What are some more "relevant" social locations than "white?"

So can you defend that in light of the fact that whites suffer only half the poverty rate of non-whites ?

Gaslighting is by definition not real. The data seems to indicate that there's more than just gaslighting at play. No ?

Economic class is the main one. Elites don't like to talk about economic class too much, because then the negative attention is on them. Better to focus on race, then you can keep the poors focused on each other.

A cynical person might wonder if the timing of the tape reaching social media and the MSM getting interested might actually have been intentional. Maybe the elites thought they were getting a little too much heat with all the big businesses getting pressure for taking PPP payments, so time to divert the attention of the sheeple by pulling out the race card.

OK, any others?

This is still a good response to the argument that racism is no longer salient, but instead only economic class. The Color of Law is also a good read, expanding on several of the points raised.

At various points I've also argued that, politically, I think the sort of universalist economic approach is probably the right one (as described, for example, by Obama in an interview with Coates, the author of the first article). But if we're doing a sociological analysis, and not evaluating political strategy, then I think the evidence is pretty stark.

White privilege is an idiotic concept. The actual exercise is to formulate racial categories in a very stupid way. It's divisive and counterproductive. If it weren't a stupid way to frame or perceive things, you could at least go with the angle it provide some uncomfortable truth. It doesn't

The actual exercise of identifying white privilege is to look for a grain of sand on the beach. Find some sliver of oppression. People do this to feel woke and virtuous. It must be quite exhilarating to know more than everyone else, be extremely virtuous, and have free pass to be a bitter and nasty douche to anyone that doesn't agree. Quite rewarding all the way around. All of this idiotic woke lens people view the world through doesn't make them any more knowledgeable about real problems and it actually masks them and draws attention away from the real problems and solutions.

I'm not in the mood to bump the old arguments right now so at this point you'll have to take my word for it and also excuse any lack of precision with my memory. Once upon a time well named was writing these long winded SJW perspective lectures on race. I had been paying attention to politics for about 5 seconds and it immediately struck me as completely misguided nonsense. Fast forward he presented what he though were the causes of racial disparity in poverty. It was a short list that was all forms of racism and oppression. Segregation, historical burdens passed along, etc. All of it. It's not that all of it was wrong, its just totally misguided. Focused on the grain of sand on the beach

I pointed out that the most significant and color blind factor for poverty was being in a single parent household. It affects people of all color almost exactly the same. As predicted the woke crowd ran around kicking, screaming, and hurling all sorts of names at me. The validity of my statement was obvious and its impact on poverty was enormous. Yet everything I said was fought and challenged the whole way from all angles.

If you actually cared about the well being of people in general, poverty, and especially the well being of children, this would be your primary focus. Yet nobody wants to talk about it and instead throw a hissy fit to silence anyone that does. This also happens to public figures like Don Lemon when they speak up about absent fathers in the black community. People freak out and squash the conversation. Everyone moves on.

The concept or actual amount of "privilege" in being white is minuscule at best. Why are people so focused on it? Why aren't those same people paying attention to real issues. Actual racism isn't really a contested issue (I can already see some mouth breathing dolt dying to take issue with that) society in large condemns it.

Living in a single parent home causes enormous amounts of poverty. The indicators like school performance, delinquency, criminality, etc all point to this being really bad for everyone. Exponentially worse than the color of your skin.

Lets list some things that might be more important to someones life than the privilege they have or don't based on their skin color

Two parent home
Abusive parent
Alcoholic parent
neglect or distant parent
physical health- mobility, pain, disease
mental health- IQ, depression, anxiety, learning disabilities etc
Random bullying
etc etc

All of those things matter more to someones well being. Most of those aren't visible. When you're saying, using, or thinking in the manner of "white privilege" you're using some generalization that is next to useless in most cases. It doesn't come close to telling you anything that matters in terms of someones actual "privilege". Yeah it's really useful telling people with an alcoholic parent and depression they have white privilege. It's really helpful telling people of color the country they live in is divided by race and white people are working together to oppress them. The whole exercise is idiotic. Rank your priorities better. Weight actual problems appropriately. Make more useful and better categories. Racism is wrong and effects from historical racism are real. That works, we don't need to labeling white people as privileged, its idiotic and counterproductive

There is an epidemic of single parent families in society today. Its negative consequences are enormous on poverty and overall life quality for the people involved and society as a whole. Nobody talks about it. The disparity in single parent homes between asians and the black community is where the actual privilege exists. skin color isn;t even 100th on the list of things that affect your well being. Considering what factors people can and can't control and which factors matter the most to peoples well being, the focus on concepts like "white privilege" is actually some petty exercise that the extremely privileged people have the luxury of obsessing about

Ah so, the "elites" who control the media are stirring up racial unrest, where have I heard this before...

Silly black people, don't you know that skin color isn't in the top 100 things that affect your well being? Ahmaud Arbery oughta know that single parents are the real problem no one talks about.

