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Challenges surrounding obesity Challenges surrounding obesity

12-14-2021 , 10:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ganstaman
What is the cause of obesity in the US?
QP: liberals

But obesity rates are higher in southern states which tend to be less liberal.
QP: but that's mostly driven by black people who are more liberal

But if we just look at white people, the southern states still have higher obesity rates.
QP: still the liberals' fault
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
That summary does not represent what i said
What? Maybe you just don't remember how the thread has been going;

Quote:
Originally Posted by Metod Tinuviel
What do you see as the primary reasons obesity has increased?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
There is a toxicities within far left liberalism which best exemplified by the failed self esteem movement
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metod Tinuviel
But at least in the US, it is the conservative states that have high rates of obesity. The liberal states tend to be the fittest states.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
A significant percent of the obesity in the South is dominated by the African American (largely left) within the southern States.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ganstaman
Fine, then just look at the white people:...

The Southern states still generally have the higher obesity rates. Is this still somehow the fault of liberals?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
Yes
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12-15-2021 , 12:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
Turkey Butts

Big business found they could deep fry this grossly fat and oily throw away part of the Turkey that no one would eat in America and flood it into meat protein starved areas such as Somoa.

The Somoan gov't eventually decided to ban this product for the citizens own good. Big Corporations leaned on their American gov't officials and told them we are your masters. The US gov't officials then pressured the UN to threaten to deny Somoa with UN entry and other benefits if they would not serve as a dumping ground for our Turkey butts.

The somoans caved and this food is one of the worst contributors to their obesity.
It is crap like this that I think is one of the biggest issues. When I went to Panama there were giant Coca-cola signs everywhere. The food at the airport was all fast food. It was like the country was run by corporate fast food and sugary drink companies. It is pretty hard to eat healthy in that environment. Will power can't combat cheap, tasty, addictive crap food that is relentlessly advertised. At least not at a societal scale.
Challenges surrounding obesity Quote
12-15-2021 , 12:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
A significant percent of the obesity in the South is dominated by the African American (largely left) within the southern States. They are dealing with the worst of all scenarios where they (their family lines) were snatched from areas of africa were food insecurity (famines) were common and thus those who survived are the bodies best at dealing with feast (grabbing, storing and very efficiently NOT burning the calories once consumed) which the selective pressure of areas that go thru times of Feast and Famine select for and now they live in Food Deserts, and are poor and cheap calorie dense fast food is the easiest, most accessible and often cheapest food available.

It sates their bodies natural desire to horde calories (fat) in the event of the coming famine, which never comes in the US.

I have many Japanese friends. They simply do not understand the Western failing re obesity. They say it simply is not an issue because your family, friends and society would not allow it. They bring pressure very early before it becomes problematic. Expectations and pressure they will tell you are key. And while that is too simplistic (food deserts and genetics also matter), it is certainly a significant factor, if not the most significant singular one, imo.

And how many in the US (especially the far left) counter that is by saying 'yes but they have high suicide rates'. Yes they do. So to does the US. Worse in every category.

And because we know some of those suicides come from those depressed with losing the battle with obesity and feeling they fail societal expectations the wrong response to that is to remove societal expectations as we have seen. Schools, doctors and parents increasingly unwilling to meaningfully engage and especially pressure kids to do better. Thus the dangerous ballooning of Childhood obesity dooming their later adult selves to much tougher battles to deal with it later. Because the society, the doctors and parents increasingly pull back from that engagement and pressure the adult that forms is put in a much worse position later to deal with it.

So now you have adults who really struggle with it and most cannot succeed, thus the ever upward obesity rate. There is then an acceptance that most will fail so we should try and remove the stigma's and pressure (since they are not working) and instead focus on building those peoples self esteem even if obese. Thus the obesity acceptance movement. Pictures, messaging, re-enforcement that obesity is both healthy and beautiful. So why the F would any young kid feel they need to do the hard work and suffer the denials with all that messaging and seeing they are in the majority of the populace. It is all a self supporting and self fulfilling slide into this mess, all the while well intentioned people drive willingly down 'the road to hell, paving it with their good intentions' by thinking just keep removing the pressure and stigma so people don't feel bad.

Think about this question. Do you help alleviate suicides and people feeling bad, getting depressed and committing suicide by removing the pressure and living in the US with a near 50% obesity rate or do you so by keeping the pressure on and having that obesity rate at less than 5%??? What if in your goal to genuinely help those in the 5% who succumbed to those pressures you are foundational to the growth 50% and thus the suicides that still happen within that group???

