You should not get banned for this. I've also never heard anything like that. Many people play multiple sites at a time.

while I disagree with DDP's confrontational methods, his conclusion is correct.

WRT bots, a lot of ppl are suffering from omnipotency bias -- belief that something you don't fully understand yet (bot strat) is all knowing and all powerful. To say that because solvers exist, bots must be using them, is assumptive. And there are a lot of claims being made about bots that are at best unsubstantiated and at worst pure hyperbole.

how could you know this?

ACR bot raise river vs fish

ACR bot raise river vs reg


I'll filter for fish as an example of a non-adjusting player since there are biases in terms of average sizing/line

Fish raise river vs fish

Fish raise river vs reg


Probably the same bots as ACR if they use large flop sizes and donk a good amount.

Since average sample is smaller on Ignition it takes more intuition than raw stats to determine player types, and it's possible the Ignition bots haven't implemented it.

I dont believe it

That's interesting.
I gather that your point with the first two images is that the bots bluff raise river 5% less (3% to 8%) against fish than regs? I'm not familiar with these MDA graphics though and idk what '3% weak' means. Is the numerator RAISE RIVER+SHOW BLUFF and the denominator is ALL POSSIBLE RIVER RAISE OPPORTUNITIES? Is the raise river stat all river raise opportunities including IP/OOP and SRP/3bp/4bp? Also what is the sample size on these stats?
Thx

Sample size (opportunities) is next to the stat % so >500 raises

Just SRP either R or XR

"weak" is just showed down low pair or worse which isn't accurate for river raises, but it's obviously way stronger from W%SD

There's discrepancies in other nodes that I probably won't post

Just to clarify I’m speaking strictly PLO. I haven’t grinded NLH in a year or so

I’m in a discord with about 50 PLO pros. A few members contacted the bot owners and they are pretty upfront about everything

Gotcha, and how would the bot know who is a fish on ignition? Just based on the small sample of in-session stats (using drivehud or similar program)?

That would be my guess. Maybe also broken stack size? But pf you can generally see in as little as 5 hands.

Does Bovada have affiliate rakeback like Ignition?

yes

DooDoo, I don't get the point of posting that sample here while posting a thread in NVG stating "results are determined by luck".

This is my Bodog sample this year, by which I mean I played 2/3 of Jan then withdrew my roll after playing 5x the amount of 3 way 3b pots as any other site, and facing the same donk size over and over in SRPs.

I don't doubt you can grind hard and find a way to beat these bots and colluders, but that seems very shortsighted to me. You're developing strategies will not work outside this weird ecosystem (at this exact point in time), and hoping they don't advance to a sophistication level you cannot beat.

I don't know if Bena and the twitter crew can find enough support to pressure the site into changing (looking more and more unlikely at this point), but that seems like the most likely way to have Iggy be a viable playing option this time next year.

1. If you are going to post a graph please post your EV as well, that is pretty common knowledge.

2. The NVG thread was to give people an idea of how underestimated variance is in poker.

3. Poker is all about developing strategies, do you think online strategies will be optimal in a live 1/2, 2/5 game? No, not even a little bit. Being a poker player is about adapting to your environment. Bots are very easy to beat if you know their strategies. I'm not splitting my time between advocating for fair games/activism when I could be making money. There is no wrong/right way to think about this subject but it seems you think that if I don't agree with you then I'm short sighted.

We have different mindsets when it comes to this, which is fine. But your take on the subject isn't more valid just because more people agree with you.

I don't think my take is more valid because more people agree with me, never wanted to give that impression. You are clearly a good thinking reg based on your thread and hh discussions, so was curious what thought process lead to you disagreeing with the consensus in this thread.

1. EV bb/100 is 11.

2. For sure. The sample you posted is a data point. As is my sample. You could conclude that the games are beatable because of them. My point is neither data point means as much as the many regs winning at 5bb forever then breaking even or losing for the past year. I'm guessing you have hands where you can see your edge vs the bots; I never felt that way playing in these games. That would mean more to me than these graphs.

3. I mean ya, you don't think you're being short sighted, I do. That's not right or wrong, just our two view points but you came into a thread full of regs concerned about bots and collusion and said "you guys just aren't doing it right." I am saying your viewpoint makes little sense to me. I don't know if these bots are actually very easy to beat like you claim, I hope they are and hope you crush the living **** out of them. I wouldn't bet on this being a sustainable model but happy to be proven wrong.