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Old Yesterday, 12:27 PM   #7551
GodgersWOAT
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by John21 View Post
Maybe stop training police to fire as quickly as possible at black human shapes so that when they're under immense stress they don't insta fall back on their training and fire at black human shapes as quickly as possible.

Roflmao
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Old Yesterday, 12:43 PM   #7552
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by tgiggity View Post
Being charged with something is a lot different than being charged with the crime you committed. Being charged is a lot different than being convicted.



That's an odd assumption to make. Why do you think I don't care about criminal drug gangs? Is it because I don't let you bring them up as a red herring to distract from police brutality?

Do you think it's not possible to care about more than one issue?

I think it's possible to support police reform and support laws/social programs that have been proven to reduce the power and influence of criminal gangs, including criminal drug gangs. Are these ideas mutually exclusive, and if so could you please explain how they are mutually exclusive?

Finally, I'd like to reiterate Wookie's question, which you must have missed:
Wookie’s question assumes that criminal drug gangs are (1) legally obliged to wear body cams; and (2) routinely engage in encounters in which they have to return fire; and (3) aren’t committing felonies ex ante which inhibits their ability to claim anyone they kill has been killed justifiably.

It’s a really dumb question, and it’s indicative of your let’s say “diminished” understanding that it had to be spelled out.

Addressing your other weak argument: the fact that you and your ilk incessantly screech for lower funding for police and for less aggressive policing makes it clear how little you actually care about curbing the impact of criminal drug gangs’ violence in black and brown communities.

Addressing your only salient point: yes, police reform and improving outcomes for black and brown communities ravaged by criminal drug gangs are not mutually exclusive. HOWEVER, I would be very surprised if the kind of reform that would ultimately improve outcomes in these communities involved defunding police and limiting their aggressive tactics: both ideas you obviously ascribe to because it’s all your team permits.

My reform would involve arming every officer with weapons that can immediately neutralize violent and erratic criminals. These weapons would replace the cops traditional weapons and would be used in all but the most dangerous of situations. I also agree with reforms that involve massively increasing body armor budgets so that officers need not use deadly weapons while not increasing their risk of death when engaging in highly dangerous situations.
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Old Yesterday, 12:53 PM   #7553
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

I think cops should be required to wear body cams when they are executing a search warrant.
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Old Yesterday, 12:56 PM   #7554
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Oh **** off and get over yourself. No one is breaking into your home or anyones home. Googling rich people? Turn off tucker carlson and try to think for yourself.
Are you blind? It's already happening. wtf do you think CHAZ is? Or the looting? You think it's just going to stop at community businesses? They already march up to the White House and prominent politicians' actual homes with their actual families in them

Years ago nobody would've thought to take a vehicle and just drive into a crowd of human beings just to kill people either

Years ago nobody would've thought to burn down a police precinct, commandeer it, and form an apparent autonomous state

But here we are. So yeah, I would say it's entirely within the realm of possibility some ****ed up **** happens, like a week's worth of police killings + the election of Trump for 4 more years, and trying to install a SC judge in the very manner that was once considered something we're not supposed to be doing

Wait until people learn that it's not just about racism, but the rich/poor dynamic mixed in. Maybe they discover it on their own, maybe the media starts hammering home the concept

The burning down of police districts and community businesses aren't going to be the only things burning down...

Cops won't be the only targets. Hell, politicians have already been targets. Someone tried to mow down a bunch of them on a ****ing baseball field years ago. You don't think they'll just go after CEOs or politicians on their own lawn?

