban a specific athlete from an international sports competition (e.g., a situation where it was clear the athlete would use the event as a platform to glorify genocide).

But in the vast majority of situations, I don't really see the point of banning athletes to send a political message, especially the Daniel Medvedevs of the world who seem like they mostly just want to show up and play tennis.

Almost all sporting events you've heard of exist in their current state because people will pay to watch. (Yes, if there was no Premier League or World Cup people would still be playing, but I don't think that's what you are talking about.) You need to keep your customers happy if you want to continue to operate. If that means someone gets excluded, then that's what happens. There's no fair or unfair about it. As Michael Corleone said, "It's just business".

I doubt that the decision about whether to ban Russian players from Wimbledon in 2022 was financially impactful in either the short or long run.

Well, it's hard to measure something that didn't happen. But do you think it was done to claim some sort of moral high-ground?

I think the decision was made by the relatively small number of people who run Wimbledon as a gesture of support for a country that had been invaded. Russian players were allowed to play at the U.S. Open two months later.

I have no reason to believe that the decision of either Wimbledon or the U.S. Open was financially consequential. Indeed, if the decisions had been obviously financially consequential, there is a greater likelihood that the decisions would have been aligned.

there should never be a national anthem at a game between teams within the same country.

there should never be support the troops, or fly overs, or military salutes at any game.

until you get rid of those things all the complaining about "politics and sports" at least in the US is just republicans blowharding.


outside the US, "sports washing" is a real thing and you can see that by what Saudi Arabia is attempting, and it will likely work because when it comes down to it people dont really give a **** about other people being murdered/tortured/oppressed thousands of miles from their sofa's and recliners.

Your position is that people can't complain about Russians being banned from sports until national anthems are removed from intra-national sporting events?

I doubt it was done out of some attempt to claim moral high ground and far more about pressure to be seen to be acting in some regards beyond just a statement. Also think it's kinda farcical when it comes to individual sports. Bans on team sports make more sense.

I assume you're talking about allowing the option for games to not do the anthem or support the troops? I assume it's already that way but maybe not?

The US banning its own country from doing a national anthem or a support of the troops would be an epic level of stupidity.

pretty clearly says IN THE US in my post, and then outside the US.

games in the MLB between philly and atlanta shouldn't be playing the national anthem and having support the troops crap.. that is inherently political. my point is if we aren't starting at removing that then we are just allowing people to say "take politics that aren't MINE out of sports"

So your position is that if someone is geographically located inside of the United States then they cannot complain about Russians being banned from sports until they stop playing the national anthem in US sporting events between two US teams?

did you think i quote tweeted you about russian athletes or something? the thread is called politics in sports not "what do you think about russian atheletes being banned from flying the russian flag at this specific sporting event." if you meant to make the thread specifically about russian athletes representing their flag in sports, you could have made that thread.

Well you see, since the whole entire thread up until the point with which you made your post was about Russians, and since the thread is literally titled "politics in sports", you'll have to forgive me for assuming that you were saying that wasn't people should be able to talk about until the national anthem is removed.

idk what to tell you man. no my position is not "if you currently are physically present in the US you cannot have a position about international sports until the national anthem is removed" or whatever you said. is that better?


international sporting organizations should probably be free to say you can't represent a specific flag in a sporting event as a form of international "shaming". but obviously it is arbitrary many countries that are quote unquote bad are allowed to fly their flags. i would be opposed to banning individual athletes from competing on the basis of something their country did outside of maybe times when the national federation has a doping scandal or something similar.

Sure, but it doesn't matter if it's political. It should be up to the participants and the fans who support the team and I'd imagine that playing a national anthem would still be a massive majority favored event if it would to be put to a vote.

A tax funded govt, funding an unsupported ban on its own national anthem would be a DPRK level of a command economy.

banning the athletes was insane ofc.

1. Russia is a totalitarian hellhole where you get slaughtered with your family if you dont support Putin.
2. if you dont denounce Putin then you cant compete

Chess did the same thing with Sergey Karjakin.

but I am not sure why you would include Iran and China in the same breath as USA and Russia. their number of invasions is quite small esp relative USA primarily and Russia to a much lesser extent.

I was saying that because they support Russia, if they're going to be banning Belarus too then they might as well also ban Iran and China.

The Iranians built a drone factory in Russia even.

I had forgotten about Karjakin.

deportes! Goat.



Politics could be woat

Ban the USA for giving cluster bombs to the Ukraine

ahh I see. I am not sure how much China and Iran are helping Russia. like I dont think they are providing nearly as much support as NATO. they are just doing standard war profiteering. yay market.

https://www.reuters.com/sports/socce...nd-2023-07-22/

Russian tennis player prevented from entering Poland despite having a French issued visa...not sure how that works..

I feel like this comes under the banner of 'collective punishment', surely. Not that I want to give fuel to the right for future overreactions by private entities, but there's got to be a better way than punishing non-political sportspeople for things their countrymen did. The counterbalance to that is not to allow sportswashing, but what we've really got to avoid is sporting companies trying to curry favour with the media and public by appearing to take cruel and unjustified actions.

collective punishment is a term that I had not heard, or at least not a serious concept, until this war and seen it all over the most bloodthirsty libs on twitter and reddit.

stuff like that makes you think. on the one hand it could propaganda forces pushing a concept to advance their goals, kinda like they did with "whatboutism" in the 70s.

I dont think that is the case in this instance, rather I think its just a way for liberals to feel good about cheering on death.