Dude, stop lying. The initial reason why they're going to pull him over was because of his tags, but he broke another law by not stopping, which escalated the response. This whole idea they had guns drawn simply because he didn't have tags it's b******* and you know it.

He put on his blinkers and slowly drove to a well-lit spot. Real Grand Theft Auto ****.

Seriously, this isn’t like in Iraq where they paid you to justify murders. Why defend this clown even after the VA police dropped his ass like a hot potato?

Pretty much the SPECIFIC instruction we were taught to do growing up since the sixties.

I can understand them pulling their guns because the guy had tinted windows, was not showing his hands right away and their vaginas may have twinged a with fear a bit at the thought of how many gangbanging cop killers could be hiding behind those tinted windows.
Not saying I agree with it but I can see the perspective.

My issue is that once they have moved to pepper spray there was clearly a huge opening there to just talk to the guy and explain what he was pulled over for and start from there but this guy was so pissed off that a citizen dare disobey him that he had to keep shouting and I don't understand why ihiv cannot concede this point. It was a mistake by the cop, whether the LT is ****ing with him or not, it's his job to stay professional and in control.

Probably not.
It was enough to escalate the initial stop to a felony stop but it's not against the law to pull over where you feel safe. It happens. It may get you some extra trouble but it's not ipso facto illegal.

Closing the door is dumb. But still, no need to use force right at that moment. It seemed like the young guy was going to get him out without much more drama.

Yes. Would be good if every citizen at every encounter told the cops to go **** themselves and I don't answer questions.
They should be defied at every turn until they learn to stop harassing people and stop shaking down everyone for money.

IHIV people should comply other than when compliance can mean justified murder of them by you specifically. Then self defense takes over and is the higher priority.

We don't fix this by telling people to 'simply comply' when faced with improper behaviour.

We stop this by training police about what is appropriate or not.

Right now you support a dynamic that when the cop does something improper it is not the citizen being abused to fix it and when it goes bad, the cop knows you got his back, with the slightest justification.

He didn't actually defy them. He questioned them....

Pepper spraying cop fired

https://www.tmz.com/2021/04/12/virgi...utenant-fired/

yeah i mean, you should absolutely never talk to the police or help them in any way. seriously.


but i will give the cops in this situation this, they don't initially have to tell you why you were pulled over/stopped. that isn't a violation of your rights.

Not to be a dick, but this is bananas. The cops are supposed to pull out their guns when they have a reasonable fear for their safety, not because some guy has tinted windows (are those even illegal?).

See my last post.

You are looking at the wrong side of the equation. You reflexively always looking to defend cop actions like this only encourages more cops to not check themselves.

Seriously.

Philando Castile was stopped over 49 times before a cop murdered him.

If you keep just saying to people like Castile, 'just comply' while not saying to the cops 'stop this madness of pointing your gun with finger on the trigger', all you are doing is telling POC to accept that in a certain percent of these interactions, even when you think you are fully complying, a percent of you are going to die.

And then worse, you are saying, and if I am on the jury and I see any reason to acquit the cop, you know I will jump at it.

I've actually done that twice on the 401 when I lived in Toronto. Thankfully it was Canada where cops are not as quick to pull guns.

It has been years since I last got a speeding ticket and pulled over, but on the 401 there are often stretches with super narrow shoulders (due often to construction) and whenever I have seen a car pulled over I can see how super dangerous it is for everyone including the cop. Cars are passing way to close to a car that is near to impeding the road.

So when the cop came up behind me and put his lights on, I waved at him, put on my hazard and proceeded up the road to where i could see the shoulder got wider, or in one instance an off ramp.

The second however it was a wider place to stop I did, and one cop asked me why I had done and I explained I did not think it was safe for him or me on that stretch and he seemed appreciative of that. I am guessing so anyway as I got a warning and not a ticket, that time. The first time I did get the ticket.

I'm not. I know if this lieutenant complied with the police officer, he would, in almost all likelihood, not have been subjected to force. He refused multiple times, at multiple points, and instead tried to shift the conversation to about why he was being pulled over, then he tried to use his uniform as a shield.

I'm sorry, if you care about people, you would not be defending this lieutenant. Defying the police isn't the way to approach them. You can wine and cry about the cops, but as long as you justify that type of behavior you have no credibility.

The cop got fired have to repost bc you two burying everything else
https://www.tmz.com/2021/04/12/virgi...utenant-fired/

“Defiantly” asking why you got pulled over is now an excuse for the cops to mace you. Amazing.

So the officer was fired is not that the outcome that should have occurred?

I still think in the USA its not always a matter of racism but instead poor police training.
Sadly that defund the police message comes up here to Canada as well

Piss poor leadership and a toxic culture then the training a distant 3rd.

The cop said he was detained. He doesn't have to give a reason for the detainment?

Right.

But be honest, had the lieutenant complied, and reached down by his hip for his seat belt scaring the cop into shooting him, and the cop's defense lawyer got the following admission:

- 'is it possible that a person reaching down towards between the seats might have a gun'

- and is it possible that a police officer doing their job properly could be afraid that was the case

- and is it then possible that the shoot is then justified


And if IHIV is on that jury he calls that a 'devastating' admission and acquits the officer?


I don't mean that to be one iota sarcastic as that is exactly why juries have acquitted offices such as in the Castile case.

Castile would likely still be alive if he did what this lieutenant did instead.

Would you disagree with that IHIV?

Can you recognize that had Castile simply kept his arms out the window and refused to play Simon Says he would still be alive?

He did comply. He put his hands out the window and didn't move as he was ordered to.

You can't do that AND open your car door at the same time.

Magic Dick might be able to do more than just play harmonica./

But yes, this quote is the real issue. Cops giving conflicting orders.

Well technically he did not comply as he was involved in a low speed police chase. He obviously could not open the car door from the outside as his door was locked which is an auto feature on most cars.

Both him and the police are trained for situations like this and both in my opinion did a bad job . Though I have never had a gun pointed at me and am not a black man.
Though I have been pulled over and I take to heart what every black parent teaches their kids when getting pulled over and do the exact same. Hands at 10-2 and never do anything till I tell the officer what I am doing and him/her saying OK.

Daunte Wright body cam released. Cop grabs gun thinking it's a tazer and shoots him at point blank range. Thought cops had to take an IQ test before being hired.

why? he acted properly. maybe not perfect. but he was absolutely correct to leave his hands visible rather than move them into the vehicle and then down by his pocket and waist which was necessary to unbuckle his seat belt.

one cop says "hands out the window. hands out the window where we can see them."

and then he is told to exit the vehicle.

ihiv, you fashion yourself a smart guy. tell me how it is possible for him to comply in this situation?

or basically, everything RFlush has been saying for pages.