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Israel/Palestine thread Israel/Palestine thread

Yesterday , 03:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bubble_Balls
The agencies mentioned in the article were relevant as in closest to the action and had the most expertise on the matter. The State Department is relevant in the sense that they’re the final word and can just ignore facts they don’t like from other agencies. If you want to be charitable, you can argue that they did so with the belief that they could pressure the Israelis into improving their behavior but that doesn’t mean they determined they weren’t blocking aid.
I was just stating what was said in the article. Yes, it did mention that the 2 agencies had the most direct experience with aid agencies but didn’t expound on it much. I’m not necessarily disagreeing with how you interpreted the article, but ultimately the one dissenting agency backed down for unspecified reasons. Israel is surely blocking some amount of aid because ultimately, large portions of it end up in Hamas hands and not with the people it’s intended for. Unfortunately, it’s not a black and white situation and getting aid to the right people requires some amount of force and effort to remove Hamas, who are the number one obstacle to getting aid to the Palestinians who need it.
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Yesterday , 04:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MyrnaFTW
Yeah let Israel make itself safe by destroying the rest of the world .
Well I think they are only going to destroy lebanon then pack up and go home.

The repercussions there remain to be seen.

Last edited by formula72; Yesterday at 04:26 PM.
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Yesterday , 05:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
are the young men from the infamous drone strike video included since they were identified later?

what about the unidentified people from drone strike videos?

what about the people buried in streets or backyards?

what about the babies who died lack of incubation and found decomposed?

what about the people who starved to death?

who couldnt get dialysis?

who died in child birth?

who are buried under the rubble?

or who have just disappeared?
https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/how-g...ry-counts-dead

we got some direct answers to these questions. lets just say that the assumptions by some people in this thread were wrong.

only the first 2 categories are included in the casualty numbers and that is only if their body parts are taken to a hospital or morgue.
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Yesterday , 06:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by formula72
Well I think they are only going to destroy lebanon then pack up and go home.

The repercussions there remain to be seen.
if they go into Lebanon, which is looking more and more likely, they wont leave unless the Liberation forces drive them out. many of their leaders, media, and politicians are openly talking about stealing the South and East and settling it.
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Yesterday , 06:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DoyleBrunsonFan
Israel is surely blocking some amount of aid because ultimately, large portions of it end up in Hamas hands
So what's the reason for blocking tampons?

War on Gaza: Women cut up tents for period products

Quote:
Since the Israeli onslaught on the Palestinian enclave began on 7 October, the total siege on Gaza has prevented hygiene and period products from entering the Strip.
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Yesterday , 06:53 PM
why are you citing an article from january is the better question. kind of weird to talk about aid efforts from january when we are currently in september, almost october now.
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Yesterday , 09:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
https://www.dropsitenews.com/p/how-g...ry-counts-dead

we got some direct answers to these questions. lets just say that the assumptions by some people in this thread were wrong.

only the first 2 categories are included in the casualty numbers and that is only if their body parts are taken to a hospital or morgue.
Dr. Zaher al-Wahaidi: The estimates from the Government Media Office indicate that the number of martyrs is 50,000, as at least 10,000 are still under the rubble. This is the declared number, and there are unreported figures as well.
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Yesterday , 09:21 PM






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Yesterday , 09:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluegrassplayer
Dr. Zaher al-Wahaidi: The estimates from the Government Media Office indicate that the number of martyrs is 50,000, as at least 10,000 are still under the rubble. This is the declared number, and there are unreported figures as well.
the declared number is not over 50k. its like 42k. quick google search or just reading mainstream sources will tell you that. it is even mentioned in that article.



reread the article, they keep 2 lists.







regardless, this guy is explicit that none of these groups are on either list

Quote:
what about the babies who died lack of incubation and found decomposed?

what about the people who starved to death?

who couldnt get dialysis?

who died in child birth?

or who have just disappeared?




it takes a lot of effort to debunk your blatant misinformation. just linking an article is not enough. I need to screenshot every single point otherwise you will deny it. regardless, now others can see the truth of how meticulous the Health Ministry is and how the reported number of ~42k is a massive undercount.
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Yesterday , 10:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor
the declared number is not over 50k. its like 42k. quick google search or just reading mainstream sources will tell you that. it is even mentioned in that article.



Take this up with the person from the article? I'm not doubting 42k, and I'm not doubting that 10k is buried, I'm doubting the outrageous opinion piece in the Lancet claiming 186k, and your claims of (if I recall correctly, 500k):

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluegrassplayer

It's a very loose estimate. Could be higher than 10k, probably not 140k higher though.
[QUOTE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluegrassplayer
To begin with the number suggested by the article, and which Victor is claiming is for the current total TODAY, is nearly twice 100k: 186k to be exact. What Victor is suggesting that the article says is that currently for every body that the Gaza Health Ministry claims, there are 4 bodies which haven't been discovered. That's not 1 death per bomb, it's 4.

