Funny story, I went to a majority black HS at the time when they'd play Roots on TV for a week.

I was sitting in class one day (probably trying to sleep) and an AA girl started berating me, telling me they were gonna get me. I was like......'okay' (my family basically game over form Europe in the 1900's and never had the money to own slaves even if that was an option lol).
Another girl looked at me and said, "don't listen that's just her opinion'.

And so it is in life. Everyone gets an opinion.

I'd like to say I was scarred but I swear I haven't thought about it in 40 years.

One of the criticisms of CRT is, it's built upon narratives that can't be challenged, and it oftentimes contradicts itself because it's based on "my truths".

CRT was created by Marxist (or Marxist sympathizers, if you want to call them that), and influenced by Marxism, or at least critical theory. So, we know what the orginalist were seeking, even if they don't explicitly state it.

I get your previous point about CRT being a different but maybe similar entity. A lot of these theorist are true believers and not aware of how close it is to Marxism, in fact they attempt, in most cases, to distance themselves.

Ask anyone of them what they think of Marx, though. As in, what was he wrong about? Further, what has this type of critical theory led before, and why should we not expect it to go there again?

A more provocative question to ask is, how did Germany get the German public to turn against the Jews?

I don't personally understand how you can have this massive never ending criticism of a racial group, and not expect at some point to deal with that group, especially the negative characterizations they make of that group.


It's the elephant in the room...what to do about "whiteness"? the first thing they're doing is teaching how evil it is.

In case you haven't figured it out, whiteness is a placeholder for capitalism.

this is perfect and should basically end this dumpster fire of a thread.

it's similar to the idiots that dont understand what "white privilege" means and attempt to insist on it meaning that if there is a single poor white person in existence then it "debunks" white privilege.

Lol Slighted. Good try. Good effort. Your white guilt isn't needed here though.

generally i call it common sense and rational thought, but i understand that sometimes both of those things are difficult for you

At least we’ve found a subject where conservatives don’t want to just teach the controversy.

But I’m guessing you aren’t stating this properly. The concept of white and black in America probably was a classification inherently based on privilege and oppression. In 1850 it didn’t matter if your family has been in America for 200 years and fought in the Revolutionary war if you happened to be black you couldn’t do a lot of stuff a guy who couldn’t speak English who just got off a boat from Germany could. So the classifications are remnants of a society that valued European descent to a highly irrational level. Again, I don’t know what crt exactly is, but I can’t imagine Americans conservatives, perhaps the most scientifically illiterate large group of people on the planet with access to the internet somehow get it right.

Ok...let's talk. What's wrong with this thread?

Man...you've gotta catch up to the thread before making a post like this.
Like what are you even talking about here?
You think I'm a conservative? I voted for Gore.

"I don't know what CRT is but since you're a conservative and dumb as rocks you can't be right" lol.
You should eat a one day temp ban for posting like this.

You have bog-standard conservative policy views on most every issue.

How you express it matters... A LOT.. but that is basically what AA in the work place type actions are trying to do.


Follow this thru if you will.

- you have from founding of the USA a near closed management market to anyone but White Males, mostly of central European descent

- cracks form in that prohibition but really even as things lessen the glass ceiling for POC and Women is still a very real thing well into the late 1980's and early 90's

- that means almost all people in junior thru senior management are white males of mostly central European descent and they are still mostly in those roles or likely higher. Everyone that generation hired is certainly in place now and hiring.


Now while I will not say having a near homogeneous white central European males cohort in all the positions of powers means they will be overtly racist, it is near impossible however to think bias won't creep in. That when all these guys are hiring and promoting they won't value soft traits like how they 'connect' with the person, the perceived 'cultural' fit, etc when facing otherwise qualified competing candidates.


So Umbuku who may have equal accounting credentials to Giuseppe, loses out to Giuseppe, because the Italian Senior manager does not really assess why he just 'feels' Giuseppe will be the better 'fit' when both candidates are otherwise equally qualified.

Affirmative Action in the work place makes the Manager assess his hiring by forcing him to look for diversity and correct it, if its not there. It is not perfect in every situation but overall, across the board it works.

And what it is doing in a subtle way is getting them not to be oppressors due to the color, even unwittingly but in a much gentler way. But still a way many whites really cry about.

