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Police brutality and police reform (US) Police brutality and police reform (US)

09-23-2020 , 03:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by goofyballer


Atlanta cop says property developers worked with the police department to crack down in apartment buildings so they could evict residents (they needed felony convictions in order to kick people out) and redevelop the buildings.

After talking to the media, he left Atlanta due to threats against his family.

Nice organization they got there.
Couple bad apples.
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09-23-2020 , 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Adrenocromo
Race soldier?
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09-23-2020 , 04:10 PM
What charges should be filed? The police served a no knock warrant and were shot at and returned fire. The system is culpable for having these types of warrants and the war on drugs but the police followed procedures. Time to end the war on drugs.
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09-23-2020 , 05:10 PM
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mod removed reference to deleted post
Almost all the other controversial police shootings included the assumption that a white person in the same situation would not have been shot. Is that the assumption in this case as well?

Last edited by EADGBE; 09-23-2020 at 06:44 PM.
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09-23-2020 , 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by David Sklansky
Almost all the other controversial police shootings included the assumption that a white person in the same situation would not have been shot. Is that the assumption in this case as well?
A white person may or may not have also been murdered in the same situation. Either way, it changes nothing. No one has ever claimed that the police force never shoot any innocent white people.
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09-23-2020 , 05:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Used2Play
What charges should be filed? The police served a no knock warrant and were shot at and returned fire. The system is culpable for having these types of warrants and the war on drugs but the police followed procedures. Time to end the war on drugs.
According to the police, they did knock. Agree on ending the war on drugs.
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09-23-2020 , 05:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble
According to the police, they did knock. Agree on ending the war on drugs.
The police literally lie about their actions in every single case where they shoot someone. Trusting anything the police says is dumb. The witnesses overwhelmingly confirm Breonna's boyfriend's account of the events.
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09-23-2020 , 05:23 PM
It is hilarious to see right wingers suddenly take the stand that you are not allowed to defend yourself against a gang of thugs knocking down your door.
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09-23-2020 , 05:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble
According to the police, they did knock. Agree on ending the war on drugs.
The cops lie all the time. All the time. Especially when they kill someone.
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09-23-2020 , 05:26 PM
I see more justification of violence ITT.
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09-23-2020 , 06:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble
According to the police, they did knock. Agree on ending the war on drugs.
right wingers dont want to end the war on drugs no matter how much they try to equivocate. the only way it ends is by defunding the police and we know how yall feel about that.
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09-23-2020 , 06:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
just want to go back to this one

https://www.rand.org/pubs/working_papers/WRA516-1.html
Quote:
[snip]Using time period and comparison, the counterfactual we estimate is what the earnings distribution would have looked like had incomes grown from 1975 to 2018 at the rate of real per capita GDP growth for the same period. Essentially, with this counterfactual, we are estimating what the income distribution would look like if incomes after 1975 had grown with the broader economy as they did in the 1948 to 1974 time period.

Discussion
In this paper, we introduced a new measure to assess the degree of equity in income growth and showed that the bottom 90 percent of workers generally had anemic income growth compared to the top percentile earners. Further, we quantified the cumulative effect of this inequity and found that the bottom 90 percent would be earning an additional $2.5 trillion had the income growth reflected growth in the per capita GDP.
Doesn't appear the "groundbreaking new working paper" considered the possible effect that taking away profits (a large portion of which are typically reinvested in capital goods) and giving it to employees (a large portion of which is typically spent on final consumption) would have on GDP growth.
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09-23-2020 , 06:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Andro
The police literally lie about their actions in every single case where they shoot someone. Trusting anything the police says is dumb. The witnesses overwhelmingly confirm Breonna's boyfriend's account of the events.
There is a witness from the apartment who heard the police announce themselves (a black man fwiw). However both parties can be right. It’s plausible the police could announce themselves and the boyfriend did not hear because they were asleep intially. The one witness who heard the police was awake and outside most others would be sleeping with doors and windows closed at 1240 am.
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09-23-2020 , 08:02 PM
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Originally Posted by John21
https://www.rand.org/pubs/working_papers/WRA516-1.html


Doesn't appear the "groundbreaking new working paper" considered the possible effect that taking away profits (a large portion of which are typically reinvested in capital goods) and giving it to employees (a large portion of which is typically spent on final consumption) would have on GDP growth.
The GDP growth was pretty impressive from post WWII to 1975.

I suspect the authors are aware of how increased wages effect the GDP.

Also, consumption is an input to the GDP formula. Economies grow which means they aren't zero sum games.
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09-23-2020 , 09:21 PM
It's interesting. You have a grand jury made up of citizens deciding this. I wonder what particular law you would change to get a different results from the grand jury.
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09-23-2020 , 09:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
just want to go back to this one

This is shocking in its scale even at a fraction of it being true.

This is Russia type Oligarchy theft but under the veil of democracy.

The country, as a whole would be doing so much better (everyone including the 1%) if this wealth was more evenly spread and thus put back in to building the American middle class and economy.

Yes the top 1% do even better grabbing it all but at what cost and for how long? You see in Russia how short term the gain is, as the wealth generator (the country) declines and declines.

So gross. So very wrong.
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09-23-2020 , 09:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Used2Play
What charges should be filed? The police served a no knock warrant and were shot at and returned fire. The system is culpable for having these types of warrants and the war on drugs but the police followed procedures. Time to end the war on drugs.
Yes new laws need to be added to address this.