There are many who attack any such discussion as the above as one we should not have.
I may be way off base since I am not a parent, but I feel that childhood obesity is a parental and societal failure. If a kid eats a piece of food it is because some adult provided it for him or her. We don't even need to teach kids they need to do hard work, just don't give them bad food. Growing up all the fat kids were fat because their parents gave them crap food. I never worked hard, I was just never given crap food.

Putting a kid around a bunch of candy and telling him it is fine if he becomes obese and that he is healthy at enemy weight is destructive. Putting a kid around candy and telling him he needs to use his willpower to make good choices and not eat it seems bad too. Just don't put him around candy and then you don't need to even talk about obesity.

On a societal level, subsidize healthy food, tax unhealthy food, make areas more walkable, reduce working hours so people have more free time to cook and exercise. Do that and the obesity rate falls no matter the attitudes. But yes fix the attitudes too. Don't bully obese people but do push back when people try to claim obesity is healthy.
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12-15-2021 , 09:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metod Tinuviel
I may be way off base since I am not a parent, but I feel that childhood obesity is a parental and societal failure. If a kid eats a piece of food it is because some adult provided it for him or her. We don't even need to teach kids they need to do hard work, just don't give them bad food. Growing up all the fat kids were fat because their parents gave them crap food. I never worked hard, I was just never given crap food.

Putting a kid around a bunch of candy and telling him it is fine if he becomes obese and that he is healthy at enemy weight is destructive. Putting a kid around candy and telling him he needs to use his willpower to make good choices and not eat it seems bad too. Just don't put him around candy and then you don't need to even talk about obesity.

On a societal level, subsidize healthy food, tax unhealthy food, make areas more walkable, reduce working hours so people have more free time to cook and exercise. Do that and the obesity rate falls no matter the attitudes. But yes fix the attitudes too. Don't bully obese people but do push back when people try to claim obesity is healthy.
You are not off base.

But again nothing exemplifies the fact that society is INCREASINGLY devaluing discipline and self control in children that follows thru as a major problem in to their adulthood than what I posted prior on the rise in Pet obesity.

At least with a kid you can make the argument they have so many other influences outside the home and as such it is harder for the parents, if you want to defend the parents failure but then how do we explain soaring Pet Obesity?

There is no logical reason for this trend. Not even a little bit. You cannot blame the cheap empty calorie food available everywhere. You cannot blame peer influence. You cannot even blame pet begging as that is only learned via developed habit.

Society is changing decade over decade as it tips towards decadence and a lack of discipline and responsibility and treating those concepts as 'mean' and thinking the pressure due to them is bad as some fail and get depressed and it can lead to suicide. So as society moves away from those things we see these results. And the response from those same people is to try and make sure we do not talk about or engage with these results as wrong or very predictable outcomes. Shush they say. You are a bad person (fat shame, etc) if you want to address it.

They accept a certain inevitability with these failings and thus instead seek to make it easier for people to live with these failings. which in turn makes it easier for ever more people to fail. And so on and so on. And as society as a whole hits a certain tipping point, society then accepts we are not going to turn back this clock and thus we m,ust give in and instead just manage this problem rather than pushing for discipline up front to prevent it.

It is such a massive failing by society. I think we really could have no bigger failing as a species. If we have an inability to protect those who rely on us with very simple common sense and easy to implement solutions (our pets) ...who can we protect?





Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
Nothing speaks to the above lack of discipline we now just accept in Society as a whole and as normal and not to be addressed, than this stat...

Quote:
Pet Obesity Is on the Rise-And Not Just Because of the Pandemic-According to New Study

...From 2011 to 2020, Banfield saw a 108-percent increase in dogs diagnosed as overweight or obese. Last year, 34 percent of all examined dogs weighed too much (up from 16 percent in 2011). For cats, 2020 saw 114 percent more overweight or obese cats than in 2011-a jump from 18 percent of all cats to 38 percent

Why Are Our Pets Overweight?
So what caused so many extra pounds? Well, there are so many factors that it's hard to tell definitively, Banfield said, but the hospital did survey 1,000 U.S. pet owners to see what potentially got in the way of keeping their pets at healthy weights. Here were the results:

66 percent of respondents said they eventually give in when their pet begs for treats. (We can relate.)
30 percent said they don't know the best ************ strategies.
29 percent said they have a hard time exercising because of their own health, which makes it harder to exercise their pets.
26 percent said they don't have enough time to exercise their pets.
23 percent said they don't pay enough attention to their pets' diets.
I mean WTF?

An obese pet is not as happy as a fit one so WTF would anyone not seeing their pet become obese just keep scaling back the caloric intake day over day, month over month until the calories in matched whatever calories are being burned???

Every excuse we give humans not to do is gone when it comes to pets and yet the SAME trend happens.