Whereas the UN claims there's 10k or so uncovered bodies, he is saying there's 150,000.





Quote:
reread the article, they keep 2 lists.




OK?






Quote:
regardless, this guy is explicit that none of these groups are on either list







it takes a lot of effort to debunk your blatant misinformation. just linking an article is not enough. I need to screenshot every single point otherwise you will deny it. regardless, now others can see the truth of how meticulous the Health Ministry is and how the reported number of ~42k is a massive undercount.
Yep, looks like I was wrong on a few of those, although several of them do fall into the category of being counted as casualties. Sorry, I can't answer all of your sealioning questions on demand. My overall point still stands: approx 40k dead when we previously discussed it, approx 10k buried. Your source seems to second that opinion, which isn't surprising since he works for the same organization as the person from the last article I posted on the subject. It's almost as if these are numbers directly from the Gaza Ministry of Health:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluegrassplayer
Dr. Zaher al-Wahaidi: The estimates from the Government Media Office indicate that the number of martyrs is 50,000, as at least 10,000 are still under the rubble. This is the declared number, and there are unreported figures as well.

You were trying to suggest that there's a lot of bodies which the Ministry of Health knew about but could not count in their figures, and that is not the case.


I doubt that there's 450k dead from lack of dialysis, childbirth, or starvation. This isn't meant to discount these issues, it's meant to highlight that realistic and confirmed numbers are better than outright fiction. 200k is outright fiction at this point. 500k...

Thanks for sharing the article, it's good information. It clarifies my main points and also corrects some minor points we had to make assumptions about due to lack of information.
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Today , 12:33 AM
Israel Deliberately Blocked Humanitarian Aid to Gaza, Two Government Bodies Concluded. Antony Blinken Rejected Them.

and then lied to congress about it.


Quote:
The U.S. government’s two foremost authorities on humanitarian assistance concluded this spring that Israel had deliberately blocked deliveries of food and medicine into Gaza.

The U.S. Agency for International Development delivered its assessment to Secretary of State Antony Blinken and the State Department’s refugees bureau made its stance known to top diplomats in late April. Their conclusion was explosive because U.S. law requires the government to cut off weapons shipments to countries that prevent the delivery of U.S.-backed humanitarian aid.

[...] Days later, on May 10, Blinken delivered a carefully worded statement to Congress that said, “We do not currently assess that the Israeli government is prohibiting or otherwise restricting the transport or delivery of U.S. humanitarian assistance.”

Prior to his report, USAID had sent Blinken a detailed 17-page memo on Israel’s conduct. The memo described instances of Israeli interference with aid efforts, including killing aid workers, razing agricultural structures, bombing ambulances and hospitals, sitting on supply depots and routinely turning away trucks full of food and medicine.

[...] Separately, the head of the State Department’s Bureau of Population, Refugees and Migration had also determined that Israel was blocking humanitarian aid and that the Foreign Assistance Act should be triggered to freeze almost $830 million in taxpayer dollars earmarked for weapons and bombs to Israel, according to emails obtained by ProPublica.

The U.N. has declared a famine in parts of Gaza. The world’s leading independent panel of aid experts found that nearly half of the Palestinians in the enclave are struggling with hunger. Many go days without eating. Local authorities say dozens of children have starved to death — likely a significant undercount. Health care workers are battling a lack of immunizations compounded by a sanitation crisis. Last month, a little boy became Gaza’s first confirmed case of polio in 25 years.

The USAID officials wrote that because of Israel’s behavior, the U.S. should pause additional arms sales to the country. ProPublica obtained a copy of the agency’s April memo along with the list of evidence that the officials cited to back up their findings.

USAID, which is led by longtime diplomat Samantha Power, said the looming famine in Gaza was the result of Israel’s “arbitrary denial, restriction, and impediments of U.S. humanitarian assistance,” according to the memo.

[...] It is, USAID concluded, “one of the worst humanitarian catastrophes in the world.”

there of course will be zero consequences to doing this genocide and lying to congress about it
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Today , 12:39 AM
1) what is the law? the article doesn’t cite the law

2) it says blocking US-backed humanitarian aid. What does that mean? Did the agencies assess that they blocked US-backed humanitarian aid?

3) are the findings of these reports binding at all? what was in the report?

The article is a poorly written opinion piece, not news.
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Today , 01:19 AM
I am curious. Amongst those who consistently post here in favor or the Palestinians and against Israel:

1) Do you think Israel has the right to exist?
2) If not, what should happen to Israel?
3) If yes, then how would you create peace with those who do not believe Israel has the right to exist (eg, Hamas, Hezbollah)?
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