People are ****ing crazy and do insane **** all the time. This would be par for the course. Some of those people aren't even crazy, they're arriving at a logical conclusion that violence is warranted and that it IS justice, because there is no other way

You may not agree with it, I may not agree with it, this board may not, but we don't matter. The public will do what it wants, to itself and to each other, whether you like it or not

Change the laws, change the people
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Old Yesterday, 01:04 PM   #7555
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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I think cops should be required to wear body cams when they are executing a search warrant.
I agree unless there is reason to believe the property is vacant/abandoned.
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Old Yesterday, 01:46 PM   #7556
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by Isacnwtnhxton View Post
I'm tired of deadly riots in response to trashy criminals dying
Then tell the cops to stop murdering people.
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Old Yesterday, 02:06 PM   #7557
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by GodgersWOAT View Post
I agree unless there is reason to believe the property is vacant/abandoned.
Why?

Body cam footage can be evidence of whether officers stayed within the authority granted by warrants. (Was something in plain sight for example) and they may be wrong that the location is vacant.

In Breonna Taylor’s case, they were wrong about number of people in the apartment.
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Old Yesterday, 02:36 PM   #7558
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

Cops love body cams, more than 99% of the time it clears law enforcement of wrong doing.
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Old Yesterday, 02:39 PM   #7559
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by Isacnwtnhxton View Post
Cops love body cams, more than 99% of the time it clears law enforcement of wrong doing.
That cops routinely get away with murder despite it being on camera is not the winning argument you think it is.
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Old Yesterday, 03:03 PM   #7560
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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He’s right tho:
I don't care about the horse (oh noes someone call PETA), just laughing at whatever chain of events led to harkin thinking this Nazi is someone he should listen to and share posts from
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Old Yesterday, 03:08 PM   #7561
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by TeflonDawg View Post
Years ago nobody would've thought to take a vehicle and just drive into a crowd of human beings just to kill people either

Years ago nobody would've thought to burn down a police precinct, commandeer it, and form an apparent autonomous state

I don't really disagree with most of what you're saying--but humans/Americans didn't just start doing stuff like this recently Our history is filled with lots of stuff along similar lines(maybe not exactly the same but surely similar). And there are always people around that say--oh come on no one ever did stuff like that back in the day--but they did whether it's ~30/40/50yrs or ~100/200yrs etc
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Old Yesterday, 03:41 PM   #7562
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by GodgersWOAT View Post
Addressing your other weak argument: the fact that you and your ilk incessantly screech for lower funding for police and for less aggressive policing makes it clear how little you actually care about curbing the impact of criminal drug gangs’ violence in black and brown communities.

Addressing your only salient point: yes, police reform and improving outcomes for black and brown communities ravaged by criminal drug gangs are not mutually exclusive. HOWEVER, I would be very surprised if the kind of reform that would ultimately improve outcomes in these communities involved defunding police and limiting their aggressive tactics: both ideas you obviously ascribe to because it’s all your team permits.

My reform would involve arming every officer with weapons that can immediately neutralize violent and erratic criminals. These weapons would replace the cops traditional weapons and would be used in all but the most dangerous of situations. I also agree with reforms that involve massively increasing body armor budgets so that officers need not use deadly weapons while not increasing their risk of death when engaging in highly dangerous situations.
Some very bold assertions you're making. Care to provide any evidence that aggressive police tactics reduce criminal activity and/or improve outcomes in impoverished areas? Or are you just arguing based on your feels? (If you don't have any sources no worries, I'll link you some of mine. Unfortunately for you I haven't been able to find anything backing up your claims )

I'm also not sure how body armor would prevent a tragedy like George Floyd. Are you asserting that if the officer who murdered Floyd was equipped with body armor he would have chosen not to kneel on Floyd's neck until he expired?
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Old Yesterday, 03:51 PM   #7563
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

Officers that are heavily equipped with defensive armor have much less to fear from non-compliant arrestees.

I don’t know if it would have made a difference specifically in the Floyd case, but I think it would make a big difference in the no knock warrant cases.
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Old Yesterday, 03:53 PM   #7564
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

It should be self-evident that police that have their hands tied in terms of tactics will be less successful at neutralizing criminal threats effectively and safely.
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Old Yesterday, 03:56 PM   #7565
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

The issues arise when aggressiveness is combined with
(1) poor training (due to low funding)
(2) shoot first (with lethal firearm) mindset (this is mitigated by use of defensive armor and specialized non-lethal weapons to neutralize threats).