Is this not the 'Road to Hell' writ as large and as in neon lights as one could ever see???


Is anyone in denial about which outcome makes the dog more happy and if not wtf not fix it?

Answer: these pet owners are not evil. Many love their pets deeply. But too many people lack discipline and that results in others (in this case the pet) being forced to pay the cost of their lack of discipline when no one would have to pay it, if only they found the discipline.
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12-15-2021 , 10:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ganstaman
The Southern states still generally have the higher obesity rates. Is this still somehow the fault of liberals?
And obesity is hardly restricted to the South. West Virginia isn’t in the south, is one of the whitest states in the country and one of the fattest. There are many factors at play (western states seem to be fitter regardless of politics and race) but we can definitely say rising obesity rates are mostly because of liberals or blacks people.
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12-16-2021 , 02:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuepee
how do we explain soaring Pet Obesity?
Pets are liberals?
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12-16-2021 , 01:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LektorAJ
Pets are liberals?
Given that pets are freeloaders who rely entirely on others to feed and shelter them while providing no value of their own, this is almost certainly true.

But also, people are lazy and it's a lot easier to just leave a giant bowl of food out for animals to graze on than to stick to a feeding schedule.

Laziness is the root of all sorts of society's problems.
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12-16-2021 , 01:27 PM
Unsurprisingly the most welfare dependent fattest states are the reddest.
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12-16-2021 , 01:40 PM
Well, cornbread and barbeque are quite tasty, but definitely not good for you.

Don't be jealous. Get in there! They'll share.
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12-16-2021 , 01:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LektorAJ
Pets are liberals?
I am not too interested in arguing against a strawman. I take them as validation honestly.

My point is not Liberals are the only fat ones. It is that this liberal train of thought, the extension of the Self Esteem Movement, is one of the leading corrosive factors in the growing obesity epidemic.


And that thought, played out by corporations, media, doctors and teachers being less willing to discuss obesity and feeling pressured to obesity norm, so that people feel less badly, is not just having an impact on liberals but all of society.


So the 'hurrr durrr strawman arguments of 'but what about fat southern whites who vote R' are just that. Proof that certain people realize they cannot elaborate a winning argument and as such stuff and fight the strawman they think they can make a point against.

Believe me when I say if the same people thought they could actually take on my arguments, they would.


Pets getting fat is an erosion of the belief that one person, any person, should be pressuring or imposing their principles, view or any push for discipline on any other. That instead has been replaced with 'be supportive of them HOW THEY ARE and try and make them feel good and accepting of them HOW THEY ARE.'


That is the only reasoning one would give for burgeoning pet obesity. A slip in the disciplines of societal responsibility (that we have a role in influencing others) towards a position of 'accept them as they are and just love them (obesity norming).

We simply would not have this spike in pet obesity in generations past. Your neighbours would look at you as abusive and the least disciplined person on the planet as it is the EASIEST thing to correct and not only has better health outcomes for the pet but makes them happier. One has to accept the worst aspects of the Self Esteem Movement (don't judge, just accept) to get where we are, today in that regard.
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12-16-2021 , 01:44 PM
I grew up in the south. I’m familiar with rural fat welfare culture.
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12-16-2021 , 01:54 PM
Quote:

It is that this liberal train of thought, the extension of the Self Esteem Movement, is one of the leading corrosive factors in the growing obesity epidemic.
That very clearly isn’t true, as the places less receptive to liberal ideas are the fattest. Like, this is a stupid position on its face.
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12-16-2021 , 02:46 PM
Very aptly timed post in the 'In other News' thread that speaks exactly to this topic and how the more radical influence of these worst parts of leftist, woke culture are not limited in impact only to others inside leftist woke culture as this strawman is presented, stuffed and beaten up.

The article skillfully makes the argument how liberal wokeism is spreading a toxicity and while they do not correlate the elements of the Self Esteem movement directly, it equally fits under the umbrella and arguably it is those principles (putting a genuine desire to help people 'feel better' ('the road to hell...) and i would argue is the singular common thread underlying all these toxic avenues.

Meaning all these issues and challenges to properly assess and address very real issues of concern from transwomen in sport, to growing obesity to all the ones discussed in the article below all stem from some on the far left still clinging to the elements of the failed Self Esteem Movement they tried to push in to schools and were mostly pushed back on, and now seeking other avenues to push those well meaning but toxic ideals out, in to society.


(since this article was behind a paywall I could circumvent with two tactics piled on on the other (incognito browser utilizing Outline.com within that) and I know that will not work for everyone asit does not always work for me, I will copy, paste the entirety of the article in the spoilers below)


The illiberal left How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?
And how deep will its influence be?



