We haven't even established a link between pro obesity messaging and obesity.

He completely head shot you with that comment. Take the L.

Do we know these obviously corporate marketing messages explicitly designed to promote a product and make $ are coming from the left?

Has to be one of the dumbest things I will read for a while.

Guys, there are a lot of fat people in the US. Fat people buy underwear. It's not complicated to figure out why underwear ads have fat people in them.

i love how you just hand wave the seriousness of the attack she received.

I know, I know, who cares if you are smeared as every form of bigoted of '...ist' on the internet, right? None of that matters, it is just the internet and you do not suffer any reputational damage in your community or your job, etc. It is just all a joke for you and your family.


This is what the left does. They excuse, minimize and laugh away the idea that there is anything wrong with the type of horrible attack this woman got for saying an absolutely rightful statement. 'Har de har har, oh so she had some words said to her on the internet'.

Just like that guy who reposted a silly joke that was not even a real insult to anyone but he got suspended at his job, due to cancel culture. 'Oh who cares, maybe next time he will think before telling a harmless joke. Who cares.'

This body positivity is an offshoot of the same garbage that is recycled over and over on the left. with examples such as 'Everyone gets a Trophy', in schools.

It is the far left pushing ideas they always think are 'nice' and thus should be done while they are completely naive as to the harm these things actually cause. The 'Road to Hell...'

It is why I constantly say we need adults in the room to stand up to the left and make the adult decisions, they will not.

CK isn’t a far-left org, it’s a multinational underwear company. Marketing to plus-size women is apparently profitable for them. It’s not some sinister left-wing plot to make America fat, it’s capitalism 101.

i handwave it because you cant keep on topic. you keep saying these people were "canceled" but they are MORE popular and influential than they were prior to being "canceled" in that lady's case that may have been the best thing that ever happened to her career wise.. iirc she was a nobody fitness tuber and then she ended up on a couple republican talk shows to push her products/wears(apologies if im misconstruing her with a similar story)

maybe we need to go back to what you think "canceled" means? do you think it just means someone on the internet was mean?

@Rococo, this is exactly the type of shade I am speaking of.

It is not CK that is on social media shaming and getting fit models taken down and pushing for this type of 'Obese norming'.

We can all acknowledge CK is pandering to an audience as all corporations do but that is DELIBERATELY missing the point. People like Trolly are not just willingly but DELIBERATELY trying to throw shade as to why this is being pushed.

There is a huge game being played here and by the rest of the cowed moderate middle (broader you) who like to hand wave and point 'over there' with a whatabout on every single issue like this. Any attempt to direct the discussion away from what the far lefts initiating role in all of this is and how they not only push it but cow everyone in to towing the party line on how it is addressed.

And it has worked. I can script (or ghost write) Trolly and the replies we will get on this forum, it is that template.

Because that is not what Cancel Culture means. That is the game people play here.

The argument that people can survive the Cancel Culture tactics and some go on to be even more popular ...ergo Cancel Culture is not a thing, is just a dishonest argument and deliberately so. Again it is a way to throw shade for the far left using that tactic.

That mother of 3 paid a significant social cost. She was forced to do an apology tour, 'correct her thinking', pull down all her public facing media and had all sorts of terrible allegations hanging over her in both her personal community and work community, that most people who know her would be unable to discern fact from lies and smears.

You guys reply 'har har har, as if any of that really matters' but it DOES.

The Cancel Culture tactic gets not just a person like her to change, when they did nothing wrong, to not go thru the bullying again, but it also sends a huge chill onto others. Everyone is now aware of the line 'not to cross' if they do not want to face the Bully mob.

Not because the bully mob is right or righteous, as they are not. They are just bully's who understand power and how to make it untenable for people to do things, or express opinions of views they do not like.

The bully mob is only getting emboldened as they see compliance and acquiescence by the moderates and worse, cover provided for their worst actions.

It is the center of society who needs to say 'enough, there was nothing wrong with that joke and it is ridiculous for employers to react to it by punishing the person', because if all the employer hears is outrage against it, they will react to that. And that is what the bully mob on the left counts on. A cowed moderate middle who shuts up, out of fear.

Those claiming there is no pressure on the use of very thin models are being highly disingenuous. Anorexia is a very serious problem that is being faught back against. Very correctly imo even if the usualy fringe make a lot of silly noise. There is also the general but also serious problem of sexism.

You might argue against there not also being health pressure on being obese. I'm not sure there isn't a lot of pressue on us fatties as well but it is a problem that is largely separated from the pressure on the promotion of dangerously thin or unrealistic images of women.

At least on youtube there is already a lot of pushback against fat acceptance activists. I think most people who have come across them view them as crazy and are increasingly willing to say so.

