On the devil's advocate side I think Inso0 would argue that the fact that police responded to the scene and put the guy on the ground IS the evidence of the wrong doing and the justification for the subsequent police actions.

He can clarify if his position is more nuanced than that.

Yeah, and then I'll say that I don't care if the guy has a warrant, is suspected of something, is guilty of something, and maybe it comes down to principles where I'll say I simply don't think that people should be treated that way. I'm willing to lay those principles out there and discuss whether they best serve the things we want as individuals or as a society.

Don't worry guys, the officer is only disappointed that he didn't finish the job:


https://www.kktv.com/2021/07/28/grap...iolent-arrest/

Honestly, it's hard to pick my words properly on this point but this is where I feel a bit sorry for some of these cops. This cop should not be put in this situation if this is the level of his thinking. He's not equipped to handle it.

I've been busted with 1 ng thc inside my system. These f ****tards took my licence away for this. You guys are allowed to drive with 6 in cali and 10 or 12ng in Washington. So id be happy if I were u. I still have another American licence though

Nobody put him in this situation. He not only chose it, he trained for it.

I do think the system needs to be designed such that people like this don't end up as cops, but that doesn't excuse his crimes or make me feel an ounce of pity for this scumbag.

I would be surprised if my blood has ever been below 10ng per ml thc since I started smoking. That test is useless.

F Germany the land of the doomed.

I feel bad for bad cops the same way I feel bad for criminals, I guess. I'm not trying to take away the personal responsibility but a lot of things have to go wrong in the world before this guy has a badge and a gun to the back of someone's head.

Yeah it is.

Seem like they made it easy for that 'evidence' to be thrown out of court.

LOL at the resident right wing nut job using the fact that the driver was out of the car and backup was called as 'proof' that the cop was justified.

The cops may very well have been justified and this might have been a routine stop/search/arrest, but just because they're doing it doesn't make it so.

Just a basic logic fail by a guy who needs to be ruled with an iron fist. So dumb.

This is exactly the type of Deadly Simon Says game too many cops force people into.

Comply or die.

Comply and still sometimes die.

The cop is escalating this situation into one of sheer panic by the guy, and then expecting him to exactly follow sets of instructions where any misstep can result in death.

it would be easy to see how as the guy is yelled at to roll onto his belly and he rightly positions his arms under him to make the turn over that the cop would then shoot him as he pulls him back out from under himself with the cop saying 'I was fearful he had withdrawn a gun'.

Sadly too many cops only make the situations they enter much worse. This could have been the easiest, least stress free questioning and arrest possible but the cop ensured that it would not play out that way.

Stupid question but why was an officer's gun drawn in the first place ?

It was a trespassing complaint and DP warrants, not armed and dangerous felons.

Are these guys this week and scared to begin with or is this how they're trained. I mean, the guy wasn't complying and was gonna have some force used on him but......head strikes aren't even efficient.

Business as usual though. Meh.

I don't know about not complying. He remains seated, he puts his hands up in a non-threatening posture, it takes a bit of convincing but he rolls on his stomach, he tries to put his hands out when told but as he shifts them wrong they yell at him and he stops. He doesn't actually put up any real resistance until he realises he's got the barrel of a gun to his head. He doesn't even fight back when the officer's choking him.

Basically, any "non-compliance" is all explained by the panic reaction rather than any apparent attempt to evade arrest.

Everything the cop does serves to escalate the situation, and every totally natural response from the victim is taken as a threat.

if i am in that spot I don't do a thing the cop says. I just put my hands up in the 'freeze, don't shoot position' and he can come put a handcuff on one wrist, direct it behind the back and then handcuff the other.

I have thought this through many times and no way I start playing 'Police Deadly Simon Says' where you try to get out of the chair, ...stand up, ...sit down and you merely stumble and end up shot dead, and the cop gets off with no punishment as he was 'rightly frightened you might have been lurching at him'. Nope, not following any such orders or instructions.

Arms up and out (in that car or in a car) and if they choose to shoot like that, at least I know they will face charges that will be hard to beat.