...The espousal of new vocabulary is one sign of a social mobilisation that is affecting ever more areas of American life. It has penetrated politics and the press. Sometimes it spills out into the streets,... It is starting to spread to schools....

What links these developments is a loose constellation of ideas that is changing the way that mostly white, educated, left-leaning Americans view the world. This credo still lacks a definitive name: it is variously known as left-liberal identity politics, social-justice activism or, simply, wokeness. ...

Spoiler:


The illiberal left How did American “wokeness” jump from elite schools to everyday life?
SEPTEMBER 04, 2021


YOU COULD use a single word as a proxy. “Latinx” is a gender-neutral adjective which only 4% of American Hispanics say they prefer. Yet in 2018 the New York Times launched a column dedicated to “LatinX communities”. It has crept into White House press releases and a presidential speech. Google’s diversity reports use the even more inclusive “LatinX+”. A term once championed by esoteric academics has gone mainstream.

The espousal of new vocabulary is one sign of a social mobilisation that is affecting ever more areas of American life. It has penetrated politics and the press. Sometimes it spills out into the streets, in demonstrations calling for the abolition of police departments. It is starting to spread to schools. San Francisco’s education board, which for more than a year was unable to get children into classes, busied itself with stripping the names of Abraham Lincoln and George Washington from its schools, and ridding department names of acronyms such as VAPA (Visual and Performing Arts), on the ground that they are “a symptom of white supremacy”.

What links these developments is a loose constellation of ideas that is changing the way that mostly white, educated, left-leaning Americans view the world. This credo still lacks a definitive name: it is variously known as left-liberal identity politics, social-justice activism or, simply, wokeness. But it has a clear common thread: a belief that any disparities between racial groups are evidence of structural racism; that the norms of free speech, individualism and universalism which pretend to be progressive are really camouflage for this discrimination; and that injustice will persist until systems of language and privilege are dismantled.

These notions were incubated for years in the humanities departments of universities (elite ones in particular), without serious challenge. Moral panics about campus culture are hardly new, and the emergence of a new leftism in the early 2010s prompted little concern. Even as students began scouring the words of academics, administrators and fellow students for microaggressions, the oppressive slights embedded in everyday speech, and found them, complacency ruled. When invited speeches from people such as Christine Lagarde, then head of the International Monetary Fund, were cancelled after student activists accused her of complicity in “imperialist and patriarchal systems”, the response was a collective shrug.

The complacency was naive. America harboured a “Vegas campus delusion”, says Greg Lukianoff, president of the Foundation for Individual Rights in Education, an advocacy group. “What happens on campus will not stay on campus.” It has not. The influence of the new social-justice mindset is now being felt in the media, the Democratic Party and, most recently, businesses and schools.

How did this breakout happen? Three things helped prepare the ground: a disaffected student body, an academic theory that was malleable enough to be shaped into a handbook for political activism, and a pliant university administration.

First came a new generation of students keenly aware of unsolved social problems and willing to see old-fashioned precepts of academic freedom (such as open debate) as obstacles to progress. Various events—the financial crisis, the election of Donald Trump, the police killings of unarmed black men, especially that of George Floyd—fed frustration with traditional liberalism’s seeming inability to end long-run inequities. This hastened the adoption of an ideology that offered fresh answers.




In a book entitled “The Coddling of the American Mind”, Mr Lukianoff and a social psychologist, Jonathan Haidt, posit that overprotective parenting in the shadow of the war on terrorism and the great recession led to “safetyism”, a belief that safety, including emotional safety, trumps all other practical and moral concerns. Its bounds grew to require disinviting disfavoured campus speakers (see chart 1), protesting about disagreeable readings and regulating the speech of fellow students.

Many students latched onto a body of theory which yokes obscurantist texts to calls for social action (or “praxis”) that had been developing in the academy for decades. In 1965 Herbert Marcuse, a critical theorist, coined the phrase “repressive tolerance”, the notion that freedom of speech should be withdrawn from the political right in order to bring about progress, since the “cancellation of the liberal creed of free and equal discussion” might be necessary to end oppression. Another influence was Paulo Freire, a Brazilian educator whose “Pedagogy of the Oppressed” (published in English in 1970) advocated a liberatory pedagogy in the spirit of Mao’s Cultural Revolution in which “the oppressed unveil the world of oppression and through the praxis commit themselves to its transformation”.

The Great Awokening

Today the most prominent evangelists for what political scientists such as Zachary Goldberg call the Great Awokening are Ibram X. Kendi and Robin DiAngelo. Both these scholar-activists have written bestselling books that sketch the expansive boundaries of systemic racism. Both minimise the role of intent, but in different ways. In Mr Kendi’s Manichaean worldview actions are either actively narrowing racial gaps, and are therefore anti-racist, or they are not, in which case they are racist. “Capitalism is essentially racist; racism is essentially capitalist,” he concludes.