I don't think anyone is saying that. I think we all know society generally and certainly the left, made it known loud and clear, that depiction of rail thin models, even ones that were just naturally super thin but healthy, COULD create form a kind of 'norm' of expectations, that would negatively impact young girls growing up.

Society voiced that loudly and the fashion industry pretty much acquiesced with maybe a rare few exceptions who might play with those images in what I believe was a belief that even the negative press it would draw, would be press nonetheless.

There was no cowardice in society to make that known.

Agreed on all fronts. Society from Right to Centre to Left all pretty much gave voice to this being a bad.


I would argue that the left and centre have been largely cowed into silence on this issue by the Far Left to a point where the worst abuses (enter Tess Holiday picture) can be celebrated as 'brave' online and that is ok, and while the right will still comment and a small percent of the middle most in the middle accept being cowed into silence.

And that is not just sad, but very dangerous for society overall.

Sure but if the Far Left wins there will be zero outside pressure, obese positivity Imagery will abound, and Dr's and others will be cowed into staying silent and not discussing weight when they are addressing a persons health. And images of overly fit people will not be welcome in the public square.


Not one thing i say there is an exaggeration. If the Far left gets its way (and they are surprisingly fast) and people do not develop a spine to push back and say enough. All 4 of the bolded have already suffered massive shifts towards the Far Lefts control and that cannot be denied.

I am not saying 100% that this won't happen, but I think the pendulum is swinging the other way. Tess Holiday is a delusional manipulative grifter. Her claiming to have anorexia really jumped the shark. That opened the door for a lot of people to vocally push back against her without fear. Drs are not going to be cowed because they have credentials and institutional power on their side. Images of fit people are always going to be in the public square because fit people are attractive and that sells. There will be random incidents trying to cancel people who say obesity is bad but it will be less and less successful.

Tess may be a grifter but there is a movement within the far left to suggest extreme obesity is more tied to anorexia than to a lack of discipline in diet choices. In fact, as I understand from prior readings the definition of Anorexia was changed recently to remove anything about being underweight, to accommodate obese people now under that umbrella.

Why is that? Because a lack of discipline is seen as a negative where it is hard to gain sympathy whereas if you are sick with an ailment like anorexia, it is not really your fault. You can pretend you actually eat healthy, do exercise and practice disciplines but still, 'this damn anorexia keeps me obese'.

it is, in large part why I think Psychology is far more of a social science than a medical science because they will follow the trends of the times and just change things to fit todays fad beliefs.


Sorry but this is already being reported to happen. Dr's increasingly report they are being told that to raise obesity is to fat shame the individual and instead they just focus on the treatment of the diabetes or other comorbidities that often are a tied outcome from the obesity.

There is a growing body of people who accept they will be obese and don't want to hear it and as such they just want to know what to take (which medicines) to deal with the issues.


Sure, I doubt they can kill but they are trying and they are succeeding.

Look above at the Beach Body campaign. It would be one thing if they just campaigned for a more diverse billboard to put up to appeal to a broader audience while leaving the 'fit' girl up too. That would be fine and fair.

But that is not what far left activists do. They demand the 'fit' girl come down and the obese women go up. No balance. Just a swing from a moderate picture to an extreme on the obese side.

So ya the obese norming activists will continue to push and try to shame and bully any and all who do not fall in line and will continue to work. Why? Because the centre and left, who are not in the extremes are cowed to speak up, as the only groups who really could, to end such nonsense.

This forum is the perfect example of how cowed people are in the centre.

I doubt it.

With successes, we only see the demands of the far left emboldened and what is considered acceptable is raised ever higher. See the Cancel culture thread where the bar has been raised to not only can you not be trying to deny LGBTQ+ people their rights (a good thing) and if you don't agree keep quiet (again a good thing), to now what is being pushed which is 'we demand to know your thoughts and if you do not support LGBTQ+ causes in the ways we think you should, we need to know that so we can demonize you.

You would think that is a bridge too far but the middle moderate centre here instantly jumps to defend that stance as they try everything to rationalize the Far left positions to not get on their radar for bullying. It is pathetic and sad at the same time but it is where society is at.

This is one battle we have to hope the far right does not abandon for the good of society as a whole.

It will be interesting to see what happens in 5 years. I think more are speaking up, which creates a positive feedback loop where people who previously didn't speak up start doing soon because there is safety in numbers. But it could just be the circles I run in / the youtubes I watch.

https://www.youtube.com/c/MoreThanMu...cDaniel/videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCxu...bq_4tIRYemL2Ug
https://www.youtube.com/user/ObesetoBeast

Workout hard for a fair number of years. Diet yourself down to ridiculous fat levels (stupid for men, outright hazardous for women), go on a dry-out to lose that water so there isn't even a hint of bloat, use makeup to define your muscles even more, use studio lights, camera angles, shadows and trained poses for some extra fakery, then post-process the entire thing in photoshop to remove all blemishes for that super-fit look or retain 1-2 blemishes so you look all-natural.