Here's an exercise and perhaps a template for both you and the woke crowd who have no shortage of time to talk about white privilege

Describe exactly what you mean or what is white privilege in a couple paragraphs or less. Then below list the indicators you use to determine it's existence

We all know how brilliant you are and how much time you have so...

Thanks in advance

Already done in this thread.

No you haven't, and if you had, you could copy and paste. Stop lying, lying liar

Or in an extremely popular term near and dear to your heart and values "cite"

Also I'm hoping others chime in. I expect nothing from you, something silly at best

I endorsed another definition given. I have no further need to provide that which was already provided.

"You have too much free time on your hands" says the guy who just posted the following:

Insightful as always wookie. Your kryptonite has always been articulating your own position. I'm sure you'll have some more clever gotcha questions ready to fire off at any moment though

"the guy" has a fan club member who shows up within minutes of 90% of his posts with quite the impressive post count

I can't say I'm all that thrilled to write an essay for a guy who seems only interested in stamping his foot and crying that I'm not performing for him rather than actually learning what people are talking about when they say "white privilege" when it's right there for him, a page or two back, no.

I specifically said define white privilege in two paragraphs or less. Since then you've spent more time pretending you have a clue about anything than it would take to write two paragraphs or less. I also said to list some indicators you use to demonstrate it's existence. You always have something to say, its just never articulating your own position

Oh and "Cite" the request for an essay

Thanks

Regards

Juan, you ever think of getting one of the lower-tier rightwing websites to publish your essay posts and earn a quick buck? I'm sure RedState would be happy to have you on the staff.

How are those socio-economic issues not tied to racism over the last century and a half? It was purely racism that denied all those black ww2 vets their fair share of gi bill benefits--think how much potential generational wealth that would've built up to now. That foundation helped countless families come up over the last ~70yrs. And that's just 1 example. There's no need to go all the way back to slavery to make the point.

Saying something like--hey it's fair now(which it really isn't) overlooks so much horrible stuff that's contributed to the situation at this point. A hell of a lot of the generational problems in their communities that have arisen are the direct result of racism. Hey guys--sorry we crippled your communities in a multitude of ways for Decades but whatcha gonna do? Let's just forget that ok? Everything's fine now good luck! The nature of the problem makes it easy for many people to say--hey I didn't do anything--so why should I have to do anything? But 'we' did do it and it is kinda our responsibility to try to do something about it. No matter how you slice it throwing generations of black people in jail in a system biased against them/essentially confining them to communities with the cops circling 24/7 ready to unleash that system on them repeatedly the moment they step out of line is going to play a role in those other factors people rattle off as the 'real' problems.

Thinking privilege only operates on the margins also overlooks tons of things. For generations legions of white hs kids had their paths essentially laid out for them--think of how many guys had an uncle/dad at the union/s other established connections etc--life set. Nothing to do with upper-middle/upper class people--but very much an example of privilege. Those pipelines hardly exist/ed for black people. Other 'outsider' white immigrant groups were assimilated pretty quickly(relatively) into those structures ahead of black people. Again, that's just 1 example. It permeates all layers of society in various ways. There's way more to it than just the wealthy/children of the wealthy getting some advantages and preferential treatment and class issues are definitely worthy of discussion. These things don't appear out of thin air they've been ingrained for generations.

In the time it took you to write this, you could have already gotten your answer just by looking back a page or two. Quite frankly, your insistence that I perform for you on command is a little deranged.

And I got two paragraphs plus a bunch of indicators as well into essay territory. If you don't, ok, I'm not going to sweat it.

@wetwork as well

Once your in poverty, it's hard to escape. For example, lets say your great-grandfather was a victim of racism, and was unjustly put in prison. Kids with parent who have been in prison are exponentially more likely to end up in prison themselves, irrespective of race. It so happens your grandfather, your father both go to prison for commiting actual crimes, which leaves you living in poverty. Poverty also breeds other issues, such as teenage pregnancy, addiction, violent victimization etc etc. All of which increases the propensity of the offspring to follow suit, irrespective of race. Racism is not responsible for people not being able to escape poverty. Enormous amount of data supports that.

None of which defines white, or black.

What is a definition of white or black that would invalidate the arguments made?

Definition might not be the right word, but as I've asked repeatedly...

Which black people, and which white people? Those are really broad groupings.

I generally enjoy long philosophical discursions about the sociology of knowledge and how classification works with socially constructed categories, and undoubtedly if you get into the weeds enough you can uncover some intellectually interesting things that are worth your time as an amateur sociologist.

But, in this context, I think the relevance to the discussion is pretty marginal. The most common way of operationalizing racial categories in social science research is just to ask your research subjects to self-identify. That is undoubtedly how it was done in all the data presented in the first link. This method works well enough to not be worth a long digression, in my view.