Ms DiAngelo is concerned with the racism of everyday speech. For her, the intent of the oppressor is immaterial if an oppressed person deems the conduct to be offensive. How “white progressives cause more daily harm [to black people] than, say, white nationalists” is the subject of her latest book, “Nice Racism”. She sees liberal norms like individualism or the aspiration for colour-blind universalism as naive: “Liberalism doesn’t account for power, and the differential in power,” she says.

The embrace of this ideology by students and professors might have remained inconsequential had it not been for the part played by administrative staff. Since 2000, such staff in the University of California system has more than doubled, outpacing the increase in faculty and students. The growth in private universities has been even faster. Between 1975 and 2005 the ranks of administrators grew by 66% in public colleges but by 135% in private ones. As their headcount grew, so did their remit—ferreting out not just overt racism or sexual harassment but implicit bias too. The University of California, Los Angeles, now insists that faculty applying for tenure include a diversity statement.

In 2018 Samuel Abrams, a political scientist at Sarah Lawrence College, published data showing that these administrators are even more left-leaning than the professors: liberals outnumber conservatives by 12 to one. For writing about this, Mr Abrams faced a campaign by outraged students aiming to revoke his tenure. Campaigns by a vocal minority of activists have cast a pall on campus life, he says. “Large numbers of people hate this. They just don’t know what to do,” he laments. “They don’t want the mob coming to them.”

An upheaval in mass communication accelerated the trend. On Twitter, a determined minority can be amplified, and an uneasy centre-left can be cowed. “Weaponisation of social media became part of the game. But what I think nobody foresaw was that these tactics could so easily be imported to the New York Times or Penguin Random House or Google,” says Niall Ferguson, a historian at Stanford’s Hoover Institution. “The invasion…was just a case of the old problem: that liberals defer to progressives. And progressives defer to outright totalitarians.”

Mr Trump’s election added to centrists’ unease, leaving the poles to grow ever more extreme. “Anything but far-left progressivism was lumped in with Trump,” says one (Democratic) prosecutor in San Francisco. In the protest against Mr Trump’s handling of the Mexican border, for instance, the old Democratic line of enhanced border security and a path to citizenship for the long-term undocumented became passé. Progressives proved their sincerity by being in favour of abolishing immigration authorities entirely.

Having grown strong roots, social-justice consciousness has spread most readily to non-academic institutions largely peopled by those who have come through elite universities. As the students who have embraced this messy body of theory leave university, they enter into jobs and positions of influence. The question is whether, outside the ivory tower, the ideology will retain its intolerant and belligerent zeal, or whether it will mellow into a benign urge for society to be a little fairer.

Newspapers are a prime example. The digital revolution has devastated local newspapers and crowned new online-only champions. As newsrooms adapted by aping the upstarts, hacks who had risen through the ranks thanks to shoe-leather reporting were replaced by younger staffers stuffed with new ideas from elite universities. One prominent journalist argued for replacing “neutral objectivity” with “moral clarity”—making unflinching distinctions between right and wrong.

The urge to purge

Changes in newsrooms were also related to efforts to increase demographic diversity, on the assumption that this is the only authentic way to give voice to minorities. But the campus zeal for deplatforming voices deemed offensive and defenestrating those found guilty of violating the ethos has also been imported. (James Bennet, who resigned as editorial-page editor of the New York Times after one such row, now works for The Economist; he was not involved in this article.) Non-journalists on the staff of newspapers, including young engineers, can be even more activist in campaigning against colleagues judged to be producing content at odds with the new vision of social justice.

As with universities, this stridency met little rebuke from the heads of newsrooms. Lee Fang, a left-leaning journalist for “The Intercept”, an online publication specialising in “adversarial journalism”, was accused by a colleague of racism for posting an interview with an African-American supporter of Black Lives Matter who offered a personal criticism of the group. He was made to apologise.



The quiet cultural revolution has also affected the Democratic Party. A decade ago, around 40% of white liberals agreed that “racial discrimination is the main reason why many black people can’t get ahead these days”; today over 70% do (see chart 2). In 2013, according to Gallup, a pollster, 70% of Americans thought black-white race relations were going well; that has dropped to 42%. Among white conservatives and moderates, there has been little movement on such questions.



In the past decade a far greater share of white liberals than African-Americans came to believe that blacks should have “special favours” to get ahead (see chart 3). Ideas for promoting racial equity that once belonged to the Democrats’ left fringe have become mainstream. Cash reparations for African-Americans are supported by 49% of Democrats, for example, and 41% endorse reducing police funding.