I don’t know why I need to provide proof that lethal weapons lead to more suspect fatalities than non-lethal disabling weapons.
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Old Yesterday, 04:01 PM   #7566
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

So you aren't interested in any information beyond your own gut-feels?
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Old Yesterday, 04:49 PM   #7567
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by GodgersWOAT View Post
Officers that are heavily equipped with defensive armor have much less to fear from non-compliant arrestees.
True. And I can imagine situations where that would help. But suppose during the Walker-Taylor raid planning stage they learned it was two likely armed Navy SEALs instead. My guess is in lieu of the plan they did adopt it would have reverted to something like: "We have you surrounded come out with your hands up." So I don't know if making the cops feel even more invincible is the solution. Like they say, once you give someone a hammer, everything becomes a nail.
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Old Yesterday, 04:51 PM   #7568
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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I got thru more of the post and it seems like this is a ringing endorsement for trumpism. Basic ***** conservatism wants law and order because stability, equality under the law and the end to the burning down of cities by peaceful protestors is a good first step to undo the damage blm has done.
Having a body cam off or "malfunctioning" at the most crucial point of interaction is not law and order. It's lawlessness

Trying to bury Ahmaud Arbery's murder is not law and order. It's lawlessness

If these things don't change, in real and meaningful terms, then you're going to continue to get a response you won't like. Trump can yap all he wants he is lying through his teeth and the Republican Party doesn't even pretend anymore. They don't ****ing care. They say the quiet parts out loud now and have been caught on camera and hot mics more times than I can count...

If you want law and order of the kind you're thinking, then the Republican Party has to stop installing corrupt pieces of **** in office. Democrats have that same problem, but on a smaller scale, and even within that context, is more of a reactionary response to the extremism of the right. It has gotten progressively worse since Reagan. Just say no may have been well intentioned, but it was a colossal disaster. Deficit spending a colossal disaster. Tearing down solar panels, which now looks like a prescient decision by Jimmy Carter, was also a terrible moment in history...

Now everything is out of control because no one has stepped in to make true change happen. Congress is filled with rich *******s who just want to argue about how to spend our money and all they're really doing is siphoning it off in pay raises, cushy post career jobs, and perks for being in power and helping out their friends while everyone, EVERYONE not wealthy or on a clear path to success is being ripped off

Even if you think you have good health insurance, you don't. You are being ripped off you just won't know it until the time comes when you need it most god forbid you fall into that situation. It's all bullshit, all corrupt, and all grotesque distortions of an economy based on capitalism

So when you see Taylor get killed and this discussion about no knock warrants, I see a Congress who refuses to decriminalize drugs, bolster rehabilitation and mental health services/healthcare in general, and an indifference to the insane, draconian power police exert over citizens at the southern border via drug seizure laws. Abuse of the Patriot Act, meant to fight terrorism, now only being used to throw the kitchen sink at any target they choose for drugs

If we weren't so ****ing corrupt and incompetent, we'd have had laws on the books DECADES ago that may have rendered these insanely militarized police units and insane policies and swaths of arrogant, hyper masculine morons obsolete. Or at least operating on a MUCH smaller scale, with manpower dedicated to other crimes of more significance and a far less need for violence...including the prevention of crime rather than the escalation of it

We're at a point now where a cop can't just give Sterling Brown a parking ticket and walk away. No, he's gotten give him a piece of his mind, disrespect a complete stranger, and call in 12 cops to back him up. Over a parking ticket. An incident that ended with an NBA player (read: really ****ing gainfully employed) getting tazed on some bullshit and those *******s feeling righteous about it. And then a bunch of dickheads come on these boards and decide that he deserved it! Get the **** out of here. Call him an *******, give him a ticket, and walk away. If the car's still there in an hour, then ****ing tow it. The end