It is all very, very dumb.

i think this forum is perfectly illustrative.

We have a very active base of people who will all jump in and address wrongs when they come from the right side and any right poster who dares to poke their head in. You will see posters silent for days and weeks on end suddenly comment on the 'wrong' said by the right leaning person.

On these issues of wrongs that come from the far left, and the worst cases of bullying and abuse you see the same people absolutely cowed into silence. If you see any replies it is a handful of posters who go into damage control, spin and cover for the worst far left abuses, while ridiculing those who they have gone after and hand waving any harm.

And while e_d and some other will try to deny it, it is near 100% predictable that you will get zero comment amongst the more moderates on the abuses of the far left. They are complicit in their acquiescence.

I agree with most of this. I think that generally happens in any echo chamber. You can't criticize "your side", even if you don't believe it because you will be ejected from that tribe. Growing up in a southern state, it was the same thing with Iraq. God forbid you said turning the middle east into a parking lot was not in fact a good thing and was instead a war crime. You might as well have said you supported Bin Laden. Tribes.

I suspect the "fat acceptance" thing won't hit critical mass. It is just too far out there and is getting too much pushback. It is 100% divorced from reality. And it specifically about how obesity isn't a health problem, yet there are zero guys in the movement.

Ya i often cite it as mostly a online forum thing but you are right about how it happens in public. Were I was younger in Ontario Canada I was seen as generally 'right' in my views and when I moved to Edmonton they called me 'granola' which means i was considered of the left (Fruits, Nuts and Flakes) as I am will never shield my views to just get along. Although in public i would never get in to arguments over politics, so that is just a forum thing (lucky everyone here).

But that is why I find those being cowed in this forum and the BFI so off putting. It is so painfully clear and easily predictable. I could post a series of 'offensive right leaning posts' and predict very specifically the type of reply it would receive here, and post a series of offensive extreme left stuff and predict the silence and shade it would get and from whom'.

I could take the exact same posts to that old BFI thread and make the exact same predictions. it is that template.

I had you pictured as a young John Lydon.

No one is advocating this. Although it is a better option than sugary fatness, resulting in diabetes and a host of other health issues.

Not a better option.

Just a different bad option.

Your understanding of this lacks nuance and is wrong in some places. There is a concept now called "atypical anorexia nervosa" which has all the same features of regular anorexia nervosa (eg restrictive eating leading to weight loss, distorted body image, and fear of weight gain) but the person basically started out overweight and so the weight loss has left them still overweight or now just normal weight. This has been defined and investigated because there were people showing up with this constellation of symptoms and weight, and they were found to have similar medical complications and psychological issues as the underweight patients with anorexia.

Atypical anorexia was not created for the purpose of including obese people in the diagnosis. It was not created because of some link between obesity and anorexia. It does not claim that anorexia is the cause of the obesity. It also does not replace the existing diagnosis of anorexia nervosa.

Our entire culture advocates this. Its ideal beauty are people who dedicate their entire life to looking the right way, but who still use plastic surgery, studio trickery and post-processing because how they actually look isn't good enough for that ideal.

There are people who literally starve themselves to death because the only thing they see in the mirror is flaws, or slowly eat themselves to death because their psyche is battered down by abuse.

Meanwhile, you have a billion dollar health and fitness industry that peddles solutions that hardly help anyone, yet their ideas completely dominate education, media and political discourse.

Yes, a bunch of food is garbage. A lot of people do not have healthy diets, and a sedentary lifestyle is too common. The solution is never going to be a field of commentators hurling abuse at people who want to feel comfortable in their own bodies, or looking for the most ridiculous outliers on social media so you can paint "body positivity" as a crime against humanity.

I understand all of that. I ALSO understand that the "concept NOW called atypical anorexia nervosa" required a redefining the of the word anorexia which USED to include being '85% below your expected weight'.

In other words anorexia was for the dangerously thin.

So why was a decision made to redefine an existing word instead of just creating or using another one? Why now 'atypical obesity nervosa'? which could just as easily be defined to encompass everything you say there with the distinction that there are both obese and anorexic people?

Do you acknowledge that when a person and wider society see a morbidly obese person say they are anorexic, it might cause challenges to both to understand what is meant?

Do you not think that confusion is deliberately done as more of a social science political thing?