Exhibit A :

Jan 6. A bad riot....but look at the blacks !!!!!!

If there was a clear link between any violence in the Floyd protests and democratic politicians, it would not be controversial to investigate. It’s only controversial with Kan 6 because Republicans know they’ve been courting these conspiracy loons,, neo confederates, militia losers etc and they can’t really denounce them without hurting their chances in Republican primaries.

That’s just not happening though. Republicans aren’t doing any better with black voters than they did 30 years ago. Trump’s share of the black vote in 2020 was equal to Bob Dole’s in 1996. Nobody has ever talked about how well Dole did with black voters. As for Latino voters, Republicans peaked in 2004 and haven’t been able to match those numbers since they shifted towards a more hardline anti immigrant stance.

This is a common misinformation tactic on the right. Just create some narrative and keep repeating lies to the point where people don’t even bother looking up easily findable data.

lol, Trump got 40% of the Latino vote while actively calling them rapists from shithole countries. The Dems have failed massively at recruiting Latinos, just a complétele neglect of basic grassroots politics. All Republicans need is a candidate who’s not quite as explicitly racist and the Dems are finished. They’re not getting Florida, Texas is gone, that’s game over.

You understand though that for your argument to be successful you must make the case why distinctions do not matter, and why the only thing that matters is 'riots = riots'.


It can be true that in any rightful governmental abuse or offense many concerned citizens may hit the streets to protest and to push for change/consequences, where it might otherwise not happen. I hope you would agree the Floyd murder by police constitutes the type of 'rightful protest'.

It can also be true that many/most such mass protests will draw many elements of anarchists, criminals and others, who may or may not have any concern for the originating issue but will use the masses as a way to run their own agenda, riots/crime. And these groups should be punished with the full extent of the law.

That part 2 happens DOES NOT make part 1 invalid or wrong.


That is very different than public officials and radical and racist groups coming together for the purposes of disrupting and ending democracy (Jan6th), or putting a race back in their place (Selma Bloody Sunday, Tulsa Race Masacre).

The difference being that the originating action in FLoyd was a 'people movement' and rightful and proper use of constitutional protests to try and enhance citizen rights, that gets coopted around the margins.

The difference being things like Jan 6th, Selma and Tulsa were gov't sponsored and/or supported actions meant to deny people their constitutional rights and put them down, that were intended to be hidden within a wider protest or action they were deliberately fomenting for cover.

You can't just hand wave away those distinctions with a 'riots are riots'... errrr, I mean you could, but then no one should take you seriously after.

Hmmmm. trying to reconcile these two posts???

Not much to reconcile. Bush got close to straight up winning the Latino vote in 04 with 44%. He did better in 2000 and 2004 with Latinos than any Republican has since. Nobody really talks about it because it’s so obvious/expected. Of course Republicans are doing worse with Latinos than when they were moderates on immigration, had a candidate who was busting out his high school Spanish on the campaign trail rather than calling Mexicans rapists etc.

Another thing that needs to be mentioned is education. Latino voters are about half as likely to have a college degree as whites and there is a significant education gap among Latino Dem and Republican voters as well. So a big part of why democrats aren’t doing even better with Latinos overlaps with why they are getting crushed with non black non college educated voters across the board.

Also Democrats are ass on immigration. They’re obv better than Republicans but they’re not ever defunding CBP or ICE. If you’re a Latino voter who cares bout immigration, you’re not really rushing out to vote for Biden.

This statement really doesn't resonate with many folks that do not have a college degree. It infers they are to stupid to vote correctly. When in fact the Latino voter tends to be catholic and more traditional value based.

Another reason Dems get crushed is they promise everything deliver on nothing to the voter and than blame the GOP for it

Bottom line is the average voter is going to se an inflation # of 10% but know its total BS as there gas has gone up 100% their groceries over 20% and so whom are they going to blame ? Joe Biden

My dude, Latinos aren’t voting for Trump because of his traditional Catholic values. The man has probably paid for multiple abortions.

Grab em by the pussy is a fairly traditional dating method though.

Huh? I’m not writing a campaign ad, I’m just going over why democrats are winning the Latino vote by the margins they have been since 2004 and why your claims about Republicans improving with nonwhite voters are just factually incorrect.

Again, not really true. The hard right swing of non college educated whites has been simmering for a while and is heavily cultural. Whites with lower opinions of blacks and immigrants vote republican. That’s far more predictive than whether they think democrats or republicans keep promises etc.

