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Israel/Palestine thread Israel/Palestine thread

05-24-2024 , 01:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd
I have posted this before but I will post it again for referece.



As a reminder, the US military raped their way through Okinawa. It wasn't a coordinated plan. But it happened.
And still ongoing
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05-24-2024 , 03:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rafiki
Of the 2.2M, how many civilians need to die for it to be genocide? What do you think is a number that holds water?

I won't even muddy the waters with intent/human shield sort of stuff.
Not interested in playing silly number games.

Some things in life don’t need exact definitions for us to recognise them and I hope you know this.
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05-24-2024 , 03:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd
Wherever men wage war, they rape. This is an undisputed historical fact of women's history. The question is not whether rape and sexual violence occured- The question is whether rape and sexual violence was a coordinated and planned aspect of the attack. I do not doubt rape occurred. I know it did. Women know it did. But I do tend to doubt that devout Muslims coordinated en masse rape as part of their attack when it directly opposes their religious tenets. Rape occurs without those plans anyway.
Crossnerd while that was common historically, I would need proof of Italian military raping in Afghanistan and Lebanon here otherwise you have to change your claim at least for recent military interventions.

Raping the infidels doesn't necessarily oppose all Muslims religious tenets btw, that religion interpretation of the concept is very fluid (in the sense that there are a myriad different interpretations inside Islam) and some radicals believe the infidels (to summarizes) basically aren't humans.

And you don't need coordinated raping for all the 10 7 mission participants, a group of them believing they can rape the infidels liberally and doing that wantonly is already enough to mark a significant difference with many other recent military interventions from the west
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05-24-2024 , 03:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd
There actually is a tangible difference in ideology if Hamas coordinated rape attacks as part of their military strategy vs Hamas simply consisting of men, a % of whom rape.
There is a difference in ideology also if the % of rapists among Hamas 10 7 attackers is a lot higher than the % of rapists among Americans in, say, Afghanistan
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05-24-2024 , 04:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd
I have posted this before but I will post it again for referece.



As a reminder, the US military raped their way through Okinawa. It wasn't a coordinated plan. But it happened.
Just to understand, why should we use as reference the opinion of an actual communist on any topic?



And I was told I have an obsession with Marxism, Marxism doesn't exist anymore, doesn't influence people anymore...

Here we have a mod who is actually basing her interpretation of how to mod on a topic on the opinion of a communist on the topic
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05-24-2024 , 04:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd
It isn't an excuse. Its an indictment. If men were so horrified by rape, they would stop each other from raping. Instead, its a hallmark of male violence that permeates the entirety of human history.
Is your claim is that men treat rape today in the same way they did when it was accepted if it was the rape of foreigners, in the past? and that based on the reference of a communist writer?
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05-24-2024 , 04:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd
You can have that opinion but it goes against all empirical evidence of women’s history of sexual violence in war time. Indeed, it is a phenomenon that has not diminished within the framework of other atrocities within modern history. You can be mad at me for citing it, or mad at the men who make it true. The patriarchy is a monolith, but if you want to “not all men” me, by all means, I am versed in that arena.

<shrug>
proof needed for western armies. I need proof for the claim "all men equally". That the propensity to rape is higher in men than in women is biologically obvious. Proof needed that all culture in all of history managed that propensity identically. Otherwise we can *rank cultures for their propensity to allow rape* in a moral sense, which would put western culture above basically all others, in that regard.

A lot of proof needed to deny that.

"the patriarchy is a monolith" what?
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05-24-2024 , 04:50 AM
Anyway at the university of Turin, currently occupied by students (at least some building), an imam described how the jihad is the greatest moral effort, to which women and children participate as well, for liberation of their lands

https://x.com/MarcoFattorini/status/1793742744143462628

Source unfortunately in italian (the imam is speaking in italian)
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05-24-2024 , 05:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
One thing i never properly understood is why the WB isn't Jordan territory, and Gaza egypt territory
I thought it was basically because they didn't want back after Israel ended their active occupation. I have seen others state as much here at least about Gaza. They don't seem to care about the people who live there any more than Israel does.
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05-24-2024 , 05:15 AM
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Originally Posted by filthyvermin
must... not... internet argue... with people justifying bombing kids, hospitals, and apartment buildings

