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Israel/Palestine thread Israel/Palestine thread

12-08-2024 , 11:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BOIDS
anyone got some analysis on the syria events/the intersection with i/p?

from what i can make out the axis of L have taken another L and vic seems mad about it, so probably safe to assume the fall of assad is a good thing, but keen to hear more
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
Israel gains massively if Iran loses the land route to supply Hezbollah.

Putin loses massively if he loses the naval base in the Mediterranean.

the above is why Vic and friends are sad.

Fall of Assad is terrible for Qurds though which are our friends and allies. and the islamist fanatics who are going to replace Assad if they manage to get Syria aren't our friends either.
All true but still very good for Israel in the short term

I do see them wanting to regain the Golan heights at some point but I still cannot fathom a scenario where the new regime becomes an ally of Iran, at least not in the next two decades.

So overall it's good for Israel

Whether or not it is good for the people of Syria or not, that i cannot answer
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12-08-2024 , 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by metsandfinsfan
All true but still very good for Israel in the short term



I do see them wanting to regain the Golan heights at some point but I still cannot fathom a scenario where the new regime becomes an ally of Iran, at least not in the next two decades.



So overall it's good for Israel



Whether or not it is good for the people of Syria or not, that i cannot answer
first the golam zone was supposed to be a buffer zone now the golan itself needs a buffer zone , is that how expansion works ?
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12-08-2024 , 03:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MyrnaFTW
first the golam zone was supposed to be a buffer zone now the golan itself needs a buffer zone , is that how expansion works ?

When you keep attacking a country for no reason yes the border sonet move
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12-08-2024 , 03:52 PM
when did Syria attack Israel? and furthermore, when did the current Syrian regime that is less than 2 days old attack Israel?
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12-08-2024 , 04:35 PM
Syria fired rockets at Israel after Oct 7
Iran helped supply Assad and Israel is now targeting those weapons
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12-08-2024 , 05:03 PM
Israel is literally just stealing land and putting all of the civilians on house arrest.
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12-08-2024 , 05:05 PM
They were stealing nothing

And I'm not upset
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12-08-2024 , 05:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by metsandfinsfan
Syria fired rockets at Israel after Oct 7
Iran helped supply Assad and Israel is now targeting those weapons
I am grunching this conversation, so maybe this is what you guys are talking about; but Israel is destroying weapons they dont want the rebels to get, including alleged chemical weapons. Of course they could have destroyed them anytime when they were under Assad's care, but didn't (for whatever reasons).

I have no inside information so am just speculating, but there is actually a possibility this has already been coordinated with Russia/Syria/Turkey, who have given their blessing.
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12-08-2024 , 05:07 PM
Syria joined this was 14 months ago. Uninvited.

Actions have consequences

All the Iran and Russia backed governments in the Middle East need to not exist

All the Iranian weaponry needs to disappear
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12-08-2024 , 05:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunyain
I am grunching this conversation, so maybe this is what you guys are talking about; but Israel is destroying weapons they dont want the rebels to get, including alleged chemical weapons. Of course they could have destroyed them anytime when they were under Assad's care, but didn't (for whatever reasons).

I have no inside information so am just speculating, but there is actually a possibility this has already been coordinated with Russia/Syria/Turkey, who have given their blessing.
Correct

Israel is in a mission. They aren't stealing land. They are controlling the border so they can destroy the weapons
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12-08-2024 , 05:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by metsandfinsfan
They were stealing nothing

And I'm not upset
why would you be upset? you support Israel and this is a crucial part of their ideology. to take land and control the natives.

even Barak Ravid admits they are stealing the land.



I am not sure why you feel the need to have it both ways.
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12-08-2024 , 05:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
Israel is literally just stealing land and putting all of the civilians on house arrest.
I dont necessarily agree with your characterization, but it is possible this has been coordinated with the other players in the region. For all the outward rhetoric, behind the scenes countries like Syria, Turkey and Russia do coordinate regional security with Israel, especially concerning Islamist groups.
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12-08-2024 , 05:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
Im pretty ambivalent really. historically, its pretty bad when ISIS takes over. but maybe this time it will be ok.
Well, having fundamentalist theocrats take control didn't work very well for Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Yemen, Lebanon or Gaza. But like you said, maybe this will be the exception.
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12-08-2024 , 05:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunyain
I dont necessarily agree with your characterization, but it is possible this has been coordinated with the other players in the region. For all the outward rhetoric, behind the scenes countries like Syria, Turkey and Russia do coordinate regional security with Israel, especially concerning Islamist groups.
ofc they are coordinating, but that doesnt make the statement false. Israel has taken control of a large portion of Syria and confined all of the residents to house arrest.

Quote:
Well, having fundamentalist theocrats take control didn't work very well for Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, Yemen, Lebanon or Gaza. But like you said, maybe this will be the exception.
the funny part is that the West and the USA and Israel funded and armed these fundamentalists. its a joke.
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12-08-2024 , 05:44 PM
Has temporarily taken control is much different than stealing
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12-08-2024 , 06:44 PM
Words and rules are different for Zionists than us peons. If I told the judge I just temporarily took something and didn't give it back, I'm pretty sure it's a guilty verdict. But I'm not superior.
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12-08-2024 , 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Victor
"became a country" is a pretty nice euphemism.

when "Israel became a country" they did one of the most massive ethnic cleanses of the modern era. and it was premeditated and executed deliberately and precisely.