Democratic politicians have responded. In 2008 Barack Obama criticised overheated sermons of his pastor, saying “they expressed a profoundly distorted view of this country—a view that sees white racism as endemic, and that elevates what is wrong with America above all that we know is right with America.” The pastor’s view is now ascendant among Democrats.

In 2016 Hillary Clinton started giving speeches on the need to end systemic racism. By 2020 this movement was the defining fault line of the presidential primary. Joe Biden, an avatar for Democratic consensus, won by taking positions far to the left of Mr Obama, including on matters of identity politics. That is why his administration speaks much more social-justice patois than Mr Obama’s ever did. And why it embraces reparations-adjacent policies like the creation of a $4bn fund to pay off the debts of only non-white farmers, and a proposal that 40% of benefits from climate-change investment go to previously disadvantaged communities.

Wokers of the world, unite!

This new political prominence makes the question of what happens to the ideology of social activism as it spreads beyond the ivory tower all the more important. Does it retain its purity and potency? Or does it become diluted?

The corporate world will be a big test. Businesses, particularly those in the knowledge economy, have been grappling with the challenge of how to respond to social-justice consciousness as young employees agitate for change and woke consumers threaten boycotts.

An increasingly common argument is that there is no trade-off between greater diversity and profits. “I’d like to get to a place where we thought that diverse representation was just as important as profitability, because we believed it was linked to so many things that were going to come back and drive value,” says Julie Coffman, the chief diversity officer of Bain & Company, a management consultancy. Others make an explicit business case. McKinsey, another consultancy, has released a stream of reports arguing that firms with greater ethnic and gender diversity have a greater chance of financial outperformance.

Since Floyd’s murder, American businesses have issued a dizzying number of equity-related missives and quotas for hiring and procurement. Facebook, a social-media giant, has promised to hire 30% more black people in leadership positions and has set a goal that “50% of our workforce be from underrepresented communities by the end of 2023”. Target, a retailer, has pledged to spend more than $2bn with black-owned businesses by the end of 2025. Walmart, another retail titan, has set up a Centre for Racial Equity and says it will give it $100m to “address the drivers of systemic racism”.

Importing the language of equity without university-style blow-ups can be difficult. “What you’re seeing is Gen Z or young millennials basically engaging in this collective war against the boomers and the Gen Xers who actually run the organisations,” says Antonio García Martínez, whom Apple fired in May after 2,000 employees circulated a petition questioning his hiring, citing passages they found to be misogynistic in an autobiography published five years ago. When Brian Armstrong, the boss of Coinbase, announced that workplace activism was to be discouraged, he was inundated with private messages of admiration from CEOs who felt that they could not do the same—and public criticism.

“Corporate wokeism I believe is the product of self-interest intermingled with the appearance of pursuing social justice,” says Vivek Ramaswamy, a former biotechnology executive and author of “Woke, Inc.”. He argues that Big Tech pursues corporate wokeism because appearing to embrace social justice suits such firms’ commercial interests—both in terms of recruitment and appeal to their customers. It performs allegiance to identity politics while simultaneously rejecting the left’s critique of capitalism. “A lot of Big Tech has agreed to bend to the progressive left,” he says, but “they effectively expect that the new left look the other way when it comes to leaving their monopoly power.”

Such hypocrisy is increasingly prevalent. The founder of Salesforce, a tech behemoth based in San Francisco, is known for championing social-justice causes like a surtax to fund homelessness services in the city. Yet the firm itself paid no federal taxes on $2.6bn in profits in 2020.

Wokeness’s next frontier, with the greatest potential to make a mark on the future, will be the classroom. In Cali fornia’s recently approved ethnic-studies curriculum, which may become a high-school graduation requirement, one lesson plan aims to help students “dispel the model-minority myth” (the idea that to dwell on Asian-American success is wrong). Roughly one-sixth of the state’s proposed new maths instruction framework is devoted to social justice. It approvingly quotes from studies suggesting that word problems about boys and girls knitting scarves be accompanied by a debate about gender norms. Last month the governor of Oregon signed a bill eliminating high-school graduation requirements of proficiency in reading, writing and maths until 2024—justified as necessary to promote equity for non-white students.

Woker or weaker?

Such proposals hint at the difficulties of translating some of the theories embraced by the new left into policy. Because disparities are theorised to be the result of largely implicit discrimination, systems must be dismantled. This leads to odd conclusions: that racial test-score gaps in maths can be ameliorated by dialectic; and that not testing for the ability to read is a worthy substitute for teaching it. Material conditions that the old left cared about, such as persistent segregation in poor districts and schools, get little attention.

