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Old 10-31-2007, 04:13 PM   #251
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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Quote:
...so when is the OP supposed to find out what the evidence is against her -- or at the very least, what she's being accused of???
When the investigation is completed. IT IS THE ONLY WAY
And I agree with you -- to a point. My contention is with Turtle's statement that if FTP finds her guilty, he doesn't care if she finds out what evidence there was against her.

Also, while I do not think that a player should be informed of *all* of the evidence against him/her while the investigation is taking place, the player should at least know what the charges are against him/her. Sillysal still has absolutely no idea why she's being investigated -- and it's been almost 3 weeks now.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:19 PM   #252
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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Abosulte was a special case, and everyone knows that. Also, they outright lied while responding to accusations, which made it more incriminating. FTP has never done something to make me "doubt their honesty" and feel that they are "corruptible".

This argument at hand has always been a question of FTP's poor customer service for not keeping in touch well with the OP, and not their honesty or integrity, so to compare it to absolute is a joke.
But why do you have such trust in FTP? Have you visited their offices? Do you know the owners personally? What have they done to earn your trust?

Plenty of people trusted Absolute before the [censored] hit the fan recently. Why was trust in Absolute misguided while trust in FTP was/is warranted?
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:19 PM   #253
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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Quote:

Quote:
...so when is the OP supposed to find out what the evidence is against her -- or at the very least, what she's being accused of???
When the investigation is completed. IT IS THE ONLY WAY
And I agree with you -- to a point. My contention is with Turtle's statement that if FTP finds her guilty, he doesn't care if she finds out what evidence there was against her.

Also, while I do not think that a player should be informed of *all* of the evidence against him/her while the investigation is taking place, the player should at least know what the charges are against him/her. Sillysal still has absolutely no idea why she's being investigated -- and it's been almost 3 weeks now.
Perhaps, but maybe sillysal does know, and just isn't informing us of that. As of her last post that I saw, she seemed pretty content with where the investigation was heading and seemed to know what she needed to.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:21 PM   #254
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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Abosulte was a special case, and everyone knows that. Also, they outright lied while responding to accusations, which made it more incriminating. FTP has never done something to make me "doubt their honesty" and feel that they are "corruptible".

This argument at hand has always been a question of FTP's poor customer service for not keeping in touch well with the OP, and not their honesty or integrity, so to compare it to absolute is a joke.
But why do you have such trust in FTP? Have you visited their offices? Do you know the owners personally? What have they done to earn your trust?

Plenty of people trusted Absolute before the [censored] hit the fan recently. Why was trust in Absolute misguided while trust in FTP was/is warranted?
Because to play online poker, I need to have a certain level of trust in them. I've never visited PayPal's offices, and they dont have a phone number to call either, but I have no choice but to use them when I auction on Ebay. I'm not going to deposit my life savings and let it sit there in my account or anything, but there are lots of reasons why they are more trustworthy then smaller sites.

And you are right, aboslute can't be trusted.....now. But theres a risk you have to take to play online poker ANYWHERE.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:23 PM   #255
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

I don't feel like reading every thread. Did OP get his/her money back?
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:24 PM   #256
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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I don't feel like reading every thread. Did OP get his/her money back?
At this point, no. her last post stated that she was aware of the direction of the investigation, adn that it should be all over soon.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:25 PM   #257
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

sillysal, ooohhh sillysal. We need an update plaese. Where are you?

I don't like the way sillysal is not keeping us informed every hour. Jeez even FTP say they only take 24 hours.

sillysal's customer service is dreadful
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:28 PM   #258
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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sillysal, ooohhh sillysal. We need an update plaese. Where are you?

I don't like the way sillysal is not keeping us informed every hour. Jeez even FTP say they only take 24 hours.

sillysal's customer service is dreadful
lol


ANYWAYS i apoligize for some of the immature statements that i have made during this heated debate.

all i'm doing is trying to state my opinions and beliefs, even if they sound stupid to some of you.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:38 PM   #259
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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You englighten us with what sillysal has NOT done.


Thank you for making my point. This is exactly the ass-backwards system that's in place. Seize now, look for evidence later; you better prove yourself innocent. But really, FTP is only behaving this way because people like you are too moronic to realize how grossly incongruent this practice is with pretty much all of western civilization's banking practices. People can't "freeze" YOUR accounts because they suspect you of anything. That the very definition of YOURS. If people can choose to take things from you at their leisure, and deprive you of the money, when they want, it is THEIRS.