And you could make the same terrible argument you made the other way. Biden did a little better with non college whites than Dems did in 2016. Are poorly educated whites finally waking up to the fact they they’ve been conned by republicans and their culture war nonsense while rural healthcare and services have gone to ****? Of course not, only a moron would invent some narrative on a demo going from 12% to 18% over a single election while the demo remains a backbone of the republican base.

Hey maybe one day Americans will wake up and realize both parties are screwing them over and demand a third party.

I can only Imagine a Mothew Mc Conaghy type leading a third party

There is nothing to wake up about. Most voters aren’t children. They have a good enough understanding of what political parties are and why a third party won’t magically be any different and why it very well could be worse. The modern republican party is for all intents and purposes a third party that only matches demographically with the early 2000s version of the party with the same name.

and as the modern GOP has shifted ever right, so too has the Dem party.

You would have had an easier time getting many populist issues (Voting rights, Abortion rights, Legal and Court Reforms, MInimum Wage, Infrastructure, etc) , thru a GOP vote with Bipartisan support up and down the ticket then you would today with the Dem's having complete control.

There simply is no party on the left that even tries to truly be a party of and for the people. POC have complained about that for over a decade and Progressives are learning that now. Shut up and vote in line. We offer you promises but expect little to nothing after the fact. Lesser of two evils and all.

weren't hispanics more in favor of republican policies than democrats and have seen the results for 6+ years now? I remember Maher talking about the statistics and trend while making a few jokes that may rub some the wrong way saying a lot of them are "throwing the ladder off" once they make it

this seems like an accurate take. not sure what people are disagreeing with regarding this statement, I said it a few pages ago too. I hope dems arent just banking on trials to get them re-elected, theyll need more if the economical trend stays the same or gets worse

Dem's are hoping beyond all else Trump runs in 2024 and they can run on the 'lesser of two evils' again. For 2022 MT's they are all in on the Jan6 Commission leading to enough outrage from moderates and centrists to vote against the GOp, but mainly they plan to run on Abortion, Voting Rights, Minimum wage, etc. You've already seen some Dems on the news shows testing the talking point which is 'we did not have enough Dem's the last time and you need to give us a few more seats so we can actually enact our agenda'.

So 'Elect more Dems so we can do what the Dems failed to do last time', which I think needs some work but will be their yard sign.

You also see the Dems applying pressure on Garland for a prosecution of Trump. I am hoping Garland does it. It is certainly deserved. The ideal time to indict him would be somewhere around March 2023 so Trump is in Court every day during the Primaries and 2024 GE.

Most voters are literally children.

Biden won the popular vote by a margin of 7,000,000 votes. That wasn't because of some massive amount of love for sleepy Joe. That was a huge turnout to avoid more of embarrassingly unstable Trump. Many of my college educated white friends who vote GOP and voted for Trump the first time, when it came to the second time either voted Biden or left the top of their ballot empty.

If it is a pure rematch, how much of that of 7,000,000 fear of more Trump will outweigh high gas prices, high food prices and overall high inflation? I think Biden has enough votes to win the popular vote again. In a pure rematch, I think Biden wins the popular vote by a couple million votes margin. In a nod to Al Gore and Hillary Clinton let's say Biden wins the popular vote by somewhere between 500,000 to 3,000,00 votes. But Al and Hildawg know very well that the popular vote isn't enough. And some newly elected/appointed state officials are scarily shady.

While I think the Dem's definitely bleed that center, suburbs, mostly woman vote that turned so strongly against Trump and turned out, I think the more potentially damaging is that I do not expect the high turnout amongst POC, Latino's, and women generally next time, all of whom rightly feel betrayed by the Dems and are seeing they will only ever be election props as long as the Corporate Dem's maintain control.

The Corporate Dem's really truly only have one mandate and that is to do as little real change as possible and maintain the status quo dynamic between the Elite and Corporations versus average citizens.

The dynamic at play is that the GOP always moves the line dramatically to the right, and then the Dem's get power and they hold that line, never using their power to shift it back. Then the GOp gets power and moves it again, hard right. And the Dem's get power and hold the line.

That is the BEST a Dem voter can really hope for currently and even when the Dems have readily useable and easy power to move things back to the left they refuse.

Yes but he really only won the election by 70,000 votes over a few key states. He just needs to capture those states.