There are some signs of a backlash. Three members of San Francisco’s board of education, including its president, are under threat of a recall election. So is the city’s ultra-progressive district attorney. However, the underlying engine—the questionable ideas of some academics, and the generational change they are rendering—is not shutting off. America has not yet reached peak woke. ■



Last edited by Cuepee; 12-16-2021 at 03:08 PM.
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12-16-2021 , 03:08 PM
Some of us just think vegetables are disgusting and exercise is boring. I'm embarrassed to say that I have a heavily Trumpian diet, but I don't think that's something I can readily change at 35. Even if I really wanted to. I won't even eat lettuce. Onions are my most hated food in the world and I physically wretch every time I smell one. ****, vegetables are gross ...

I feel like I'm willing to accept a shorter life if that life is filled with the foods and activities I enjoy, assuming the alternative is a better chance at a somewhat longer life filled with gross foods I hate and engaging in trite activities in the name of health. I GUESS I'll probably feel differently as I get older and unhealthier, but hey, it's hard to predict how one will feel about anything decades from now, or, you know, maybe I'll get killed in a car accident and it will be entirely moot.
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12-16-2021 , 03:12 PM
Cuepee, what you and The Economist would consider "far-left" or "ultra-left" is an entirely different group than the one obsessed with "wokeness" and culture war issues. People from the latter group are way more likely to belong to the Democrat primary voter, Rachael Maddow-type center-left. The "far-left", to whatever degree that exists in America, is way more interested in dismantling capitalism, ending American imperialism and obtaining money to distribute to the working class than this culture war stuff. Marxists, in fact, view the cultural stuff like wokeness as a malignant distraction from the material concerns that really form and change societies in a macro sense.

Last edited by DifferentName; 12-16-2021 at 03:21 PM.
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12-16-2021 , 03:17 PM
Yes but I think you are not the type who then thinks 'I don't want to feel shamed or bad about my diet choices, I don't want to get depressed that my choices have certain consequences and as a result we should try to norm this so that it seems more acceptable and is not addressed as something we should strive to correct'.

The elements of the far left look at your situation and see how trying to pressure you to better outcomes (educate you to eat better foods and why) will result in a percent of people failing to do so. That will, in fact compound the issues for some who fail and have the poor outcomes but also suffer depression over it due to the societal pressures and expectations.

So there answer is to try and remove those societal expectations and replace them with affirmations 'you are good no matter how poorly you eat', which may in fact make you feel better about your poor diet, but leads more people to a poorer diet thus making the overall problem worse and not better. They then say to just cut/paste the former affirmation to the growing audience.

Never do they recognize they are the biggest contributor to the problem and instead they just see they are making more people able to live a bit more happily in the worsening state.

Again the fit dog is more happy and fulfilled than the obese one even if you gave the obese one a thousand affirmations a day.
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12-16-2021 , 05:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DifferentName
The "far-left", to whatever degree that exists in America, is way more interested in dismantling capitalism, ending American imperialism and obtaining money to distribute to the working class than this culture war stuff. Marxists, in fact, view the cultural stuff like wokeness as a malignant distraction from the material concerns that really form and change societies in a macro sense.
But it makes no sense to blame rising obesity on either of these groups when ultra white ultra conservative states have some of the highest obesity rates in the nation and minorities have higher obesity rates the less woke/left their states are. It’s quite amazing the woke left is able to make people fat exactly in the areas they have the least power.
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12-16-2021 , 05:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DifferentName
Some of us just think vegetables are disgusting and exercise is boring. I'm embarrassed to say that I have a heavily Trumpian diet, but I don't think that's something I can readily change at 35. Even if I really wanted to. I won't even eat lettuce. Onions are my most hated food in the world and I physically wretch every time I smell one. ****, vegetables are gross ...

I feel like I'm willing to accept a shorter life if that life is filled with the foods and activities I enjoy, assuming the alternative is a better chance at a somewhat longer life filled with gross foods I hate and engaging in trite activities in the name of health. I GUESS I'll probably feel differently as I get older and unhealthier, but hey, it's hard to predict how one will feel about anything decades from now, or, you know, maybe I'll get killed in a car accident and it will be entirely moot.
Similar outlook although I like veggies and onions and seriously doubt trump enjoys a stonking vindaloo, good beer e or anything of quality.

We consider the rest of life life ev so sure as we get older the equation changes. It's not that tricky to take into account - the joys of being old aren't exactly a mystery. There's a different moral way to look at it where we have some sort of duty of care to the older person we will become but that's probably a many beers conversation (weakest point in my defense of choosing to be fat if cuepee wants to try)
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12-16-2021 , 05:46 PM
This study https://www.nature.com/articles/s41599-018-0201-x shows a pretty strong inverse correlation between obesity and poverty since 1990. The authors speculate that the introduction of high fructose corn syrup may have played a role in the obesity increase.