I mean if your feelings get hurt so easily whats the point of posting here? Your view on CRT seems to echo the Tucker Carlson/Fox News sentiment on race in the 21st century. I think even many conservatives admit they are pretty dumb views and just meant to rile up rube cultural warriors. The fact that you direct me to read this thread, rather than as good discussion where people might actually know what they are talking about is again another strike. Nobody should try to learn anything from 2+2.

entertaining discussions like these, including but not limited to, is CRT really a secret Marxist plot to overthrow white people, is Affirmative action racist?, is white privilege real?, is systematic/institutional racism real?, are in and of themselves victories for white supremacists. and advance white supremacist talking points.

if as original position stated then we don't need a thread. this is obviously a reality and has been in this country for a long time and attempting to combat it is being on the right side of history..


if you want to define CRT by the wikipedia definitions of:
First, that white supremacy exists and maintains power through the law.
Second, that transforming the relationship between law and racial power, as well as achieving racial emancipation and anti-subordination more broadly, are possible.

then both those things are also true/possible... AND we dont need a thread.

if you or ihiv or anyone else would like to define it as something else, then feel free and we can revisit.

What I mean is you need to read the thread before attacking people. It's clear you haven't. Your post was a bunch of pure nonsense as is what you're saying now. How are my views on race "Fox News like" exactly? Can you explain what my views on race are?

So to be clear: your opposition to this thread is because you think it is not something that is worthy of discussion?
And re definition: I already set out for a definition earlier...one sec and I'll add it..

i think it's dressed up white supremacy.

i would also argue that "cancel culture" is another imagined boogeyman invented by conservatives to attempt to legitimize racism, so probably not the best definition to use.

What do you think "or more pejoratively" means?

Tucker Carlson has segments like "Is your kid's School teaching them that being white is wrong?" You posted basically the same thing, down to doing so in question format you really can't be wrong. It's a standard low quality news/analysis tactic. You might not be aware of it which is fine. But it's unreasonable for you to expect the rest of us to pretend like we don't get it.

Having the thread is white supremacy or discussing CRT?
Do you think any sort of good could come from discussing it, maybe some sort of shared understanding?
Or do you think I'm a white supremacists and that I'm irreedeemable?

Well are they? And should it matter if they are?
Like yeah....this is what we're talking about. It's a ****ed up ideology ultimately. A religion as McWhorter calls it. He's probably a racist too though.

It’s the constant bad faith, for one thing.

You are free to report me to the moderators.

So basically your opposition here is to rhetorical style and you have nothing of substance to offer?

Fair point; I made a lot of assumptions there. My apologies.

Not at all. As I said:

Some of the ideas found in CRT interest me. Debating over whether some specific people's interpretation and/or implementation of it is extreme I find much less interesting; almost any philosophy or ideology will have a range of believers, some of whom may be quite extreme.

I'm quite interested in hearing what you think about these questions I asked in that post:

Ugh, dude.

Well, depending on one's definition, it can be.

I think this part of a book cover quote you posted is illuminating here:

Reads like the kind of thing Tucker Carlson could make an entire show out of. And taken on its own, I'm sure it would stir all sorts of outrage. But add in the next several lines (or some of the preceding ones)...

This doesn't seem like such an outrageous idea to me.

Now this is another matter altogether.

Is it your concern mainly that some professors are teaching a strict interpretation of CRT like this and turning a new generation of students into a bunch of anti-capitalists, or do you have worries that this is going to be insidiously introduced to the greater public?

In very general terms, yes, I think it's important that kids are taught at a relatively young age what racism is, what privilege is, and what they can all do to put a stop to it. When we come down to things like "rank themselves" and telling elementary school kids they are racists or victims, I can't imagine that even being a thing, at least not without a shitton of context. BUT I could easily see that being a talking point of what some people would portray is being taught, even if it wasn't - very similarly to what I brought up earlier about LGBTQ issues in elementary school.

this is a bit of a derail but,

entertaining these types of threads as if they are in good faith is a favor to white supremacy. having a comparison of CRT to the Nazi's and the holocaust in this thread is a favor to white supremacy.

anytime a "is affirmative action the REAL racism?" thread is legitimized into an actual discussion is a favor to white supremacy.

anytime someone comes on here to stormfront-lite and posts some tucker carlson youtubez about immigrants "dirtying" the country, or about "protecting our culture" and isn't dunked on/made fun off right back out the door is a favor to white supremacy.

dont worry im not trying to censor or "CaNcEl" anyone. imo racism and thinly veiled racism like saying that systematic racism/institutionalized racism doesn't exist isn't a valid opinion, much like someone else said its the flat earther's of modern society. they are to be mocked not entertained.

Ugh, no. This whole nonsense of "sexual perverts" using this as some way to promote their "perversion" is just a way of bigots making an argument that appeals to other bigots.

Of course, this hinges on how one defines a vague term like "perversion". There are people who believe that the LGBTQ community are "perverts", and to them, yes, anything that promotes acceptance of the LGBTQ community is by definition "promot[ing] sexual perversion". As I said, an argument by bigots that will appeal to other bigots.