Scientology as a whole is scam that's for sure. but they do have brilliant people working for or with them, similar to the Nazis, the ideology is whacked. they do have some of the best lawyers, best scientists, economist. they literally own most of the city of Clearwater in FL, at least used to. that's what money can buy, power. they infiltration in Hollywood and the government was huge, so much that some governments have banned them. they are banned in Russia for instance for trying to infiltrate the government. you may have heard of the biggest infilatration of the us gov, yes that was cruises people, operation snowflake,


but yes put all that aside they are right somewhat about the pills. everyone wants a magic pill to fix all their problems. that's not how it works.


fun fact or not, L Ron the founder died being full of pills and heavily addicted to them.

This article is confusing to me regarding its popularity and timing. We've known that the "chemical imbalance" theory of depression has been false for at least a couple decades. The author of this paper, Dr. Joanna Moncrieff, has written about this since before 2010.

And all of this speaks nothing to whether the medications are safe or effective. It's not like blood pressure meds fix some measurable chemical imbalance in most people, but we know they work and that's what matters. Why is it different for depression? What's the evidence that any treatment for depression actually gets to the core issue (how do you measure or prove that)?

Good info.

Just as a point (i know you know) it is always more concerning when you are providing medications to treat symptoms and not the cause.

I am curious as to your view on this.

There are lots of studies that suggest Depression is largely a luxury of the First World, with rates the highest in the most rich countries. I recall seeing someone in the 3rd world medical community stating something along the lines of 'we are too busy figuring out how to eat and survive to be depressed'.

Historically families and others would often take the tact of 'keep the person busy' when a family member or friend suffered some struggles as way to get them to focus ANYWHERE BUT on the topic that could lead them to depression. Exercise, diet, travel, etc where all ways pushed to give the person another focus. There was some recognition that focusing on some event or issue you could not change at the time could lead to depression whereas with some time and distance it might be easier to deal with.

First world psychology seems to take the opposite tact. Analyse, assess and deconstruct the issues. Would you agree?

While i agree that there are some very tough cases that absolutely require medical/psychiatric intervention, i also think taking that approach to all cases just funnels mass numbers of people into a cycle of depression who could of, potentially instead been steered away from it.

Well, it’s going to be fun watching QP fall down the Scientology anti-psychiatry hole.

I've been down many of those holes about 20 years ago when I did some research into their views.

Nothing I find illuminating or worthy of comment in there.

How about you? What should we expect when you now fall down some of those holes?

Expect to see me not siding with L Ron Hubbard and other scam artists.

Good to see you move closer to my position then.

That is progress from you.

You want scientology? Knock yourself out. Here is a tell all video from Beghe. I remember flying to LA and seeing huge billboards of scientology near the airport, which was kind of scary, since I knew what they do, kinda.

Jason Beghe, he is the one that got me looking into this with this interview. Scientologist are all over LA, the most famous from the top of my head: Tom cruise, the Nancy Cartwright, Travolta, Smith made some donations to at some point to some related company but is not in, this cult was all over the place with front companies, not many people knew what they were. here are more : They were/are pretty powerful in Hollywood, that changed a bit with the internet. With the scientology celebrity center luring them in, thats how they got cruise and all. But dont be fooled, they will screw you over, take all of your money and soul.

Oh yeah, and narcanon, is a company belonging to scientology, is actually a way to suck you into scientology. They do rehabs and anti addiction programs. Watch out, it is not what it seems to be, its a scam. And there are a few more of those companies. Highly dangerous.


I am looking for videos right now of Narconon and cant believe I am seeing Woopie Goldberg actually recommending them here. She must not know what they are. She is not a scientologist Im pretty sure. I like Woopie, dont get me wrong but she is out of line here. They murdered a few people already, destroyed families, and if you want to get out they destroy your life. Not that its not already destroyed once you are in it. Just trust me or do your research. The wife of the CEO dissapeared, other excecutives spoke out, Lea Remini spoke out too and many more. The son of L Ron Hubbard exposed his father too, David Miscavige father wrote a book. Its a very weird and dangerous cult.

Honestly I feel kinda bad for this post, there might be some desperate person trying to see if narconon can help them. There are better ways where you dont end up in a sect, alright? DO NOT GO THERE.

here

re that UCL study on depression (and some meta-analytical articles that followed it), I'm not qualified to draw any conclusions, but I'm friends with quite a few academics (my old career), and many of them work either in the field of theoretical psychology or in methodology of special sciences - and they all seem to think that this is very meaningful and will change the way we understand depression, it's just not clear how for now

the most discussed thing seems to not be that single study, but rather a meta-analytical implications that come from it, an example of such article can be found here in open access:

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41380-022-01661-0

a bit too technical for me, but maybe someone will find it useful

I haven't quite thought of it this way, but it seems true at least for many mental health professionals and many patients.

I work primarily with kids and do try to find ways to get their parents to get them doing more -- going outside, exercising (either in some structured activity or freely), and engaging with peers. We know that these things improve depression, anxiety, and even ADHD symptoms.

However, getting parents to take control enough to take away the iPad and get the kid out the door is hard and often requires a level of therapeutic support that just isn't accessible to many. So not infrequently, I'm left with the choice between wanting the ideal but achieving nothing vs providing a medication that might reduce symptom intensity with the hope that it can make it easier to push towards real behavior change. In this way, I do view psychiatric medications generally as agents for symptomatic relief instead of as correctors of some underlying brain pathology.

thanks again for the thoughtful reply.


I don't want to sound like a broken record on this but again I believe 'the Left' generally focuses so much on compassion and empathy and wanting to be supportive, as the highest virtues to aspire to, that they often do not see, or are more willing to accept, more cases we would define as 'failures' , rather then providing anything resembling 'tough medicine', that could lead to more successes but make the 'fewer' failures feel badly.

Time and again I feel I can point to this approach, as well meaning as it is, seeming to result in a worsening of the problem (from suicide to obesity, etc, etc) . And the left counters with endless compassion and sympathy for the growing cohort of 'failures', but has no way to actually improve the outcomes.

Compassion while always nice, is not always the best tool in the box. You can ruin a school with the Self Esteem movement, even if you manage to help a few kids on the margin who are failing out.

It is my view (only) that there was this shift in people (and psychiatrist generally) towards compassion as first principle and that is often at the expense of results which sometimes require something different, often more stern.

How the Taliban is taking care of junkees is better than what the previous regime was doing. it is even better what we do in the West imo. we actually do not nearly enough. the previous regime did not stop to grow opium, the Taliban did stop to grow it. (so they say I can't confirm it)
If true that's amazing.

Anyways, Babrak the social worker is the hero of this documentary.

One guy says here one third of Afghanistan is on heavy drugs. Another number is 4M due to our occupation.

enjoy

Just tell us what they do so we dont have to watch a 40 min video

They stick addicts into rehabs on autopilot. The US and the west leaves addicts on the streets dying and robbing people. In the US you have to pay 30k for a rehab, they do it for free. They actually do something. Which is lol, they are the taliban.

I've seen firsthand how addictive behaviors can lead to devastating outcomes, and it's heartbreaking to hear about these tragic stories. If anyone is struggling with addiction, seeking help and support is crucial for overcoming it.

Personally, I've found solace in smoking vapes like VIHO Supercharge, but I understand that everyone's journey to recovery is unique.