China, North Korea, and pretty much every country without a tax treaty with the U.S.

Lol

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Site not working for anybody else? It gets finished dl’ing a new update then shuts down for me.

Guess I'm delusional. Like I said, outside their jurisdiction.

I said crimes not taxes.

Have you ever heard of an extradition treaty? Almost 20% of all nations have no extradition treaty with the U.S. The U.S. and any of their branches of government or enforcement cannot touch one penny or person that is in one of those areas without their government authorizing it, not a single penny or individual. You can steal all the money in the bank, kill every single person there, and if you are able to get to one of those locales, you are safe. The chances of one of those governments authorizing the US access is virtually nil. If there is an especially egregious crime, they may arrest the individual and extradict.

There is another group of countries with no tax-treaty with the U.S. Guess what the odds are of recouping any monies or assets there if you stole them from the U.S. and/or it's citizens?

Snowden, Assange, *******ich, etc.... Three big name people the US can pinpoint and not do a single thing about taking
them into custody. You don't know what you're talking about.

So what happened on Black Friday? Was fulltilt and pokerstars domiciled in the U.S.?

Interesting how you draw this conclusion considering that the majority of sites shut down have had funds fully recovered by users. Granted, it took finagling and years of effort, but it happened.

The few sites that haven't were, in many cases, obvious frauds like Jao Poker for example.


They went after .com domain names and poorly protected banking assets. The .com's they no longer have the same access too because like ****tards, they gave away our true direct ownership of them as a country. WRT banking assets, those attempting to circumvent certain laws have learned valuable lessons from Black Friday and made necessary adjustments. See cryptocurrency.


--
Kahn

So thanks for validating my point. Because the US has no ownership of the domains of these gray market poker sites or access to their bank accounts anyone playing there is playing with no recourse if the sites were ever shutdown by DOJ. Most likely scenario is DOJ blocks their IP addresses and shortly after the site pops back up under a different name and IP... and all your funds that were in the account are gone.

Not really what I am talking about. The guy said that the DoJ could not touch ACR because they did not have jurisdiction. What jurisdiction did they have on Black Friday? These were not American companies. So you probably know more about the technology behind domains and banking, but that is a different question. Whether the U.S. government has the technological ability to shut the site down is different than making the argument that they can't do it because they don't have jurisdiction. I have heard this argument multiple times, and I am still waiting to hear the answer to the question of what was their jurisdiction on Black Friday.

Even though they were foreign companies I am pretty sure they were legally registered to conduct business within US, so they were paying US taxes for US based business. ACR, Bovada, Merge, Chico are all operating online businesses outside of US system. Global is interesting because VGW is actually registered to cinduct business in US, but not for what it is doing. It has a license for trading securities.... not really sure what that means in context of gambling. Either way the options are terrible.

If I'm not mistaken, there were U.S. bank accounts seized or assets frozen. The .com domains fell within the DOJ's jurisdiction I would imagine. The .ag, .eu, ect. don't. So the DOJ ain't touchin jack****.

They froze all attachable assets and seized the domain names due to being US domiciled. They are no longer US websites. You can search ownership and registrar address on whois.com
Now all the sites are banking in offshore havens and/or using crypto, good luck to them trying to seize that.

FullFlush, as an example, got away with it due to being in safe havens and non tax treaty locales. The government cannot get squat from them. If you sued and were awarded a judgement...it would make for great birdcage liner, completely worthless.

If a rep was to travel to a US friendly nation, it would have to be substantial and very serious for them to arrest and arrange extradition. The downside risk is huge for them. A US citizen as a rep or consultant for an enterprise deemed illegal, like online poker or gambling, would be at risk of the full force of law enforcement, potentially even a network affiliate. There just is no way our nitwits in the government have any real power vs sites like WPN, as structured.


VGW Holdings is Global, not VGW Capital...
https://www.sec.gov/cgi-bin/browse-e...ion=getcompany
They're listed as a tech company and global is a legal sweepstakes company, really just to circumvent the laws here.

i dont think ACR is even relevant enough for the DOJ to go after tbh guys

its a tiny poker site - thats like cops checking every dark alley for druggies (they wont bother)

unless something big happens (like a major media story on ACR) then the DOJ wont care

they went after pokerstars because more money was exchanged/funneled on that site in one hour than all these US sites will see in a year lol

Agree completely re WPN not at risk. They would really have to violate some other laws, serious ones, for it to be worth DOJ's efforts. They pay people their money and really aren't flaunting their business.

I'm not sure how he made your point - you're describing an entirely different situation, and your conclusions are based on a whole lot of speculation. Your "most likely scenario" doesn't seem very likely at all to me.

WPN is a risk as a player because of the shaky foundation its built on- but as far as a DOJ investigation? nope

sheldon adelson is the reason online poker is dead in the US- so as long as he doesnt know WPN exists and doesnt tell his friend Trump, we should be good lol (relatively speaking)

That I think you're very wrong on. Their customer service is pretty bad, crashing issues are a pain in the ass, etc...but financially speaking, they are very very strong.

your first two points arent really relevant in this day and age (they should be though) - if your the only game in town you can get away with a lot

and i also disagree with them being “very very strong” financially- i dont know how you came up with that. i think they have enough money to payout winning players- that doesnt mean they are financially very very strong

If you're concerned if whether or not the pockets with say-so are deep or not, you can look Town view Trading up. The least of concerns is whether or not they can afford a small hit or ten.

im not concerned about any of this stuff lol. im just giving my observation since returning from black friday

im not going to lie to you dewd - i was initially so shocked at how bad things were after so many years. but im content now- it works for what it is lol

? Why are you chiming in on this at all? WPN cannot and will not be shutdown by DOJ. They have no business registration within the US, and don't conduct business on US soil or even an ally of US. They market to US players in states where they have no legal online options and are completely playing at there own risk.

But troll away for the good of the community.

Source?

Online poker is dead? News to me...I'm still printing

Is there some kind of secret handshake required to join in the conversation?

While I don't think they're quite as invulnerable as you're suggesting here, I don't disagree with this general sentiment. What I was disagreeing with was your statements that "if they did you will not get a single penny back by way of US govt.", and "Most likely scenario is DOJ blocks their IP addresses and shortly after the site pops back up under a different name and IP... and all your funds that were in the account are gone." While either situation is possible, I don't think they are very likely.

Disagreeing does not equal trolling.

Poker Stars, Full Tilt, Absolute Poker, Ultimate Bet - you don't need links to the threads, do you?

Unless you're disputing "have had funds fully recovered by users.", because this is incorrect. But I believe a large majority received most or all of their funds, and I'm assuming this is what he meant, but worded very poorly.