Of course, if you are playing for nickels (as I suspect most people who aren't alarmed by these repeated issues must be) then it doesn't matter. 50K matters.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:43 PM   #260
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it


What? Enlighten us. What has sillysal done?

[/quote]

You englighten us with what sillysal has NOT done.

Account suspensions do not just happen for no reason, and whatever it is that she did, triggered it. I'm not saying that I know she did something illegal exactly, but she did do somethign to trigger the investigation.

[/quote]

Please tell me what is then. Please fill me in on what I did. Somebody , Anybody. So I can stop pacing my house wracking my brain stessing about just what it was that I did. So I might actually get some sleep. So I can stop drinking massive amounts of alcohol to calm my nerves.

As I've said before, there will be those who believe I'm guilty of something and there will be those who believe and sympathize with me.

I know I've done nothing wrong. If Fulltilt keeps my money they will have done so fradulently and you can bet I will do everything in my power to prove that.

I am trying to stay positive and I'm hoping that FTP will resolve this shortly. I hope that if I was involved unkowingly in some kind of chip dumping scandal, or a credit card scam, that they punish the wrongdoers accordingly. If that turns out to be the case I will acknowledge FTP securtiy deparment was dilgent in finding illegal activity that damages all of us involved with online gaming.

This has been a long and exhausting 3 weeks and I hope that none of you have to ever go through this.

As a member of The Poker Players Alliance I actively support the online gaming industry. However, if this is not resolved shortly and in my favor I'll be left with no choice but to bring this to the attention of local and naitonal media.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:45 PM   #261
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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You englighten us with what sillysal has NOT done.


Thank you for making my point. This is exactly the ass-backwards system that's in place. Seize now, look for evidence later; you better prove yourself innocent. But really, FTP is only behaving this way because people like you are too moronic to realize how grossly incongruent this practice is with pretty much all of western civilization's banking practices. People can't "freeze" YOUR accounts because they suspect you of anything. That the very definition of YOURS. If people can choose to take things from you at their leisure, and deprive you of the money, when they want, it is THEIRS.

Of course, if you are playing for nickels (as I suspect most people who aren't alarmed by these repeated issues must be) then it doesn't matter. 50K matters.
No, thank you for making MY point. If you are goign to compare a banking practices to an online poker site, then you are the moron.

Online institutions such as poker sites reserve the rights to hold your money if they feel you are conducting fraudulent activities. When you opened an account there and deposited money, you signed that dotted line.

They don't have a choice but to "freeze" accounts. Are you saying that since western civilizations banking practices don't allow people to freeze your accounts, then a poker site shouldn't be allowed to freeze a suspected player's money? So that they can run and chip dump and distribute the funds in question to the rest of the online poker world?

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Old 10-31-2007, 04:48 PM   #262
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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I hope that if I was involved unkowingly in some kind of chip dumping scandal, or a credit card scam, that they punish the wrongdoers accordingly. If that turns out to be the case I will acknowledge FTP securtiy deparment was dilgent in finding illegal activity that damages all of us involved with online gaming.
sillysal, so you're saying that you approve of the way FTP has conducted this investigation?

I fully believe that you will be exonerated if you really did nothing wrong.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:52 PM   #263
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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Please tell me what is then. Please fill me in on what I did.
Im not saying that you did something spefically wrong. What i meant was, you did one of the thigns you listed, that triggered the investigation. Sorry if it came off wrong and sounded like an accusation
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:58 PM   #264
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

sillysal, so you're saying that you approve of the way FTP has conducted this investigation?

I fully believe that you will be exonerated if you really did nothing wrong.

[/quote]

what rock did you crawl out from under??????? ARE YOU INSANE!!!!OF COURSE IM NOT HAPPY WITH THE WAY THIS INVESTIGATION HAS GONE. There is NO EXCUSE for the amount of time and lack of information I was given. This whole thing has been absured and I find your post's to be absurd. Are you a FTP employee or something or do you just like to hear yourself talk.
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Old 10-31-2007, 05:01 PM   #265
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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sillysal, so you're saying that you approve of the way FTP has conducted this investigation?

I fully believe that you will be exonerated if you really did nothing wrong.
what rock did you crawl out from under??????? ARE YOU INSANE!!!!OF COURSE IM NOT HAPPY WITH THE WAY THIS INVESTIGATION HAS GONE. There is NO EXCUSE for the amount of time and lack of information I was given. This whole thing has been absured and I find your post's to be absurd. Are you a FTP employee or something or do you just like to hear yourself talk.

