Quote:
Originally Posted by well named
FWIW I inferred your support from the post I quoted, which I think you also reference when you say "yes I do support AA for the reason I gave, which is that society benefits from a more even playing field."
Or because his first post itt he brought up "reverse discrimination", responded to questions implying, and implied himself? On top of that, he's the champion of the removal of "bad faith" postng so obviously he wouldn't have been doing that
Quote:
Originally Posted by well named
It makes sense to me to think of anti-discrimination law in this sense, more so than AA.
What exactly are you two smoking? You don't get to just tell people "I like to think of it this way" to completely avoid reality. AA has also been called positive discrimination. Reverse discrimination by max cut. The word discrimination is in the title. They aren't discriminating a positive or a reverse, they're discriminating based on race. If you think it will create a more "level playing field", better social outcome, is more fair, etc, good for you. What you don't get to do is conflate your objective/goal/expectation with the methods used to achieve them. The method is racial discrimination. If you're going to advocate for that, you need to own up to it and/or justify it. Denying it and playing hide the ball is totally ridiculous. What max cut is doing is either completely dishonest or delusional
Quote:
Originally Posted by Max Cut
I wonder what percent of people responding to a pew poll would say murder should be legal. Would that be the correct context for measuring opinions on capital punishment?
The max cut argument for capital punishment
I believe in capital punishment for mass murderers. We shouldn't pay for them to rot in prison, and we shouldn't let them roam free. If they roam free, they will kill more people
-Ok so you believe its ok to kill someone?
No, I'm against killing people
-but capital punishment is killing someone
no, I'm not a murderer, you're the murderer. Can we get a mod in here to deal with the bad faith posting?
-i never called you a murderer. in order to support capital punishment you have to kill people. you need to justify killing the person if you're going to support capital punishment
i'm talking about taking out mass murderers. there's net less murder with capital punishment. its reverse murder. also maybe i'm for capital punishment, maybe im not. maybe that makes your posts in bad faith
-are you on drugs?
Quote:
Originally Posted by well named
I was watching a BBC detective show from the early 90s yesterday and in an episode they talked about "positive discrimination." I was somewhat entertained.
I think it makes sense to conceptualize AA programs as an attempt at reparations. An argument might go something like this: imagine that party A has stolen something of value from party B. If the police require restitution from A then that act of restitution does not constitute theft from A, in the same way that someone just seizing property would under other circumstances.
So I think the complaint is that assuming AA to be "discrimination" by definition prejudices the evaluation of that context. Clearly the analogy is imperfect with reparations of any type. That something of value has been stolen is pretty straightforward: racial discrimination involved quite literally the theft of a great deal of wealth from African Americans, for example. So there is certainly a "party B" who has been injured. But there is no single "party A", aside from the federal government, but then it's not the federal government which "pays" restitution in an AA program, it's somewhat randomly selected individuals.
The fact that the analogy (or the policy) is imperfect in that sense doesn't necessarily render it entirely invalid in my view, especially given the limits courts have set on how AA policies can actually operate. But I do think if you take the reparations framing seriously (and I think you should) then it suggests that maybe other more directly reparative policies would be a better way to try to achieve the same goal, which is the reduction of inequality caused by injustice.
As someone in favor of AA, what race categories are there to be implemented? and how do you rank order them? And by how I don't need a detailed story of history, you can just toss out a list and include a sentence or two if you feel inclined to offer an explanation for the position on the list