It's been at least a few days since anyone as mentioned hospitals and apartment building here. Very little talk of kids either. And I haven't seen anyone claim that anything in particular was just. Maybe you're just talking about the people on reddit who Victor often criticizer for...reasons?
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05-24-2024 , 05:22 AM
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Originally Posted by PointlessWords
Pakistan is run by terrorists and there are no nuke issues yet
Seems like possible racist bigotry expressed here? But I'm not sure as I still don't know exactly what others' definitions of racism are.
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05-24-2024 , 05:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd
Dunyain, first of all, I can find no credible online reference for the bolded. Second of all, this above post is riddled with Islamophobic rhetoric far past what is acceptable. Please take a timeout from this thread until 12:00 AM Eastern Time. Please be warned any further posting that violates the bigotry and racism rule for this thread will result in temp bans. Please do not disregard this message. Thank you, friend.
Wow. I honestly have no idea what you would find to be bigoted rhetoric in Dunyain's post.
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05-24-2024 , 05:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubble_Balls
Nope. It’s on the person pulling the trigger, always. You don’t see cops leveling city blocks because murderers live there.
To be fair, you do see that every once in a while.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_MOVE_bombing
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05-24-2024 , 05:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 57 On Red
No, quite, massive regional nuclear superpower, invincible by any reasonable measure, and yet they still make the 'Poor little us' claim all the time.
Whenever my 7 pound toothless morkie decides to be stupid aggressive towards a giant scary looking dog, the big dog always gets a sad look on its face and I do feel bad for it.
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05-24-2024 , 05:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubble_Balls
Could point to decades of killing on either side and say the same. Surely, Hamas 2.0 will find the same justification in the future from what’s happening now. Every event needs to be evaluated for itself. Thinking you can forever avoid moral culpability because of some injury in the past is nonsense. It’s literally not different than Hamas.
Some here seem to think that poor black people in the US should be able do this.
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05-24-2024 , 05:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by PointlessWords
I agree that they are not trying to take the land. They have already taken it.
They tried to give it back to Egypt, who wouldn't take responsibility for it.
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05-24-2024 , 05:52 AM
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Originally Posted by chillrob
Some here seem to think that poor black people in the US should be able do this.
What does this have to do with Israel/Palestine?
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05-24-2024 , 05:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalfrezi
What does this have to do with Israel/Palestine?
A moral framework should be applied every time, otherwise you can expose a lack of morals and a cynical interest to treat some issues differently from others.
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05-24-2024 , 05:58 AM
I wasn't asking you.
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05-24-2024 , 05:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trolly McTrollson
I don't know how else to explain to you that there isn't a minimum body count. Again, you can easily look up the UN's working definition of terms like genocide and ethnic cleansing for yourself.
I see the phrase "intent to destroy" there. It doesn't seem to me that Israel is trying to destroy the Palestinian Arab people.
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05-24-2024 , 06:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rafiki
Same day as the footage of the five 19 year old girls in their pjs being taken, all live on gopro. Yes, enlisted IDF women unarmed and off duty. But the footage is a tough watch.

It's been a pretty brutal reminder of what the IDF is fighting for.
But they did perform the social nicety of telling the girls how pretty they all are.
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05-24-2024 , 06:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalfrezi
I wasn't asking you.
A moral framework should be applied every time, otherwise you can expose a lack of morals and a cynical interest to treat some issues differently from others.
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05-24-2024 , 06:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jalfrezi
I wasn't asking you.
If you want private conversations there are PMs
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05-24-2024 , 06:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crossnerd
Wherever men wage war, they rape. This is an undisputed historical fact of women's history. The question is not whether rape and sexual violence occured- The question is whether rape and sexual violence was a coordinated and planned aspect of the attack. I do not doubt rape occurred. I know it did. Women know it did. But I do tend to doubt that devout Muslims coordinated en masse rape as part of their attack when it directly opposes their religious tenets. Rape occurs without those plans anyway.
How sure are you about this? And does your definition of rape include all sex with 9yo girls?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aisha

With regard to your posts about rape happening in every war, since ever - sadly, rape is a successful reproductive strategy which is selected by evolution. And soldiers are not known for restraining their baser instincts. In fact, they seem to mostly be trained to embrace them.

Last edited by chillrob; 05-24-2024 at 06:15 AM.
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05-24-2024 , 06:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Luciom
If you want private conversations there are PMs
I was interested in someone else's opinion other than the person who dominates every conversation in the politics forum.
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