[/quote]

gee i wonder where i got it from.. oh wait whats this

"If that turns out to be the case I will acknowledge FTP securtiy deparment was dilgent in finding illegal activity that damages all of us involved with online gaming. "
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Old 10-31-2007, 05:04 PM   #266
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:


You englighten us with what sillysal has NOT done.


Thank you for making my point. This is exactly the ass-backwards system that's in place. Seize now, look for evidence later; you better prove yourself innocent. But really, FTP is only behaving this way because people like you are too moronic to realize how grossly incongruent this practice is with pretty much all of western civilization's banking practices. People can't "freeze" YOUR accounts because they suspect you of anything. That the very definition of YOURS. If people can choose to take things from you at their leisure, and deprive you of the money, when they want, it is THEIRS.

Of course, if you are playing for nickels (as I suspect most people who aren't alarmed by these repeated issues must be) then it doesn't matter. 50K matters.
No, thank you for making MY point. If you are goign to compare a banking practices to an online poker site, then you are the moron.

Online institutions such as poker sites reserve the rights to hold your money if they feel you are conducting fraudulent activities. When you opened an account there and deposited money, you signed that dotted line.

They don't have a choice but to "freeze" accounts. Are you saying that since western civilizations banking practices don't allow people to freeze your accounts, then a poker site shouldn't be allowed to freeze a suspected player's money? So that they can run and chip dump and distribute the funds in question to the rest of the online poker world?


Right. And you are willing to be a second class citizen, subject to the whims of FTP. I am not. If this is their business model (and numerous threads confirm that it is) count me and my money out. No other industry claims to need this god like control over my funds. Somehow, every other industry (and several other sites within this industry, I might add) has found a way to combat fraud without month long repeated "freezes" without even so much as a phone call.

And LOL and your saying that she MUST have done something wrong and then immediately retracting it after making the rhetorical point you needed at the moment. Now you readily admit she may be completely innocent.
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Old 10-31-2007, 05:08 PM   #267
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

Quote:
Quote:

I hope that if I was involved unkowingly in some kind of chip dumping scandal, or a credit card scam, that they punish the wrongdoers accordingly. If that turns out to be the case I will acknowledge FTP securtiy deparment was dilgent in finding illegal activity that damages all of us involved with online gaming.
sillysal, so you're saying that you approve of the way FTP has conducted this investigation?

I fully believe that you will be exonerated if you really did nothing wrong.
Oh. Please ignore my previous posts. I wasn't aware of the severity of whatever is interfering with your comprehension skills. Carry on. My bad.
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Old 10-31-2007, 05:09 PM   #268
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:


You englighten us with what sillysal has NOT done.


Thank you for making my point. This is exactly the ass-backwards system that's in place. Seize now, look for evidence later; you better prove yourself innocent. But really, FTP is only behaving this way because people like you are too moronic to realize how grossly incongruent this practice is with pretty much all of western civilization's banking practices. People can't "freeze" YOUR accounts because they suspect you of anything. That the very definition of YOURS. If people can choose to take things from you at their leisure, and deprive you of the money, when they want, it is THEIRS.

Of course, if you are playing for nickels (as I suspect most people who aren't alarmed by these repeated issues must be) then it doesn't matter. 50K matters.
No, thank you for making MY point. If you are goign to compare a banking practices to an online poker site, then you are the moron.

Online institutions such as poker sites reserve the rights to hold your money if they feel you are conducting fraudulent activities. When you opened an account there and deposited money, you signed that dotted line.

They don't have a choice but to "freeze" accounts. Are you saying that since western civilizations banking practices don't allow people to freeze your accounts, then a poker site shouldn't be allowed to freeze a suspected player's money? So that they can run and chip dump and distribute the funds in question to the rest of the online poker world?


Right. And you are willing to be a second class citizen, subject to the whims of FTP. I am not. If this is their business model (and numerous threads confirm that it is) count me and my money out. No other industry claims to need this god like control over my funds. Somehow, every other industry (and several other sites within this industry, I might add) has found a way to combat fraud without month long repeated "freezes" without even so much as a phone call.

And LOL and your saying that she MUST have done something wrong and then immediately retracting it after making the rhetorical point you needed at the moment. Now you readily admit she may be completely innocent.
No.

Name one other poker site that would NOT freeze a player's account while investigating them. Im sure the people at FTP will not sleep at night knowing that you "refuse to be a 2nd class citizen!", and play at their site.