No knocks need to be saved only for the most extreme circumstances, as they were originally designed. You know, to take down a Cartel, or Mafia guarded house. Not to take down, what the police intel said was a lone woman at home.

Also use of force needs to be proportional. Does anyone think this was proportional as bullets went in to the unit next door and thru the roof towards the unit above?

What if she had some young family member kids over? What if she had white neighbours and their kids were shot?

Not that it should matter if its white kids or an adult but I think most of us would think that if neighbour kids were killed by these indiscriminately fired bullets the charges would be more severe.

What these cops did was not proportional, in any sense. It started with an erroneous warrant they never should have got, and turned into an execution of a bystander when another person rightly used self defense when faced with an impossible situation.

At every step, compounding police errors caused this death and the charges end up being laughable.
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09-23-2020 , 10:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
This is shocking in its scale even at a fraction of it being true.

This is Russia type Oligarchy theft but under the veil of democracy.

The country, as a whole would be doing so much better (everyone including the 1%) if this wealth was more evenly spread and thus put back in to building the American middle class and economy.

Yes the top 1% do even better grabbing it all but at what cost and for how long? You see in Russia how short term the gain is, as the wealth generator (the country) declines and declines.

So gross. So very wrong.
Curious, which single entity do you think has benefited the most from this?


See:

https://taxfoundation.org/short-hist...united-states/

It's never government's fault.

Last edited by itshotinvegas; 09-23-2020 at 10:27 PM.
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09-23-2020 , 10:19 PM
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right wingers dont want to end the war on drugs no matter how much they try to equivocate. the only way it ends is by defunding the police

Why couldn't you just eliminate the section of the criminal code that prohibits the sale, production, importation, and consumption of controlled substances? Then you really could defund the police because the whole narcotics squad wouldn't even be necessary. It would be a massive improvement with regards to civil liberties, and we all know minorities and the poor are adversely affected by the war on drugs. And this would significantly reduce the number of people incarcerated every year, not only because no one would go jail for drug dealing or using, but also because there is a lot of violence associated with the illegal drug trade itself that presumably would no longer exist. And it would be good for the police too because you have to imagine a lot of their high risk raids involve taking on drug traffickers.


I really don't see any case for the continuation of the war on drugs at all.
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09-23-2020 , 10:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble
Why couldn't you just eliminate the section of the criminal code that prohibits the sale, production, importation, and consumption of controlled substances? Then you really could defund the police because the whole narcotics squad wouldn't even be necessary. It would be a massive improvement with regards to civil liberties, and we all know minorities and the poor are adversely affected by the war on drugs. And this would significantly reduce the number of people incarcerated every year, not only because no one would go jail for drug dealing or using, but also because there is a lot of violence associated with the illegal drug trade itself that presumably would no longer exist. And it would be good for the police too because you have to imagine a lot of their high risk raids involve taking on drug traffickers.


I really don't see any case for the continuation of the war on drugs at all.
The left hates tobacco, drug, and gun companies for multiple reasons. One of which is they apparently steal ****, and their products harm their consumers and society at large.
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09-23-2020 , 10:25 PM
I've always thought that Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms should be the name of a big box chain, not a federal agency.
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09-24-2020 , 12:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RFlushDiamonds
The GDP growth was pretty impressive from post WWII to 1975.

I suspect the authors are aware of how increased wages effect the GDP.
Idk. Even libertarians agree that if all surplus value was returned to the workers the workers would be better off, today. And most socialists agree that some surplus value needs to be kept from the workers to support those working in science, R&D, etc. to ensure increased living standards, tomorrow. In other words, the focal point of the entire debate is around how much workers need to give up today for a more prosperous tomorrow, whichever schema we're employing. So if they have some counterfactual showing productivity wouldn't have declined despite significantly more profits going to the workers, I can't imagine why they wouldn't include it because it would completely destroy the libertarians' instrumental claim that we're all better off allowing the rich to get richer.
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09-24-2020 , 01:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PokerPlayingGamble
Why couldn't you just eliminate the section of the criminal code that prohibits the sale, production, importation, and consumption of controlled substances? Then you really could defund the police because the whole narcotics squad wouldn't even be necessary. It would be a massive improvement with regards to civil liberties, and we all know minorities and the poor are adversely affected by the war on drugs. And this would significantly reduce the number of people incarcerated every year, not only because no one would go jail for drug dealing or using, but also because there is a lot of violence associated with the illegal drug trade itself that presumably would no longer exist. And it would be good for the police too because you have to imagine a lot of their high risk raids involve taking on drug traffickers.


I really don't see any case for the continuation of the war on drugs at all.
If drug game becomes legal, then drug runners will do something more lucrative. Maybe trafficking people idk, but it’s going to be worse than what they’re doing now most likely. Runners gonna run.
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09-24-2020 , 01:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Used2Play
What charges should be filed? The police served a no knock warrant and were shot at and returned fire. The system is culpable for having these types of warrants and the war on drugs but the police followed procedures. Time to end the war on drugs.
Well the boyfriend that shot a cop during the home invasion was released the next day with no charges filed. That points to the police conducting the home invasion improperly and while they were conducting this improperly there was at the least a wonderful death.
There is no consequence when you do your job improperly and someone dies because of your negligence?
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