If you do not believe Israel should exist, this is the type of sophomoric, not based on reality argument one would make. One would certainly not mention the genocide committed against Jewish populations in all the surrounding Arab countries, which of course absolutely did happen when Israel was created.

This is why there is no role for debating facts here, given that there is no agreement as to the facts, other than for one.

The only one undeniable fact is that your side would like Israel to cease existing, by any means necessary. Genocide was already committed against Jews in the surrounding countries, and your side intends to repeat that with Israel. That is why Israel is engaged in a war and will not stop. You see, in a war your goal is to destroy the other side until they agree to end the war. But, for now, the other side has pledged to continue fighting on. Therefore, this war must continue until Gaza no longer exists, or they finally agree to live in peace alongside Israel.

Just copy and pasted this to everything you say going forward.
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12-08-2024 , 07:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
Words and rules are different for Zionists than us peons. If I told the judge I just temporarily took something and didn't give it back, I'm pretty sure it's a guilty verdict. But I'm not superior.
Okay, you need to chill out please. This is too far ^

Please take a timeout until 12:00 AM Eastern Time
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12-08-2024 , 07:20 PM
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Originally Posted by metsandfinsfan
Has temporarily taken control is much different than stealing
Is it? Did Israel give Syria a handwritten receipt? I'm not seeing how this is anything other than a straightforward land grab.

Which is not to concede that Israel even has the right in the first place to temporarily take control of the sovereign territory of another nation.
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12-08-2024 , 08:02 PM
Quote:
Netanyahu warned Assad on November 27, the day Syria's rebel offensive began, that he was "playing with fire" by supporting Hezbollah and helping to transfer weapons to Lebanon
.

Who in Syria would have given that receipt?

We're in the middle of a war. Syria transfered weapons to hezbollah. Hezbollah attacked Israel. Israel now needs to do whatever to destroy those weapons. Of even take them

This is how war works

https://www.france24.com/en/live-new...d-analysts-say
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12-08-2024 , 08:26 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
when did Syria attack Israel? and furthermore, when did the current Syrian regime that is less than 2 days old attack Israel?
Is there a current Syrian regime?

Israel is taking preemptive measures to secure their border and the buffer zone. If you don’t believe Jews should be able to defend themselves, you’ll start spinning this as a land grab instead of just plain common sense given the situation. The Syrian troops (and UN?) who were previously tasked with controlling the buffer zone collapsed. It’s up in the air which extremist group will end up in control of Syria, but no matter what it will be a group who hates Jews. If youre OK with that, then keep protesting.
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12-08-2024 , 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson
Is it? Did Israel give Syria a handwritten receipt? I'm not seeing how this is anything other than a straightforward land grab.

Which is not to concede that Israel even has the right in the first place to temporarily take control of the sovereign territory of another nation.
Well of course you wouldn’t, you’re intensely biased against Israel. Everything they do is a land grab or a genocide in your eyes.
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12-09-2024 , 07:46 AM
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Originally Posted by DoyleBrunsonFan
Is there a current Syrian regime?

Israel is taking preemptive measures to secure their border and the buffer zone. If you don’t believe Jews should be able to defend themselves, you’ll start spinning this as a land grab instead of just plain common sense given the situation. The Syrian troops (and UN?) who were previously tasked with controlling the buffer zone collapsed. It’s up in the air which extremist group will end up in control of Syria, but no matter what it will be a group who hates Jews. If youre OK with that, then keep protesting.
No, they dont have the right to roll tanks into Syria and terrorize the population. I dont care who they are. why do you think that rules shouldnt apply to them?
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12-09-2024 , 08:23 AM
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Originally Posted by LtUaE42
If you do not believe Israel should exist, this is the type of sophomoric, not based on reality argument one would make. One would certainly not mention the genocide committed against Jewish populations in all the surrounding Arab countries, which of course absolutely did happen when Israel was created.

This is why there is no role for debating facts here, given that there is no agreement as to the facts, other than for one.

The only one undeniable fact is that your side would like Israel to cease existing, by any means necessary. Genocide was already committed against Jews in the surrounding countries, and your side intends to repeat that with Israel. That is why Israel is engaged in a war and will not stop. You see, in a war your goal is to destroy the other side until they agree to end the war. But, for now, the other side has pledged to continue fighting on. Therefore, this war must continue until Gaza no longer exists, or they finally agree to live in peace alongside Israel.

Just copy and pasted this to everything you say going forward.
bolded is ludicrous. there was no genocide against Jews by Arab countries and certainly not in 1947 when the ethnic cleansing happened.

regardless, even if there was, wtf does that have to do with the Palestinians? Ive asked this question many times and no one has been able to tell me why supposed mistreatment of Jews in Algeria or Iraq or wherever gives Israel the right to brutalize the Palestinians.
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12-09-2024 , 09:34 AM
Re: dangerous double standards in geopolitics

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c0q0w1g8zqvo

Not sure whether to laugh or cry
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