Once we clean all that bullshit up, then we can move on to how ****ed up the Democratic Party is and all its inanity wrt...everything. But both sidesing does a disservice to the matter at hand, because the right side is a much bigger problem and has been for like at least a half century (whenever Southern Strategy started)
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Old Yesterday, 05:12 PM   #7569
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by Isacnwtnhxton View Post
Lol wut only got thru 2 sentences. Of course we all know about her. Before she got famous the only public information on the internet about her was her vile record, just like george floyd. Oh wait, he was known also as a porn dude, impulsive midwife, and failed rapper. Then he died and that's when he became a gentle giant.
The goal is to reduce the % chance that society produces a complete ******* like George Floyd

The goal is to reduce the % chance that society produces a justice system that leads to killing people like George Floyd, but rather exhausting every avenue possible to get him help and/or support so that he can be a better person

In doing so, the hope and expectation is that Breonna Taylor lives and gets to go to work the next day. She had no record and a good job. Dead Breonna Taylors don't help the economy, nor do families and communities who get devastated by the violence

We do not know what her true involvement or lack thereof was wrt to drug running. She had a bf who turned out to be a huge criminal, years ago. That should not be a death sentence, nor a reason to just dismiss the fact that she is DEAD

I don't care how long George Floyd's rap sheet is. I'm sure people will not miss him, but that's not the POINT. Nobody should be dead before the trial. Taylor should not be dead before the trial. And that's if a trial is even warranted! We scream about how there was no evidence to prove George Zimmerman murdered Trayvon Martin, but now we can't afford the same benefit of the doubt to Breonna Taylor? What the **** is that? Notice the common denominator, that people choose to defend the not dead people?

It's ****ing disturbing
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Old Yesterday, 05:33 PM   #7570
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Old Yesterday, 06:17 PM   #7571
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by GodgersWOAT View Post
It should be self-evident that police that have their hands tied in terms of tactics will be less successful at neutralizing criminal threats effectively and safely.
Reminds me of how police complained in the 60s that Miranda Rights would be the end of police investigation as we know it.
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Old Yesterday, 08:10 PM   #7572
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by Isacnwtnhxton View Post
Cops love body cams, more than 99% of the time it clears law enforcement of wrong doing.
And yet their unions pretty consistently fight the required use of them. Hmmm?

Do you think that is because with those camera's when they do the right thing, the camera's help and back that up.

But without the camera's when they do the wrong things they cannot simply lie and get away with it as easy?

Cops with no camara's will get the benefit of the doubt 99% of time, so really they don't need them when they do the right thing.
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Old Yesterday, 08:19 PM   #7573
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

Going out to take on the satanic libs--don't forget to like/subscribe donate hit up the patreon scoop a little merch and we'll update you with more option$$ as they arise. Later suckers. oh ya, maga and all that good stuff.
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Old Yesterday, 08:26 PM   #7574
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Originally Posted by Isacnwtnhxton View Post
Lol wut only got thru 2 sentences. Of course we all know about her. Before she got famous the only public information on the internet about her was her vile record, just like george floyd. Oh wait, he was known also as a porn dude, impulsive midwife, and failed rapper. Then he died and that's when he became a gentle giant.
What the actual ****? Taylor had literally zero criminal record before she was shot dead.

It's one thing to continually point to the record that someone like Floyd or Blake had; it's heartless, harmful, completely misses the point and makes you look like an *******, but it's at least based in reality. It's another entirely to say that someone who had never been charged with any crime and whose job helped save people's lives had a "vile record".
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Old Today, 12:18 AM   #7575
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Re: the murder of George Floyd by the Minneapolis Police

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Reminds me of how police complained in the 60s that Miranda Rights would be the end of police investigation as we know it.
Technological improvements and innovation (thanks 1980s NYPD) made things a lot better, but even still I think they’re still right if you run the counterfactual.
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