As soon as you can demonstrate you are zero threat (hands up and out) and they have every opportunity to simply come handcuff you, force them to do that.

Passive resistance is a thing.

I'm not in any way making excuses for the thug cop. I'm just trying to be objective. I would have put my hands out and said 'I have a lighter' and hoped they picked it up. And that would be that.

He was playing a dangerous game and he has the trophy scars to show for it.
I mean, thankfully the cop was on camera and he'll get a payout but the cop had every intention of shooting him. That's just mind boggling.

For a trespass and bench warrant. WTF !!!

But people are all different. If he had some sort of impairment going on or was just high that's not an excuse for the cop to tee off on him.

Sad, as usual.

https://www.fox2detroit.com/news/det...-front-of-them

Thing is, this is one of the few that was actually a case people like Sharpton should get behind. This was egregious and no cop should get away with this no matter if the victim is white or black. Interesting the race baiters take a case with merit....

Cop wasn't kneeling on his neck and even if he was, minutes before, GF had the opportunity to act right and get in the back of the car and fight it out in court. Instead of eating pills, passing counterfeit money, then pretending he didn't do nuffin when the PoPo shows up. The officer will get this thrown out in appeals court or supreme court. Too bad he has to sit in prison until that happens....if he is in prison. Hopefully they let him out the back door...

I used to hate the police. I used to have problems with them. All until I matured and looked back realizing that most of the problems I had with police, were caused by me. Social Media is ruining everything....

What I'm saying is I don't see a lot of resistance, active or passive, until the point that they cause him to panic. His hands are in a non-threatening posture, he rolls over after a couple of words, he tries to put his hands out, and then the cop tells him this is a genuine life or death situation and that the thing on the back of his head is the barrel of a gun. But even what resistance he puts up after that largely amounts to covering his head when being hit and placing a hand over the officer's when being choked.

My amateur opinion as someone who's trained in a few martial arts and taught some fighting and self-defence too is that those are totally natural reactions that are almost impossible to stop yourself from. If you hit someone in the face they will instinctively bring their hands up, but that's not really fighting back or resisting. Cops need to know that some of the things they might do will cause a certain reaction.

I'm also trying to be objective. Some resistance and some force when you go to cuff a guy is expected, but everything the cop did only served to escalate the situation and put the guy in a position where he was panicked and going to do things that might look like grabbing for the gun. I think the key is to focus on the beginning of the interaction - he doesn't run, he doesn't even try to stand up, he puts his hands up with palms showing, after a couple of prompts he rolls over, he tries to put his hands out (doesn't do it right at first, pulling them back to lift himself up, which the cop rightly stops). They've got the guy in the prone position with two officers ready. There's no real threat and yet the cop still wants to escalate the situation to a potentially deadly one.

I don't disagree with any of that.

I'm just saying that if you panic and resist ..... that's going to be considered resisting. A judge or prosecutor may not charge you but that's the way it's going to be seen by the cops. At least here in the US.

It was nonsense for the cop to escalate it and it quickly became criminal.

We run towards the danger.......or not.

Fair. All I'd add is that I have no idea how I'd react if I felt a gun on the back of my head. I'm not sure anyone does until it happens. I might panic, I might roll over, I might do anything to get away from the gun. I'm almost certain I'd put my hands up if someone was striking me with an object.

The good side to this story is that they are charging the cops and the official statement from the police force is to disavow the officer's actions. Especially not letting the second one off the hook for not intervening.

Beautiful first post where you talk about 'race baiters' while at the same time suggesting that Sharpton et al have never advocated prior for any individual who had any merit simply based on the others being POC.

I can see you will have a long posting career here.

Don't you remember the good old days before social media, back when there were no police problems?

It's the pre body cam days that I shudder to think about.

I would not be shocked to find that almost 50% of people incarcerated would not have been if body cam's were always present.

Yup, 50%. I think that so many trivial disputes such as driving infractions where the person angers the cop have ended up with false, 'assaulting the police' serious charges and other things like that.

They had unchecked power and they certainly abused it.