The far left position may be responsible for the pet obesity. But for humans, if it were the main cause I would expect the more conservative areas to show lower rates of obesity. But liberal states tend to show the lowest rates. If we say that income is the reason, some stuff makes sense. Liberal states tend to be wealthier. Black people tend to have lower incomes. This seems to fit quite well. It does not explain why things have changed since 1990 though. But then again I don't really remember the fat acceptance even being a thing until say 2010?
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12-16-2021 , 06:02 PM
It's maybe worth considering that getting old is an even less attractive proposition for poorer people. A decent life when you need care, taxis, wheelchairs etc etc is very very expensive.

Maybe one way to help tackle obesity is to make beign old a far more attractive proposition. Then we could maybe enthuse more people about it.

Maybe instead of telling people they need to get old we should tackle stuff like this
Quote:
Number of US workers aged 75 and up expected to increase 96.5% over next decade as some say ‘we must work until we die’
https://www.theguardian.com/money/20...ocial-security

as well as the far more serious problem of 'care'.
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12-16-2021 , 09:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Metod Tinuviel
This study https://www.nature.com/articles/s41599-018-0201-x shows a pretty strong inverse correlation between obesity and poverty since 1990. The authors speculate that the introduction of high fructose corn syrup may have played a role in the obesity increase.

The far left position may be responsible for the pet obesity. But for humans, if it were the main cause I would expect the more conservative areas to show lower rates of obesity. But liberal states tend to show the lowest rates. If we say that income is the reason, some stuff makes sense. Liberal states tend to be wealthier. Black people tend to have lower incomes. This seems to fit quite well. It does not explain why things have changed since 1990 though. But then again I don't really remember the fat acceptance even being a thing until say 2010?

Poor people in 3rd world countries are all skinny.

So that theory has merit.

Last edited by Tien; 12-16-2021 at 09:25 PM.
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12-16-2021 , 09:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inso0
Given that pets are freeloaders who rely entirely on others to feed and shelter them while providing no value of their own, this is almost certainly true.
Pets are true democrats , living on handout.
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12-16-2021 , 10:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tien
Poor people in 3rd world countries are all skinny.

So that theory has merit.
They are a different order of poor. They are also more likely to have far more physically active lifestyles through no choice.
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02-01-2022 , 12:21 PM
Should not have swiped right on my cell phone this morning and seen this article as it is just irresponsible and madness.

I am a liberal but this encompasses almost every flaw of far left liberalism. The idea that feelings should subvert facts and actions, to try and make 'some' feel better while ignoring this is the main contributor to the growing problem that makes so many more then feel 'worse' and have terrible outcome.


People should speak out against this. Doctors should state loudly they will not do this. But we know they increasingly already are, leading to more obesity and then more silence and then more dressing up obesity as healthy and so on and so on to an inevitable result such as we see with Covid where we have an increasingly 'maintained' but fragile population (comorbidities) that is far more susceptible to a litany of health scare issues and in need of increasingly more drastic measures to protect them from their own choices.

Dressing this up as 'more love' is dangerous. It is 'more misinformation in pursuit of feelings'.


Quote:
These ‘Don’t Weigh Me’ Cards Are Game-Changing for Doctors Appointments

January 28, 2022



For many people, regardless of size, stepping on the scale at the doctor’s office can be a triggering, harmful experience. “Please don’t weigh me” cards may offer a solution.

The cards, which are gaining a ton of attention online, were created by More-love.org, ...



...They’re a subtle way to send a strong message to medical staff: “Please don’t weigh me unless it’s (really) medically necessary. If you really need my weight, please tell me why so that I can give you my informed consent,” the cards read. ...
And of course that link lead to this one.

So, so much very wrong and dangerous in this article and approach.

Quote:

Here’s How the ‘Health at Every Size’ Movement Made Me a Better Trainer
It's totally changed my relationship with fitness.


January 9, 2020


.... Health at Every Size (HAES) is a set of principles that was established in 2003 by the Association of Size Diversity and Health. It’s mission was simple: to reject the idea that weight, size, or BMI should be considered proxies for health. ...

1. Anyone who trains is an athlete, regardless of their body size....

3. The role of fitness is not to “burn off” the food you eat....



I fear society just does not have the will to address. Many people who disagree with all this will choose to remain silent rather than be attacked as a Fat Shamer. A tactic too often employed to try and silence debate and discussion than engage in it.
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02-01-2022 , 01:00 PM
Doctors should totally agree.

Then weigh the fat ****s cos it really is.
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