Also, never did i readily admit she may be innocent, just like i never admitted she was guilty. i was only clearing up the fact that i meant to say she must have done something to trigger the investigation, and that FTP does not just investigate a player out of thin air.
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Old 10-31-2007, 05:40 PM   #269
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

Wow. You are a great advocate. FTP should hire you to represent them. "I don't know why they seized the money your Honor, but they had a good reason. I just know it. Besides, its only 47K. "
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Old 10-31-2007, 05:58 PM   #270
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

Wait, let's back up a minute. Did turtle82 really think that people who are being held for rape don't get to know what they're being held for?

I just want to know what kind of a retard we're dealing with here.
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:01 PM   #271
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

Quote:
Quote:
sillysal, so you're saying that you approve of the way FTP has conducted this investigation?

I fully believe that you will be exonerated if you really did nothing wrong.
what rock did you crawl out from under??????? ARE YOU INSANE!!!!OF COURSE IM NOT HAPPY WITH THE WAY THIS INVESTIGATION HAS GONE. There is NO EXCUSE for the amount of time and lack of information I was given. This whole thing has been absured and I find your post's to be absurd. Are you a FTP employee or something or do you just like to hear yourself talk.
gee i wonder where i got it from.. oh wait whats this

"If that turns out to be the case I will acknowledge FTP securtiy deparment was dilgent in finding illegal activity that damages all of us involved with online gaming. "

[/quote]

Where does she say she'd be happy with how the investigation has gone? Saying they were "diligent" does not mean that they should not have improved their communication and that they should not have conducted the investigation more quickly.

All sillysal is saying is that she will acknowledge the fact that there may have been a valid reason for the investigation in the first place -- but she won't be endorsing how the investigation was conducted.

Of course, FTP won't bother informing her of the results of their investigation, they'll just suddenly tell her that her funds are either being seized or are being released to her. They won't bother trying to justify to her why they felt the need to hold her $47K hostage for 3+ weeks.
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:12 PM   #272
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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Wait, let's back up a minute. Did turtle82 really think that people who are being held for rape don't get to know what they're being held for?

I just want to know what kind of a retard we're dealing with here.
wait lets back up a minute, you're an idiot.

I never said people who are arrested for rape don't know what they are being charged for, I said that they dont get to know all the details of the investigation. Guess you can't read either.

"When you were arrested for rape, did they put you in jail and update you on a regular basis while they investigated and give you all the details and facts and evidence? "
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:17 PM   #273
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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Quote:
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sillysal, so you're saying that you approve of the way FTP has conducted this investigation?

I fully believe that you will be exonerated if you really did nothing wrong.
what rock did you crawl out from under??????? ARE YOU INSANE!!!!OF COURSE IM NOT HAPPY WITH THE WAY THIS INVESTIGATION HAS GONE. There is NO EXCUSE for the amount of time and lack of information I was given. This whole thing has been absured and I find your post's to be absurd. Are you a FTP employee or something or do you just like to hear yourself talk.
gee i wonder where i got it from.. oh wait whats this

"If that turns out to be the case I will acknowledge FTP securtiy deparment was dilgent in finding illegal activity that damages all of us involved with online gaming. "
Where does she say she'd be happy with how the investigation has gone? Saying they were "diligent" does not mean that they should not have improved their communication and that they should not have conducted the investigation more quickly.

All sillysal is saying is that she will acknowledge the fact that there may have been a valid reason for the investigation in the first place -- but she won't be endorsing how the investigation was conducted.

Of course, FTP won't bother informing her of the results of their investigation, they'll just suddenly tell her that her funds are either being seized or are being released to her. They won't bother trying to justify to her why they felt the need to hold her $47K hostage for 3+ weeks.

[/quote]

diligent

adjective

characterized by care and perseverance in carrying out tasks; "a diligent detective investigates all clues"; "a diligent search of the files"

If their investigation was "characterized by care and preserverence in carrying out tasks" , how can you she not approve?

Also, sillysal stated that she would endorse them as diligent, IF everything turned out okay. I thought the ends don't justify the means?
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:22 PM   #274
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

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Wow. You are a great advocate. FTP should hire you to represent them. "I don't know why they seized the money your Honor, but they had a good reason. I just know it. Besides, its only 47K. "
lol .. thats all you could come up with? please rebuy
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:27 PM   #275
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Re: Fulltilt froze my account with 47 grand in it

Turtle, you don't really understand how FTP operates if you think it's akin to our judicial process.

FTP releases the accused no information throughout the investigation, not even the charge.

Then, after many weeks have passed, FTP's final judgment is issued. If guilty, you have no recourse for appeal. FTP's decision is final, right or wrong. Throughout the whole process, the accused is never given a chance to defend themselves, never.

So how can anyone who is innocent and knows it feel good about this process?
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